Linux-Advocacy Digest #345, Volume #32 Tue, 20 Feb 01 09:13:03 EST
Contents:
Re: .NET is plain .NUTS (Bloody Viking)
Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ] (Stephen Cornell)
Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (Bloody Viking)
Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ] ("Donal K.
Fellows")
Re: SSH1 (Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting (Shane Phelps)
Re: .NET is plain .NUTS (Charlie Ebert)
Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"! (Charlie Ebert)
Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta (Chris Ahlstrom)
Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta (Chris Ahlstrom)
Incredible developments in Italy regarding business software ("Adam Warner")
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) (Chris Ahlstrom)
Re: Linux web pads? ("Karel Jansens")
Re: Linux web pads? ("Karel Jansens")
Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited ("Donal K. Fellows")
Help with display properties ("John")
Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited ("Donal K. Fellows")
Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited ("Donal K. Fellows")
Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ] (Peter da Silva)
Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited ("Donal K. Fellows")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bloody Viking)
Subject: Re: .NET is plain .NUTS
Date: 20 Feb 2001 11:20:22 GMT
Aaron Kulkis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: No...it's better to say
: "Look boss...if I do that....do you have any employees who you don't
: trust...for any reason?...or any employees who might be pissed at you,
: or the company...or *their* supervisor.....or their supervisor's
: supervisor?....I'm sure that somewhere...out in the office, there's
: at least ONE employee who, if he had a chance to totally fuck over
: this business....would do it in a heart beat...leaving not just me
: without a job...but have YOU in court against Microsoft's legions of
: lawyers, with the end result being you declaring bankruptcy.
: Have you seen the ads for the BSA? They're a bunch of snot-nosed
: punks who basically play "Vito the Enforcer" for Gates and his
: cronies a Microsoft....now...all that....maybe quietly frustrated
: employee has to do is call the BSA, and tell them that they should
: audit OUR business.
: Frankly...we're in a bind....this is ...the NEW Microsoft. Remember
: when he said that he doesn't care if people pirated his software,
: because eventually, they would get addicted. Well...look, you just
: told me to commit a BLATANTLY illegal act...because...lets face it...
: you're now one of Billy-the-Pusher's addicts...and guess what...he's
: not giving it away for free any more."
: "now....you've got two choices. We can continue to use the
: pusher's product...and face spiraling prices. .NET will make
: sure of that...every machine can be UNIQUELY identified.....the
: activation keys, that will be kept in Redmond, not here....will
: NOT be sent to a machine unless THAT machine's signature is on
: file AND PAID UP.
: Now...the other choice is....to convert to something that is not
: only cheaper....where WE *CAN* make as many installations as we
: want without being dragged into court....but...it works better, too."
: "So, tell me...which would you prefer....living in fear that we're
: all going to get dragged into court, and lose the business....or
: INCREASE the profit margin, and migrate to something that works,
: and DOESN'T have any licensing fees...and never will"
And if the boss is stupid enough to cut you off as you say all this, he'll
probably fire you for "insubordination" or some such crap. So, that means he's
a bad job reference when looking for the new job. What you do is pick up the
phone and call the BSA "Vito the Enforcers" to financially nuke his arse onto
the street. No more bad job reference as the company is no more.
If after that debacle, you start your own business, you use Linux with
OpenOffice to prevent the same fate from befalling you. All it takes to go
postal is call the BSA when a company uses Microsoft products.
I still like my idea of "If you fire me, I'll call the BSA". Next best thing
to a suitcase nuke.
--
FOOD FOR THOUGHT: 100 calories are used up in the course of a mile run.
The USDA guidelines for dietary fibre is equal to one ounce of sawdust.
The liver makes the vast majority of the cholesterol in your bloodstream.
------------------------------
From: Stephen Cornell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.security.ssh
Subject: Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ]
Date: 20 Feb 2001 11:21:57 +0000
"Chad Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> So far, no one has refuted my claims (which were basically that SSH
> isn't secure and there are several exploitable vulnerabilities which
> exist on a large number of installed SSH hosts).
No, you're wrong. People have responded by posting information about
the vulnerabilities which have been found, which are (i) patchable
bugs and (ii) flaws in the SSH protocol 1.
In response to (i), the solution is to patch your software, just as
you have to do with Microsoft products (you do know that there are
exploitable bugs in IIS and Terminal Server that need patching, don't
you?).
In response to (ii), there are no known exploits in spite of these
flaws having been made public for a year or so and that there are
hundreds of universities worldwide that use SSH1, just waiting to be
cracked. If you actually bothered to do some reading, you would see
why this is the case (hint: it's not simply a case of writing a
script). These flaws do not apply to protocol 2; we all know that
protocol 1 is deprecated.
So, refute this: SSH _is_ secure, provided you use protocol 2, and you
only allow connections between hosts with known host keys. In that
respect, it is at least as secure as SSL - and I don't hear you making
lame jokes about `NSSSL'. Even if you use SSH1, the risk is
unmeasurably small - and free SSH2 servers and clients are widely
available.
> They continue to bash me, call me names, and other infantile
> behaviors,
I'm not surprised. Normally, you restrict yourself to saying how
wonderful MS products are. In this thread, you have continued to
espouse unsupported views about a subject of which you are almost
completely ignorant, in the face of people who know a lot more than
you. You are an idiot.
--
Stephen Cornell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel/fax +44-1223-336644
University of Cambridge, Zoology Department, Downing Street, CAMBRIDGE CB2 3EJ
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bloody Viking)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: 20 Feb 2001 11:33:02 GMT
Aaron Kulkis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: Personally, I think a Marine Expeditionary Brigade, 2 Marine
: Air Wings, and a couple of Iowa-Class battleships should use
: the Redmond, Washington campus of Microsoft as a live-fire
: training ground.
The Iowa-model battleships would be nice, just make sure to adapt nuke
artillery shells to its guns. That way, Redmond becomes MS-Parking Lot v.1.0.
--
FOOD FOR THOUGHT: 100 calories are used up in the course of a mile run.
The USDA guidelines for dietary fibre is equal to one ounce of sawdust.
The liver makes the vast majority of the cholesterol in your bloodstream.
------------------------------
From: "Donal K. Fellows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.security.ssh
Subject: Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ]
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:32:02 +0000
Chad Myers wrote:
> "Craig Kelley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> Yep, that's pretty much the definition of FUD.
> So you're admitting you're avoiding all my facts, right?
I admit that you're a clueless dipstick, Chad, with an amazing ability
to demonstrate in a public forum your lack of ability at basic reading
comprehension. Detailed rebuttals have been posted, and you have
somehow managed to completely miss the point throughout. If you wish
to be regarded by the general public as anything other than a kid that
is predestined to live out your life in the illiterati, I'd advise
spending time learning how to take a piece of text and get all the
information out of it. (My kid brother is better at it than you seem
to be...)
Donal.
--
Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- I may seem more arrogant, but I think that's just because you didn't
realize how arrogant I was before. :^)
-- Jeffrey Hobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: Shane Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.security.ssh
Subject: Re: SSH1 (Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 23:04:27 +1100
Craig Kelley wrote:
>
> Janne Sinkkonen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Peter da Silva) writes:
> >
> > > They've been spreading FUD about SSH1 for years. They had a commercial
> > > interest in getting people to upgrade to SSH2. You can join the dots
> > > yourself.
> >
> > BTW, is there any known incidents of compromized SSH1 connections, or
> > is the vulnerability of the protocol just theoretical so far?
>
> Rootshell claims that they were owned via SSH1, but they have no
> proof. Of the published attacks, you'd need to be able to sample data
> between the client and server and you'd need many attempts, which
> would display odd (noticable) behaviour.
>
THe rootshell crack was the red herring I alluded to earlier.
IIRC, rootshell was broken into via ssh, but not through any ssh vulnerability.
The cracker grabbed a password through another method, then came in through
the front door, so to speak, using ssh. Linking with TCP wrapper and setting
restrictive allow/deny rules would have significantly reduced their exposure.
> It seems doubtful, but I wouldn't say 'extremely' difficult (maybe
> 'fairly'?)
>
> --
> The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
> Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charlie Ebert)
Subject: Re: .NET is plain .NUTS
Reply-To: Charlie Ebert:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:09:50 GMT
In article <96spne$rm8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Bloody Viking wrote:
>
>Charlie Ebert ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>
>: It is THEIR feeling,,,, well let me just repeat what one of them
>: told me one morning when I questioned buying licenses.
>
>: "MR. EBERT, I bought this copy of Microsoft OFFICE. This CD is mine!
>: This office your standing in is MINE. You are MY employee and this
>: CD is MY PROPERTY. Because this CD is MY property and YOU ARE
>: MY employee you will do with this CD what I TOLD YOU TO DO or
>: you can get out. You don't OWN this place. If you don't LIKE IT
>: HERE you can just pack your bags and GET OUT. Now install this
>: CD across the computers I told you to install them on as I TOLD you
>: to do and do it NOW!"
>
>: And all I was trying to do was to highlight the possibility of his
>: being thrown into legal difficulties by fulfilling this ORDER.
>: I wasn't trying to TELL HIM what to do.
>
>What an idiot boss. What you do is follow that order, and in a future
>arse-chewing, you could always say "If you fire me or continue screaming, I
>will call the BSA on you". Then, as he fires you, go to the nearest payphone
>and financially nuke his business with the software stormtroopers doing the
>dirty deed.
>
WRONG! You never do that.
I don't give a damn for Copyrights. I use GNU/Linux.
Therefore, why should I cooperate with a Copyright organization.
Wrong thinking...
Let God be the judge.
>Who needs a gun to go postal with, when every boss is a warez dood? At
>$250K/pop, 100 copies of warez would send that business back to the stone age,
>with a $25M fine! The specter of warez makes every business vunerable to this
>digital method of going postal. Warez is a sword of damaclese over the head of
>every business exec. Large companies are especially vunerable to this attack
>as they will be all but certain to have lots of warez due to if nothing else a
>sloppy techie or a techie planting a "warez bomb" on purpose in case of firing
>to later go postal with.
>
Exactly my point. It would be like having a dual with your employer.
You get the cannon, he get's the skimpy bathing suit.
>The .NET thingy will result in economic disruption as nearly every company is
>out of compliance, and suddenly a shitload of money is lost by companies with
>Bill Gates getting it all. Any "warez bombs" will prematurely "explode" as
>.NET is implimented.
>
>--
>FOOD FOR THOUGHT: 100 calories are used up in the course of a mile run.
>The USDA guidelines for dietary fibre is equal to one ounce of sawdust.
>The liver makes the vast majority of the cholesterol in your bloodstream.
But never cooperate with the BSA. They stand for Copyrights.
Copyrights and Microsoft are like Six guns, Horses, and Cows,
if there not frozen at your freezer section in your favorite grocery
store, they should be.
--
Charlie
**DEBIAN** **GNU**
/ / __ __ __ __ __ __ __
/ /__ / / / \/ / / /_/ / \ \/ /
/_____/ /_/ /_/\__/ /_____/ /_/\_\
http://www.debian.org
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charlie Ebert)
Subject: Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"!
Reply-To: Charlie Ebert:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:12:12 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>
>
>Pete Goodwin wrote:
>>
>> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>
>> >So it seems your goal is to be as dishonest as you can get away with
>> >without lying. How pathetic.
>>
>> Reminds me of a Star Trek movie.
>>
>> 1st speaker: A lie?
>> 2nd speaker: An exaggeration.
>
>Either way, you DELIBERATELY post mis-representations.
>
>Translation: You're a goddamned LIAR Pete, and you know it.
>
>--
>Aaron R. Kulkis
>Unix Systems Engineer
>DNRC Minister of all I survey
>ICQ # 3056642
>
The appropriate old west term is the dick jerker.
He was the one who was the last person to touch the cow
before she left the gate.
--
Charlie
**DEBIAN** **GNU**
/ / __ __ __ __ __ __ __
/ /__ / / / \/ / / /_/ / \ \/ /
/_____/ /_/ /_/\__/ /_____/ /_/\_\
http://www.debian.org
------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:29:56 GMT
Edward Rosten wrote:
>
> >> bad.... I've spent more time getting a modem to work under Win NT.
> >
> > Then you don't understand what you are doing. You should be even
> > touching a computer in an administrative capacity.
>
> Then you've never administered more than a few computers ever. Hardware
> can be a problem under any OS. Win NT is an exception.
>
> > Disgraceful, you are a user, nothing more, nothing less.
>
> You are the disgrace for your lack of knowledge an unwillingness to admit
> it.
Thanks for the defense! Rather better than mine, I'm afraid.
I'm easy troll-bait, sigh.
The modem I'm talking about was shipped with an NT system I ordered
from Sam's Computers a few years ago. The modem didn't work, so
I took it out, checked the configuration, and reinstalled it.
Finally got it to work, but it would disconnect after awhile unless
I was browsing. I downloaded a pinger, and it kept the connection
alive. What a pain. I went so far as to look up the FCC ID of
the modem, found the little company in California, got new
"drivers", to no avail. I finally bought a modem at Staple's,
installed it in a few minutes, and no more problems. I also
decided not to buy from Sam's Computers anymore.
Chris
------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:33:29 GMT
Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>
> Jeepster wrote:
> >
> > Linvocates - they make the mormons seem normal.
> >
> > Gotta love 'em.
> >
> > > bad.... I've spent more time getting a modem to work
> > > under Win NT.
> >
> > Then you don't understand what you are doing. You should be even touching a
> > computer in an administrative capacity.
>
> Of course, the fact that NT, just like everything else with
> the Lose32 API is a fucked up piece of shit doesn't have the
> slightest relevance....or does it.
Thanks, Aaron! I take back anything bad I ever said about
your lonngggggg sig <grin>.
Jeepster can go back to servicing Bill Gates' CPU (central
procreative unit.)
Chris
------------------------------
From: "Adam Warner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Incredible developments in Italy regarding business software
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 01:42:22 +1300
>From the truth is stranger than fiction file:
http://lwn.net/2001/features/siae.php3
Any Italian wanting to distribute software for profit requires an
authorising stamp or they could face a huge fine or imprisonment:
"Whoever intends to make a profit ...for commercial or business purposes,
from the use of ...computer programs contained on a medium not bearing the
SIAE stamp, is subject to a penalty of imprisonment from six months up to
three years and to a fine from 2500 to 15000 Euros."
Since an SIAE stamp is required for the name of the author, publisher,
producer or copyright holder a single Linux CD could conceivably require
hundreds of stamps.
Adam
------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:46:44 GMT
Francis Van Aeken wrote:
>
> Mike Martinet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > The crux of any discussion concerning Windows performance as a server
> > has to revolve around DOS. And that's not a derogatory statement. It's
> > a decision THEY, Microsoft as a company, made for marketing reasons - to
> > leverage their installed desktop base into server sales.
>
> > If you were to go out and design server software, you would not base it
> > on an intentionally crippled, home-use OS.
>
> NT is based on DOS now?
>
> It's comforting to see that Linux advocates continue to be as well informed
> as they always were.
>
> Francis.
You're talking about one Linux advocate, my friend. A high percentage
of Linux people also have to work in a Windoze world, and many of
them know Windoze pretty dang well.
Chris
------------------------------
From: "Karel Jansens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux web pads?
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:15:27 -0100
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Charlie Ebert"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>>
>>
>>Karel Jansens wrote:
>>>
>>> Recently, I keep coming across articles praising a 'revolutionary new
>>> way of computing' (or something along those lines anyway), referring
>>> to those nifty 'web pads', A4-sized flat touch-screens that allow
>>> users to access the web away from their computer (although most of
>>> them seem to be limited to around 10 m, which sounds like they're
>>> developed for closets rather than homes). They've been popping up in
>>> several magazines, but the only one I've got at hand is on page 37 of
>>> the february 2001 issue of Popular Science.
>>
>>
>>Aggggggh Popular science...better named "Popular Adolescent Fantasies"
>>For DECADES these shitheads continued with the "personal hovercraft are
>>just around the corner and cars will be obsolete" garbage...
>>
>>Not seeming to understand that it takes a hell of a lot of fuel to get
>>anything up off the ground.....and completely out of the cost range of
>>the average commuter whose current vehicle only pays for
>>"rolling resistance" (not to mention almost no cost to sit still
>>while idling...vs engine still on full power to hover in place).
>>
>>The best use for popular science is lighting kindling in the fireplace.
>>
>
> HA! I have to agree with that.
>
> But it depends on what they have a story on.
>
> Sometimes they cover things the NAVY or AIR FORCE is doing.
>
> Sometimes they cover things like this scratch pad or whatever.
>
> Some of their ideas are totally hair brained agreed.
>
> I remember one idea they had for having web access and E-mail on your
> refrigerator. Now, that was hairbrained.
>
> But a scratch pad isn't that bad an idea. I want mine in color.
>
> OR,
>
> I'll take a keyboard with built in mouse and use that head mounted TV
> which goes in your glasses. Color for that one also.
>
> I have to have color or I'm pissed.
>
>
Like every magazine that reports cutting edge (or believes it is reporting
such stuff <G>), PS is _bound_ to get it wrong from time to time. After
all, who is going to read a magazine themed: "technology you are already
using in your home"?
Back to the LinPad <TM>: Would it be terribly difficult to port Palm's
Graffiti text input system to linux? It allows for a reasonable speed of
text input. I've also seen a report on a foldable keyboard somewhere (I
mean _really_ foldable, like a handkerchief); such a gizmo could be
easily tucked away in the LinPad <TM> until needed.
IMHO, it's all down to cost (now _that's_ easy to say!): If the LinPad
<TM> could be produced for something like 2 to 300 Euro, buyers would be
queueing in the streets.
BTW, colour is nice, but at the same time a bloody nuisance to the
batteries. A good monochrome screen will easily get 4 to 5 times more
life out of the same amount of juice.
--
Regards,
Karel Jansens
==============================
"Go go gadget linux." Zoomm!
==============================
------------------------------
From: "Karel Jansens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux web pads?
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:15:54 -0100
In article <pNjk6.265959$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "mmnnoo"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I can't see that a web pad is anything but a laptop without a keyboard -
> for some reason they've chosen to remove the least expensive but most
> useful component of the laptop computer and call it a new product.
>
> Feel free to disagree, but remember not to use a keyboard in composing
> any rebuttal.
>
Damn! _Now_ I regret not having booted OS/2 this morning, or I could have
dictated my reply (VoiceType does work, and it only needs a Pentium 90).
But I agree with you: For bulk text input (that's not scanned in,
obviously) nothing sofar beats the q-board. However, I don't see the
LinPad <TM> as a replacement for a laptop (you can't take it with you
beyond the range of the LAN transmitters), but as a comfortable tool to
have your information with you wherever you are in your home/workplace
(ever had fantasies about surfing the Web on the toilet - Not that I
have! he hastily added -, or in your bed?).
For text input, as I wrote in another post, a version of Graffiti for
linux would be nice, or a foldable keyboard tucked away inside the LinPad
<TM> until needed.
--
Regards,
Karel Jansens
==============================
"Go go gadget linux." Zoomm!
==============================
------------------------------
From: "Donal K. Fellows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.next.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:25:51 +0000
"Andrew J. Brehm" wrote:
> ZnU <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Licensing software is no different from selling a book or any other item
>> which is essentially free to manufacture but has a high development cost.
Books have substantial manufacturing and distribution costs. Paper doesn't
grow on... hang on... it's made from trees. :^)
> Books are not really sold. If they were, they would be my property to do
> as I please with after I bought them.
Books are sold (I could take my collection of O'Reilly books and use them
as expensive paper aeroplanes, for example, and nobody would have any right
to stop me) but the information content of them is not (which is the main
thrust of a lot of copyright law.)
Donal.
--
Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- I may seem more arrogant, but I think that's just because you didn't
realize how arrogant I was before. :^)
-- Jeffrey Hobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: "John" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Help with display properties
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:32:32 GMT
Hi I installed redhat 6.2 on my computer and when I open let say properties
of
display the dialog box does not fit my display and I have move the box
around to click buttons, it is 640X480. I can not make higher resolution
beacause my monitor is an old 14'. So I want just to correct what I can.
Could anybody help me with that.
Thanks
------------------------------
From: "Donal K. Fellows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.next.advocacy
Subject: Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:33:14 +0000
Nick Condon wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (J.B Moreno) wrote
>> Say Project One is a Text Editing Library (something like WASTE).
>>
>> Say Project Two is a Text Editor.
>>
>> If Project One is under GPL then the Project Two must also be under GPL.
>> OTOH, if Project One is under BSD then Project Two needn't be BSD or GPL
>> or anything else in particular.
>
> If Project One is under the BSD, there is no guarantee that Project Two
> will ever see the source code. The GPL provides that guarantee.
No. If project 1 is GPL then unless project 2 is GPL, project 1 will never
get used as part of project 2, the developers of which will instead have to
use some other equivalent code. There's usually an alternative somewhere.
Some people don't mind this effect - their goal is to maximise the amount
of source code that is modifiable by the general public - but other people
do mind this a lot since their goal is to get the code that they are using
to be used by the maximum number of people possible.
This is a big philosophical difference.
Donal.
--
Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- I may seem more arrogant, but I think that's just because you didn't
realize how arrogant I was before. :^)
-- Jeffrey Hobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: "Donal K. Fellows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.next.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:36:56 +0000
John Rudd wrote:
> Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>> --
>> Aaron R. Kulkis
>> Unix Systems Engineer
>> DNRC Minister of all I survey
>> ICQ # 3056642
>>
> [long .sig trimmed]
>
> Dude, ever heard of netiquette? :-) no more than 4-6 lines, please. :-)
He's heard of it, but doesn't think such petty rules apply to him.
Donal.
--
Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- I may seem more arrogant, but I think that's just because you didn't
realize how arrogant I was before. :^)
-- Jeffrey Hobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Peter da Silva)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.security.ssh
Subject: Re: SSH vulnerabilities - still waiting [ was Interesting article ]
Date: 20 Feb 2001 13:39:11 GMT
In article <Mpmk6.43366$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Ok, I'll conceed that SSH has more than just telnet features. But,
> these are newer features, correct?
No.
> SSH was originally for making
> secure shell access. Basically telnet, but secure. Thus the name
> "Secure Shell", correct?
SSH was originally a "secure rsh", and "rsh" is a remote job execution
service.
A telnet-style client on top of this channel was one of the obvious
applications, but it's not integral to the protocol. One of the more common
applications of ssh is for mirroring, and in that job ssh replaces rsh
directly.
--
`-_-' In hoc signo hack, Peter da Silva.
'U` "A well-rounded geek should be able to geek about anything."
-- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Disclaimer: WWFD?
------------------------------
From: "Donal K. Fellows" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.next.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 13:48:23 +0000
ZnU wrote:
> The BSD license, in contrast, is more like "I wrote this, and if you
> find it useful, you can use it under whatever conditions you like." To
> me, this just seems closer to the ideal that many GPL supporters claim
> to advocate when they talk about the "gift culture." I like my gifts
> without lots of strings attached, thanks.
The only real string attached to the BSD license is the one saying that
you can't claim that you wrote something written by someone else.
But honest people would uphold that anyway. (And gift culture really
does work; the more you give away, the better regarded and respected you
are, and consequently the better you can do for yourself. What goes
around, comes around...)
Donal.
--
Donal K. Fellows http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~fellowsd/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- I may seem more arrogant, but I think that's just because you didn't
realize how arrogant I was before. :^)
-- Jeffrey Hobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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