On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 5:37 PM, Edward K. Ream <edream...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The process of *considering* embedding Leo in another IDE has been one of > the most useful things I have ever done. I feel as if I have awoken from a > deep slumber. Atom, VSCode, eric6 and Pycharm/Intellij are all superb > tools. Building and using them, even briefly, has been eye opening. > > But embedding Leo in another IDE would be a big mistake. This posts > explains why. > > This is a long post. To state my conclusions first: > > - Embedding Leo in any IDE would be a huge and risky project. > - Such a project would distract us Leo devs, and burden us with endless > support. > - Embedding Leo would be less useful than it might seem. > - Leo has its own strengths. Many don't translate easily to other IDE's. > > WoW soooooo quickly conform these points ;-) just 2 week, ERK rebuild IDE world idea, Sayeahoo! > See the summary for other conclusions. > > *A huge and risky project* > > Embedding Leo in any IDE would be much harder than it might appear at > first. At *minimum*, such a task would require an *entirely new* gui > plugin for Leo. Such plugins have been the biggest projects in Leo's > history. > > This became obvious to me yesterday while reading/reformatting the eric6 > plugin guide. Eric6 is a pure python app, but the eric6 ecosystem is almost > completely different from Leo's. There is likely *no* clever way to use > Leo's existing Qt code. Everything would likely have to be rewritten. > > Embedding Leo in another IDE would create ripple effects that touch *all* > of Leo's code. These ripple effects would depend on arcane details of the > particular IDE in which Leo is embedded. > > ripple effects <~~~ very right define, appended one reason: embedding others IDE ecosystem is hold one huge upstream into Leo's ecosystem; but the upstream ecosystem is out-control by ERK, means for Leo's new feature can compatibility upstream ecosystem, will ripple huge unnecessary work. > It's impossible to know beforehand what the final design and code would > look like. This makes such projects extremely risky. Quick prototypes won't > significantly reduce the risk. Rather, they are likely to be wasted > investments. > > *Endless distractions* > > Successful projects have limited focus, no matter how many devs are > involved. Embedding Leo in another IDE would be a major, most unwise, > commitment of time and energy for all Leo devs. > > Support would be endless. For example, leoBridge.py is a small module, but > it has generated continuing and difficult issues. One of those issues > required tricky futzing with gnx's when loading .leo files. Just recently I > had to tweak that code again. > > Do we want to answer endless questions about how to build Pycharm, or > whatever? Do we want to tell people how to *use *Leo in other IDE's? > Finally, do we want to complicate Leo's distros with javascript related > matters? > > *Expensive advertising* > > My dream has been to promote Leo by offering its features in other > environments. I'm ready to say now that this has always been a bad idea :-) > > I've learned in the past week or so that it's (usually) pretty easy to > download and run other IDE's. People can and do use more than one IDE. > People know where to find Leo. Creating a Leo plugin in any other IDE > would be an expensive and ineffective form of advertising. > > *Leo's strengths* > > In one of my first posts I said that just about everything Leo *shares* > with Atom is inferior to Atom. But this statement was *just plain wrong*. > Here > are some common areas in which Leo excels: > > 1. Scripting. Most IDE's aren't scriptable at all, so technically my > remarks don't apply ;-) > > 2. Plugins. Leo's plugin architecture is much simpler than eric6, and > that's the easy case. > > 3. Searching. No other platform has Leo's clone find commands. etc. > > 4. Commands. Outline-oriented diffs exist nowhere else. etc. > > 5. Settings and configuration. eric6 has a nifty gui representation of > its settings, but Leo's settings are much more flexible: > > - Settings can apply to individual .leo files. > - Settings nodes naturally contain arbitrarily verbose comments. > - Users can organize settings trees as they like. > - Plugins can add settings just by calling c.config.getBool, etc., > *without* adding to Leo's gui code. > > 6. Window system. Terry has made Leo's window system scriptable (in > python!) and extensible. > > *Summary* > > Leo will remain a pure python app, scriptable in python. > > There is much to learn from eric6. I shall incorporate some of eric6's > features into Leo's code base. > > Leo must have a plugin that supports Joe Orr's great work. This plugin > will be worth *any* amount of work. Imo, this is the proper place to > focus our time and energy. > > I am happy with these conclusions. They feel sane, sensible and safe. As > always, they are provisional. We'll see how the subconscious reacts ;-) > Please let me know *your* reactions. > > only one suggest: this paper must insert into LeoDoc, maybe as FAQ? > Edward > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "leo-editor" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to leo-editor@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/leo-editor. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- life is pathetic, go Pythonic! 人生苦短, Python当歌! 俺: http://zoomquiet.io 授: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.5/cn/ 怒: 冗余不做,日子甭过!备份不做,十恶不赦! KM keep growing environment culture which promoting organization learning! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "leo-editor" group. 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