Linux-Advocacy Digest #453, Volume #30 Sun, 26 Nov 00 20:13:02 EST
Contents:
Re: C++ is very alive! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: KDE2 (A transfinite number of monkeys)
Re: Of course, there is a down side... ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: C++ -- Our Industry... (mlw)
Re: Mandrake 7.2 and KDE2 - Congrats ! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Linux growth rate explosion! ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Ayende Rahien")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: C++ is very alive!
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:11:15 -0500
Bob Hauck wrote:
>
> On Sun, 26 Nov 2000 16:57:28 GMT, Charlie Ebert
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> >Bob Hauck wrote:
> >>On Sat, 25 Nov 2000 23:37:43 -0500, mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >>I agree that anyone calling themselves a "software engineer" ought to
> >>score pretty high on your little quiz. However, I don't agree at all
> >>with the implication that "real engineers use C++".
>
> >I kind of got the impression he was saying the software engineer title
> >belonged to Kernel developers and the such. You'd play hell writing
> >a kernel in java I think.
>
> Kernel developers, at least Linux and BSD kernel developers, use C not
> C++. Anyway, I hope he wasn't limiting "software engineer" to kernel
> developers, since they are but a tiny minority of the people developing
> software and not everybody doing databases or web sites is a dumbass.
>
> No, I don't want to write a kernel in Java, but then I also don't want
> to write web applets in C++. This just outlines my point about using
> the right tool for the job.
Awwwwww, come-on.
Web applets should be written in microcode for a virtual cpu engine
which is written in Java. Anything less than that is just laziness :-)
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (A transfinite number of monkeys)
Subject: Re: KDE2
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 00:14:14 GMT
On Sun, 26 Nov 2000 13:06:24 -0800, matt newell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: I meant a gtk+ theme.
Actually, I just read about it today.. There will be "GNOME Themes" after
all.. Helixcode is hosting a project called "metathemes", the goal of which
is to provide a united theming interface for Gtk+, Sawfish (& other WMs if
the plugins get written), Xmms, and there are rumblings about doing it
Mozilla too. There's an alpha out that I haven't tried yet, but have
heard very positive things about.
: Claiming that writing programs in C++ because the ABI is just now becoming
: mature is counterproductive. If people only used languages that had mature
: compilers there would never be any new languages and we would still be doing
: systems programming in asm.
It's not just the ABI. C++ is a moving target. There is no stable, released
version of a C++ compiler on Linux that has a good STL implementation.
: No, Corba proved to be to big and slow for embedable components, so the came
: up with kparts. I don't know what you mean network transparency for objects?
: When would you open a document using a part that is not on your own computer.
: This seems like unusable overkill. If I need a plugin to open some kind of
: document I will install it.
Not at all, welcome to the networked workplace. Not everyone works in an
isolated environment. The Network Is the Computer (thanks for the line
Scott!).
: Will galeon support embedable components, it is nice to be able to view
: images, pdf files, text files, Office documents, and anything else with a
: plugin.
I'm not sure about that.. Galeon's motto is "the web, only the web". :-)
Not email, not news, nothing but the web. Personally speaking, I HATE it
when a browser opens up an office document. I want to DOWNLOAD the blasted
thing, not look at it in a browser window..
: > Oh, like gtk-engines? It's good to see the KDE team catching up in that
: > area!
:
: Yes, but KDE supports both KDE and gtk themes.
It needs to. :) http://kde.themes.org/ only has FOUR KDE2 themes.
--
Jason Costomiris <>< | Technologist, geek, human.
jcostom {at} jasons {dot} org | http://www.jasons.org/
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Of course, there is a down side...
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:15:47 -0500
Les Mikesell wrote:
>
> "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:EE2U5.10300$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >
> > > > None. They didn't have to if the lazy programmers either: a> Checked
> > the
> > > > dates before copying or B> Wrote their programs to the published
> Windows
> > > API
> > > > correctly.
> > >
> > > And you are positive that there has never been a case where the newer
> > > MS DLL broke another vendor's previously working program?
> >
> > Of course there are. But those programs have typically not followed the
> API
> > and relied on undocumented side effects that went away when the DLL
> changed.
>
> People who say things like that always point to documentation that exists
> now, saying that the competing vendor's programmers should have followed
> it years before it was available. Very convenient.
>
> > When an upgraded DLL does legitimately break applications, MS fixes it,
> like
> > they did when SP6 broke Notes.
>
> Could being in the courts about anti-competitive practices have
> anything to do with this new attitude about fixing the problems they
> cause for competitors?
nyeeeaaah....COULD BEEE!
>
> Les Mikesell
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:18:00 -0500
mark wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
> >mark wrote:
> >>
> >> In article <8vqtut$56ngn$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ayende Rahien wrote:
> >> >
> >> >"Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> I've seen it take out the majority of the WINDOWS directory on 95.
> >> >> I installed 98 on my sister-in-laws machine, and still had many
> >> >> problems. A UPS fixed them; she hasn't called me lately.
> >> >
> >> >UPS?
> >> >Unitteruptable Power Supply?
> >> >Or is it some other abbrevation?
> >> >
> >> >
> >> Yes, uninterruptable power supply. I've not seen it stand for
> >> anything else in computing. I believe that there is a US
> >
> >I once heard about a non-computer-literate army officer who complained
> >that his office's *unlimited* power supply only lasted for 20 minutes.
> >
> >I guess he thought it was a perpetual motion machine.
> >
>
> 20 mins must have been a major disappointment :)
ever start laughing with a mouthful of Coca-cola?
Now I have to clean my monitor screen!
>
> Mark
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: C++ -- Our Industry...
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:20:09 -0500
Wow, that was a lot to cope with.
You did touch on a few of my BIG problems with the industry:
VB, crap.
Java, crap.
Both these are proprietary environments.
Perl, TCL, and other interpreted languages have their place. Little
skill is required to create a pretty good app.
C/C++/Assembly are fairly low level, standardized languages. Very
powerful.
--
http://www.mohawksoft.com
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake 7.2 and KDE2 - Congrats !
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:21:20 -0500
mark wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >On Wed, 22 Nov 2000 13:22:51 -0500, Gary Hallock
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>Oh yeh, right! PM 6.0 did not exist at the time Windows ME and W2K came out. It
>did not
> >>exist when I had to use PM on Windows ME. And why should I have to spend more
>money to
> >>upgrade PM?. What can't Windows provide upward compatibility?
> >
> >Because Gary, Windows (Microsoft) shouldn't have to worry about
> >supporting backward compatability with every piece of software that is
> >out there. If they did, they would be stuck in a rut and in many cases
> >not able to advance.
>
> Microsoft should only have to worry about what their customers want and
> what their competition is offering. Unfortunately, since they lack
> the latter, they're not interested in the former. This means issues
> of backwards compatibility are of no interest to them.
>
> >That is exactly what happend with OS/2 which
> >tried to maintain compatability with Windows applications (Win/OS)
> >while MS marched on and OS/2 died.
>
> I thought what happened with OS/2 was more to do with a microsoft &
> IBM battle, I don't recall anything about backwards compatibility.
>
> >
> >It is also the reason why Linux is mired in old technology, like it's
> >file system.
>
> I like my data stored on a reliable, efficient, secure filesystem. Then
> there's my work data which has to be stored on Fat32, which kind of
> doesn't really meet any of that.
> >
>
> >>Your Dos VFat argument is backwards. That's called backwards compatibility. I
>don't
> >>expect to be able run a new program on an old OS. But I do expect to be able to
>run an
> >>old program on a new version of the OS.
> >
> >I prefer the latest technology and if I have to upgrade to get it
> >that's ok with me.Linux has broken many things along the way as well
> >with Lib5/LibC and so forth. It's just that you guys love flittering
> >around hoping to be the first one on /. to find the bug and fix it.
>
> Nothing was broken which couldn't be recompiled with the available
> source. Or, if you use e.g, debian, then the libc5 stuff runs
> just fine, and on my machine, even the libc4 stuff still does.
>
> I agree, I've been upgrading the machines for years. I've not been
> filling Bill's pockets whilst doing it, though.
>
> >
> >Linux will always be living in the past. It will always be behind in
> >hardware support and it will forever be trying to have even a small
> >amount of the high quality and broad range of applications that
> >Windows has. Nothing but a huge influx of money and Linux going
> >commercial, is going to change that.
>
> Linux is certainly my future, Windows is not. Linux is now edging
> windows away from the kids machines. It won't be long before
> windows has completely gone from my network, having been replaced
> by debian GNU/Linux.
Oh come on...you need SOMETHING around as a bad example of how
NOT to do things...
>
> Mark
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:25:44 -0500
Ayende Rahien wrote:
>
> "mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > In article <8vplo7$5eu5a$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ayende Rahien wrote:
> > >
> > >"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >> mark wrote:
> > >
> > >> > This is a high price to pay for Microsoft's attempts to copy the
> > >>
> > >> It' not so much the attempt, but the INABILITY to do it properly
> > >> which is the problem.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> > functionality of the Mac finder.
> > >> >
> > >> > Mark
> > >>
> > >
> > >Interestingly enough, Mac OS X seems a lot like windows.
> > >Who is copying whom?
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Mac OS X will seem a lot like windows to a windows user
> > because Microsoft have been trying to copy the Mac finder
> > for years and years. Each release of Windows gets a bit
> > closer to the Mac.
>
> No.
> I can believe this for 3.11/95
> But not for the rest of it.
Fine...bury your head in the sand...loser.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 19:29:15 -0500
mark wrote:
>
> In article <pUET5.10217$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >"Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:%OqT5.2513$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> > Press shift when you click the OK button on the shut down screen, this
> >> would
> >> > give you quick shutdown.
> >> > BTW, ctrl+alt+backspace doesn't restart X, it terminate it, and then
> >start
> >> > it, there is quite a difference here.
> >>
> >> The point is, the entire OS doesn't go down in flames as a consequence of
> >> the GUI crashing... Sure, you lose whatever it might have been you were
> >> working on, but core processes other systems on your net might be using
> >> don't have to be interrupted by the recovery. Plus, you don't have to deal
> >> with the corrupted file system and registry nonsense.
> >
> >To the average user, the GUI *IS* a core process, and usually the only thing
> >they care about on a desktop machine. Who cares if the telnet server is
> >still running if you just lost all your work in the 5 open X applications
> >you had going?
>
> This wasn't my point, at least. My point was that _if_ I get a
> problem with X (which is so rare I can't actually remember when
> one might have been, but I believe it has happened in the distant
> past), then I can kill it and it will restart momentarily under
> the management of xdm.
>
> With my win98 machine, it might take 20mins just for the machine
> to stop, then I have to do the equivalent of an fsck, whether it
> needs it or not if I got bored waiting and stopped it by hand,
> then I've got to try to get back to where I was.
>
> The whole user experience is a) awful and b) the subject a large
> amounts of Dilbert style humour in our office.
> >
> >And corrupted file systems don't usually happen with NTFS since it's
> >journaled.
>
> I thought that was moot?
>
> >And I have never experienced a corrupted registry except when
> >the hard disk developed bad spots.
>
> Can't say I've ever had a corrupted registry in Windows.
But if C: gets corrupted, then it really doesn't matter whether
or not the registry is corrupted....you're in the same shithole
as if the registry suffered internal corruption.
>
> Mark
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux growth rate explosion!
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 01:13:35 +0200
"mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <8vr8r9$5a7fd$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ayende Rahien wrote:
> >
> >> Doh. How do you get a trojan onto a unix machine?
> >
> >Same mecanism you get one into a win machine.
> >Lure the user to open it.
>
> No, the user needs to save it, give it executable permissions,
> su to root, give it root/suid permissions, put it into the path,
> add a script into /etc/init.d or /etc/rc.d to get the trojan
> started, modify the firewall scripts to open the required ports,
> etc. etc. etc.
We've been through this before.
If the user execute the program, it can handle the rest on its own.
About the root, please check some info about single user OS and why it works
the way it is in 9x
Then refer to NT/2K and show me how, short of runing as admin, the program
can do all of that.
> Note that 'open' just means 'open' in unix, it does not mean
> run.
Terminology change across OS, deal with it.
> >> >If unix was a wide spread OS, used by average computer illeterate
> >persons,
> >> >you would see the same for unix.
> >>
> >> No, for the reasons I give above.
> >
> >Yes, for the reasons I give above.
>
> No, it really isn't the same, is it. Microsoft provides the
> delivery mechanism and the root access and the lack of firewalling
> capability, along with a really obscure startup system (the
> registry) which _anything_ can modify to startup itself at
> startup.
What delivery mechanism?
Please check on signle user OS and how they handle permissions (hint, they
don't)
Define firewalling capability.
BTW, there is *nothing* obscure in the startup system.
If you don't understand the registry, you (on 9x) do Start>Run>msconfig
There tab in the end contain a list of all the programs that run at startup.
> Daemons (or whatever you call them in Win32 land) can even
> prevent themselves from appearing in the task list.
Services, and you are talking about 9x here.
> >Yes, for the reasons I give above.
>
> No for the reasons I give above. You really should learn
> something about unix. You'll probably find yourself switching
> to a decent OS when you realise just how had you've been.
I've a decent OS, it's called win2k.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 01:23:56 +0200
"mark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <8vr521$5j30n$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ayende Rahien wrote:
> >
> >A> Boot from win98 cdrom. Insert slackware cdrom, start install from dos.
>
> If you can do this, you don't bother installing another OS to fix
> an ext2 system.
>
> You certainly don't bother trying to save things onto FAT32 because
> you lose all your permissions information and your filename cases.
>
> If, as you say, you have another HD not doing anything, then you
> don't need to do any of this - you boot up as far as you already
> can, and create a new ext2 filesystem on the second HD (or by the
> method I've just mentioned), and save your goodies there.
>
> This scenario is just too contrived to ring true at all.
Because you don't know the whole thing, and I'm getting tired of explaining
it.
Face it, you don't know the whole thing, you don't know the person involved
here, you know practically nothing.
FWIW, the reason he didn't install an ext2 filesystem was because he didn't
want to.
He wasn't interested in making another ext2 filesystem, he had other factors
that decided on the FS that would go into the HD when he did it aside from
saving his files.
Can you understand this?
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 01:30:15 +0200
"Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:5eeU5.25026$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:8vqtur$56ngn$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> >
> > I said *CD*, not *CD-ROM*
> > The CD & Bios support booting from CD, the Slackware CD itself didn't.
>
> Does it provide rescue capabilities in addition to install or allow
> you to get to a shell before doing anything destructive? If so (and
> other distributions do this - I just don't use Slackware), you should
> have repeated whatever method was used to start up the install.
IIRC, the ISO from slackware provide it, but the disk wasn't an ISO, it was
a non-bootable CD, so you couldn't do anything with it.
Well, you could boot from the win98 cd-rom and then use the slackware cd
then, but that wasn't what he wanted to do.
> > And just to counter your next arguement, no, it wasn't the burned ISO,
> > (which as far as I know, can boot)
> > It was a CD that a friend burned for him, and he didn't make the CD a
> > bootable one
>
> Odd that he would give a non-bootable CD to someone without a
> floppy drive...
Why would he need one?
You put it in the cdrom, go to DOS, and install from there.
> But this whole situation is odd including
> (especially) the concept of expecting win98 to be able to do anything
> helpful. The only thing realistic about the whole story is having
> problems with a win98 install.
No, win9x usually install without a hitch.
> > There are more things in heaven and hell that are dreamt of in your
> > philosopy, Huratcio - Shakspere (badly spelled, probably)
> >
> > Try to think about it.
>
> Think about the normal ways to recover a Linux system next time
> instead of the most bizarre approach. For example, a search
> on freshmeat.net will find a bunch of boot/rescue ISO images,
> or you could grab a copy of demolinux - a fairly complete
> boot-and-run from CD distribution.
Yes, I know.
But he didn't do that this way because of other reasons that I didn't
mentioned which has nothing to do with linux.
> Or you should be able
> to put any of the floppy rescue images on a bootable CD - you
> did mention a friend with a burner, didn't you. And keep in
> mind that these are all last-ditch after-the-fact suggestions. A
> better initial approach would have been to use a distribution that
> lets the CDROM act as a rescue disk if needed.
Slackware does it, that particular CD didn't.
> By the way, did you ever try to install win95 or NT on this machine? How
> would that be possible?
What do you mean, how is that possible?
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 01:33:28 +0200
"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Said Ayende Rahien in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 26 Nov 2000 15:44:56
> [...]
> >What I don't understand is how a UPS can solve problem in the FS.
> >It's like changing a monitor to fix the sound card problems.
> But I wouldn't think there was anyone who purported to have some
> expertise with PCs, let alone with Windows in particular, who wasn't
> aware that low quality power often causes recurring problems in the file
> system, most especially FAT.
No, what I was commenting about was how did a UPS made windows directory
come back.
As that was the problem that Chris was talking about.
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