Having been the victim of first internet and then computer problems I've only just had the chance to catch up on mail from the last week or so including reading through the, often heated, exchanges on poppies, poppy fascism and remembrance. It has had the advantage of being able to take everything in more or less at once from the, shall we say, more extreme viewpoints at the different ends via those of a more moderate and balanced disposition which has meant it's possibly been a little easier to get an overall grasp of the, er, discussion so let me throw in my two eurocents worth as remembrance day draws to a close ...
Being brought up in Britain I guess I became aware of the 11/11 from an early age, of the remembrance for the fallen and the poppy appeal. Over the years I have seen it not exactly dumb down but change in approach. When I was young[sic] remembrance day was on the 11/11 itself whatever day of the week it was. That was when the wreaths where laid at the Cenotaph and other war memorials, when the parades and services where held. Gradually the significance changed and remembrance day was moved to the nearest Sunday to the 11/11. In recent years I think I am right in saying there has been a growing resurgence for remembrance day, probably the result of the growing number of conflicts in the world, with some attention being given to the 11/11 but remembrance day itself still being on the nearest Sunday. It was when I moved to the Netherlands I became aware of a different significance, another aspect of remembrance. Remembrance day here is held on May 4th, in effect the final day of WW2 in the Netherlands, followed by Liberation day the next day, May 5th, when the Germans signed the official surrender in the Netherlands. It still has a big impact on the country, both young and old, possibly more than in the UK I would say. The Act of Remembrance and the two minutes silence are always in the evening at 20.00 and always on the 4th May. The first year I was here and on a train from Den Haag to Amsterdam when in the middle of nowhere it slowed down and stopped. I wondered what was going on till someone explained it was eight in the evening and time for the two minutes silence for remembrance for the fallen. Later I became aware how this happened in different circumstances. Not just public transport that would stop, not just the many gatherings of people at memorials but motorists who would pull up and stop their cars, even on the motorways, people on the streets, in cafes who would stop talking and stand still. The big difference though is Remembrance is not just for those in the armed forces who fell in all conflicts, up to and including ongoing ones, but for everyone including civilians. True, those who where in the resistance in WW2 who died have a special significance but the remembrance includes all the fallen. Maybe this has to do with a country that was occupied as opposed to one that wasn't (though I don't remember the same thing in Denmark) so that it impinged on the population more directly but it is all encompassing. True, at the Remembrance service on the Dam the armed forces are significantly present but so are civilians as well and at many other memorials services take place for civilians who where shot or killed, either for being members of the resistance or as reprisals or otherwise died. I agree with the sentiments expressed by some about the way it seems to have become obligatory to wear a poppy. The BBC was mentioned where everyone but everyone seems to have one on (though never checked to see if the Blue Peter dog or other other animals where one). This just becomes a ritual and loses its significance. It should be a something one wants to do and not feels one has to do. Finally to the remark "The country needs armed forces and if nobody signed up voluntarily we would have to have conscription / national service." I would say not necessarily. How about as an alternative training everyone, starting at primary school, in NVDR? Okay, that's my thoughs. I'll now see what Newsnight has to say - they have a piece coming up on the First World War poets. guy _______________________________________________ the Leeds List is an unmoderated mailing list and the list administrators accept no liability for the personal views and opinions of contributors. Leedslist mailing list [email protected] http://list.zetnet.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist Volame vsechny Cechy
