Linux-Advocacy Digest #406, Volume #32 Thu, 22 Feb 01 15:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: Incredible developments in Italy regarding business software ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: State of linux distros (Tim Hanson)
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Re: Amusing Aaron Kulkis Anagrams ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: State of linux distros ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Joke of the day - from Microsoft
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Re: State of linux distros ("Reefer")
Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta
Re: It's just too easy
Interesting Google Facts! (Charlie Ebert)
Re: State of linux distros ("Reefer")
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Re: Microsoft dying, was Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (The
Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited (Joshua Hesse)
Re: Ooooopsss there goes another one. (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"! (Peter Hayes)
Re: State of linux distros ("Masha Ku'Inanna")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Incredible developments in Italy regarding business software
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:55:16 +0000
"Donal K. Fellows" wrote:
>
> Adam Warner wrote:
> > Um, it is being reported that this legislation was passed last year:
> > http://lwn.net/2001/features/siae.php3
> >
> > "The Italian Parliament recently approved an amendment to copyright law.
> > The new rules have been in force since September 18, 2000 as law 248/2000.
> > The new mechanism is as yet unclear, but we suspect that it might hinder
> > or even put a stop to the work of anyone producing software or using it in
> > their business."
>
> Is that actually compatible with European Law?
>
> Donal.
I think it probably violates every free trade agreement in the EU.
--
http://www.guild.bham.ac.uk/chess-club
------------------------------
From: Tim Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:57:36 GMT
Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
>
> On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:47:01 GMT, Charlie Ebert wrote:
> >In article <tRbl6.2212$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mike wrote:
>
> >But keep in Mind, that doesn't automatically mean that Debian is dead!
>
> Debian will never die because it's free, and this IMO is a very good thing, I
> see it as a last line of defence, in that it's something that will always be
> there.
The Debian Project is also the poster child, getting contributions from
just about everybody, including hardware from the likes of Compaq, as
well as IIRC, Red Hat. It is in the true spirit of copylefted free
software. I just did an install completely off the net. No CDs or
local media except a couple of floppies for booting, which I also got
off their site. Didn't cost me a dime. I love broadband.
> >But it might mean that Suse get's bought out, Caldera get's bought out.
> >Turbo Linux get's bought out.
>
> I think it will be difficult to get rid of SuSE and Turbo, because SuSE
> is "European Linux", Turbo is "East Asian Linux". Redhat is essentially
> "American Linux". (Debian is "free Linux") They all seem to have pretty
> solid niches carved out for themselves. On the other hand, Caldera don't
> fit into this picture at all. (I'm also not sure how long both Mandrake
> and Redhat will last ... )
Caldera is out of the consumer market. Turbo and SuSE are doing well in
their respective markets. Mandrake will stay. The rest don't need to
go out of business; most of them will play to niches, like real time
embedded, tiny, cluster, etc.
> --
> Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
> elflord at panix dot com
--
Dave Mack: "Your stupidity, Allen, is simply not up to par."
Allen Gwinn: "Yours is."
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 18:57:46 -0000
On 20 Feb 2001 03:07:02 GMT, Joseph T. Adams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Bloody Viking <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>: Joseph T. Adams ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>
>: : I'm not a "fundy" or any other kind of Christian, but I'd prefer ANY of
>: : them to ANY of their detractors.
>
>: Take your xtian moral crap and shove it where it belongs, up your arse. I
>: don't care to live in a theocracy. If I did, I could always move to Iran. A
>: xtian version of an Iran still sucks.
>
>A Christian theocracy is impossible, because Christianity and
>theocracy are mutually exclusive. Jesus said that His kingdom was not
>of this world.
>
>However, for an elected leader to express some tiny bit of a moral
>backbone, with regard to abortion, infanticide, etc., does NOT
>constitute the establishment of a "theocracy."
When that "moral backbone" is motivated solely by religious
dogma, then it is indeed theocratic. If it can't be justified
based on purely secular grounds, then it's place in a republic
is suspect.
[deletia]
--
Having seen my prefered platform being eaten away by vendorlock and
the Lemming mentality in the past, I have a considerable motivation to
use Free Software that has nothing to do with ideology and everything
to do with pragmatism.
Free Software is the only way to level the playing field against a
market leader that has become immune to market pressures.
The other alternatives are giving up and just allowing the mediocrity
to walk all over you or to see your prefered product die slowly.
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Amusing Aaron Kulkis Anagrams
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:03:27 +0000
meow wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > I've been coming up with some anagrams of Aaron Kulkis name and i
> > thought id share them with you
> >
> > Aaron Kulis = Miserable piece of shit
> > Aaron Kulis = Toss Pot
> > Aaron Kulis = Argumentitive fuck wit
> > Aaron Kulis = Arrogant wank stain
> > Aaron Kulis = Numb nuts
> >
> > thats all i have so far
> > I think there surely must be some more
> > Anyone got any others?
> >
> > Meow
> >
>
> Heres another..
>
> Aaron Kulis = Professional Bullshitter
>
> Meow
Have you ever considered learning to read?
--
http://www.guild.bham.ac.uk/chess-club
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:07:15 +0000
Reefer wrote:
>
> > Yep. I'll just trash my HDDs and install Windows 2000 on my P133.
> > Oh, yeah and shell out for it as well :-)
>
> Win2kpro works perfectly with a P133, just make sure u have 'nuff memory
> ...lets say 128 MB RAM .
Oh in that case, I'll set Win2k up as a mail server on a 486...oh hold
on, that won't work will it? Maybe Linux lives on after all...
--
http://www.guild.bham.ac.uk/chess-club
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: Joke of the day - from Microsoft
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:07:40 -0000
On 19 Feb 2001 19:20:59 -0700, Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bruce Scott TOK) writes:
>
>> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> >And Bush scored above the 90th percentile of those that took the
>> >test.
>>
>> If this is true than it just means everyone else are morons too. When I
>> took it (1974) my scores of 650(verbal)/780(math) were too weak to get
>> into places like Stanford (the 650 was only 33rd pctile or so for
>> Stanford!).
>>
>> If I recall right the 650 was about 89th or 90th pctile.
>
>I never took the SAT, but my ACT score (30) was in the 97th
>percentile. I don't condescend to call others morons because of it.
>
>Also, more than half of the students that go to high school never even
>take these tests, so these percentile rankings are ratios of the other
>less-than-half that bothered (ie, you can half the difference to get a
>better generalization). You're basically saying that 39 in 40 people
>are morons, on average.
That might be optimistic...
--
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:09:59 -0000
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 00:39:51 GMT, Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In comp.os.linux.misc Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> In comp.os.linux.misc Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> In comp.os.linux.misc Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>> In comp.os.linux.misc Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>> In comp.os.linux.misc Peter T. Breuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
[deletia]
>> conviction. It's a formal game at bottom - like winning at Gin Rummy.
>
>Well, I can respect that.
>
>It's how I look at the results of my 5 senses. I don't have an absolute
>belief in anything I see or hear, but I've found that if I pay attention
>it helps "win the game".
>
>However, maybe I'm strange. I feel that some studies like perhaps ethics
>are somehow grounded in a "absolute" truth. Maybe because I fear the
>alternative.
Ethics is not infact based on "absolute" truth but acknowledging
what your standards and objectives are. It is "absolute" truth
that is scary for it is typically adhered to without any thought.
[deletia]
--
The term "popular" is MEANINGLESS in consumer computing. DOS3
was more "popular" than contemporary Macintoshes despite the
likelihood that someone like you would pay the extra money to
not have to deal with DOS3.
Network effects are everything in computing.
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: "Reefer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:19:08 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skrev i meddelandet news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Reefer wrote:
> >
> > > Yep. I'll just trash my HDDs and install Windows 2000 on my P133.
> > > Oh, yeah and shell out for it as well :-)
> >
> > Win2kpro works perfectly with a P133, just make sure u have 'nuff memory
> > ...lets say 128 MB RAM .
>
> Oh in that case, I'll set Win2k up as a mail server on a 486...oh hold
> on, that won't work will it? Maybe Linux lives on after all...
> --
> http://www.guild.bham.ac.uk/chess-club
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:16:30 -0000
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 00:50:22 -0000, Jeepster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Linvocates - they make the mormons seem normal.
>
>Gotta love 'em.
>
>> bad.... I've spent more time getting a modem to work
>> under Win NT.
>
>Then you don't understand what you are doing. You should be even touching a
>computer in an administrative capacity.
>
>Disgraceful, you are a user, nothing more, nothing less.
>
>> bargain than even the finest monopoly bloatware, Win 2000.
>
>And Linux with all its associate addons is not bloat? with KDE/Gnome added
>its not? *LOL*
Nope.
You can pick and choose.
That makes it NOT "bloatware" but a collection of components
that you can mix and match at your liesure.
Besides, the core of KDE and GNOME both together don't account
for much in terms of resource utilization.
>
>Again, you are a user not an administrator.
>
>Now sit down boy, and stop whinging about matters that you don't understand.
[deletia]
If a "user" can't effectively deal with NT then it's has
no point in existing. There are much better OSes out there
for "experts" to run.
--
>
> ...then there's that NSA version of Linux...
This would explain the Mars polar lander problem.
Kyle Jacobs, COLA
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: It's just too easy
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:21:50 -0000
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:29:44 GMT, Pete Goodwin
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Brent Pathakis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
><jb1k6.1280$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>>1. Even though hw support for Linux has vaslly improved, you still need
>>to do a little homework to make sure your hw is supported. If it is,
>>you"ll probably have an easy time of it...
>
>I checked, both my network cards are supported. Actually automatically
>configuring them doesn't appear to work. Also, LM 7.2 couldn't figure out
>to use via-rhine on one card.
"modprobe via-rhine"
BOY that was HARD...
[deletia]
--
In general, Microsoft is in a position of EXTREME conflict of
interest being both primary supplier and primary competitor.
Their actions must be considered in that light. How some people
refuse to acknowledge this is confounding.
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charlie Ebert)
Subject: Interesting Google Facts!
Reply-To: Charlie Ebert:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:22:18 GMT
Pull up http://www.google.com
Do the following.
Do a search on "Windows" - You see 24,900,000 references.
Do a search on "Microsoft" - You see 14,700,000 references.
We have to assume that the term Windows is more closely aligned with
applications and hardware made to run with Windows than Microsoft
associated materials', per say.
Do a search on "Open BSD" - You see 684,000 references.
Do a search on "Net BSD" - You see 712,000 references.
Do a search on "FreeBSD" - You see 3,330,000 references.
Do a search on "BSDI" - You see 182,000 references.
Do a search on "LinuxPPC" - You see 390 references.
Do a search on "Storm Linux" - You see 133,000 references. *
Do a search on "Turbo Linux" - You see 179,000 references.
Do a search on "Corel Linux" - You see 297,000 references. *
Do a search on "Yellow Dog" - You see 542,000 references.
Do a search on "Slackware " - You see 703,000 references.
Do a search on "Mandrake " - You see 820,000 references.
Do a search on "Suse " - You see 2,300,000 references.
Do a search on "RedHat" - You see 3,470,000 references.
Do a search on "Debian" - You see 7,140,000 references.
* Storm Linux is dead. Corel Linux is dead.
Finally, if you
Do a search on "Progeny" - You see 171,000 references.
Progeny is the brand new company headed by Ian Murdoc to bring
Debian to Corporate desktops. It will be a direct competitor
with Redhat specializing in bringing Linux NOW to corporate America.
It's also extremely clear that Debian is ahead of the rest of the
pack by a factor of 2:1.
If you added them all together you get around 15 million web pages.
That's more web pages then reference Microsoft
and 60% of the web pages which reference Windows - PERIOD.
When I did this a couple of years ago, nobody was above a million.
There were only a couple who were above 500,000. And that was
at that time, Debian and Slackware.
And being armed with this information, I cast my endorsement for
Debian as the eventual WINNER if there will be a WINNER of the
Linux distribution races.
And I will cast a vote of confidence for Progency Linux as
serious commercial contender to Redhat which is currently the
largest of the commercial arm's of Linux.
I say that based on the popularity of Debian from which is is
built from #1 and #2 Ian Murdor is heading the organization
and they want to bring Linux NOW to every corporate desktop.
Linux NOW is like clustering for the office place. It turns
every workstation into a node for a gigantic super computer
for the company's use. And it's redundant.
Interesting statistics. Time for your side of this story now!
--
Charlie
**DEBIAN** **GNU**
/ / __ __ __ __ __ __ __
/ /__ / / / \/ / / /_/ / \ \/ /
/_____/ /_/ /_/\__/ /_____/ /_/\_\
http://www.debian.org
------------------------------
From: "Reefer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:29:19 GMT
> Oh in that case, I'll set Win2k up as a mail server on a 486...oh hold
> on, that won't work will it? Maybe Linux lives on after all...
> --
A superior OS like Win2k wants to have SOMETHING to work with, not some
leftover hw from your childhood...
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:26:48 -0000
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:45:42 GMT, Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In comp.os.linux.misc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> On Fri, 16 Feb 2001 01:54:03 GMT, Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>In comp.os.linux.misc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 22:00:09 GMT, Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>>In comp.os.linux.misc [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 20:38:45 GMT, Robert Surenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>>>>In comp.os.linux.misc Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>>>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dan Mercer) writes:
>>>>>
>>>
>>>I agree, so what. I'm saying that Science depends on faith.
>
>> That the universe works in a predictable fashion is not
>> an article of faith. It is an axiom that is time tested.
>
>Study physics... The universe does not work in a predictable fashion.
>That stuff ent out with Newton.
As long as you aren't dealing at the atomic level, it does
infact work in a predictable fashion. This forum would not
be possible otherwise.
>
>Axiom is "self-evident" truth. Most thinks have found great profit
>by challenging them.
>
>> [deletia]
>
>> You can choose to violate the rules and prove us wrong
>> in the process. Somehow, I suspect that you will choose
>> not to for your own survival.
>
>What rules? Are you asking me to bow to Science again?
No, just a simple proof by contradiction.
[deletia]
You are "bowing to Science" any time you go over a bridge,
or use an elevator, or fly in an aircraft, or merely
loiter in a highrise building.
--
>> Yes. And the mailer should never hand off directly to a program
>> that allows the content to take control.
>
>Well most mailers can, so I guess they all suck too.
Yup.
Candy from strangers should be treated as such.
|||
/ | \
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft dying, was Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:42:37 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Edward Rosten
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:23:13 +0000
<973ato$82k$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>In article <uU8l6.56399$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Chad Myers"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[snip]
>> Windows XP is a whole OS which provides hundreds of new features.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>you mis spelled `no'.
No no, he's correct. Windows XP provides thousands of new features.
The catch is: they're undocumented. :-)
[.sigsnip]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- at least with Linux I could fix the bugs
EAC code #191 17d:09h:13m actually running Linux.
It's a conspiracy of one.
------------------------------
From: Joshua Hesse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.next.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: Information wants to be free, Revisited
Date: 22 Feb 2001 19:42:30 GMT
In comp.sys.next.advocacy Sam Morris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:"All your base are belong to us" - Cats
"You have no chance to survive make your time."
--
"I have also mastered pomposity, even if I do say so myself." -Kryten
UNL Anime Club: http://www.unl.edu/otaku
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Ooooopsss there goes another one.
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:46:51 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Masha Ku'Inanna
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Thu, 22 Feb 2001 00:13:25 -0500
<9726vn$v2e$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>>
>> And remember, folks. Companies providing Linux are dying left and right.
>> Everyone is seeing the Linux hype for what it really is: hype.
>> The Microsoft Operating System is therefore the way to go and everyone
>> should buy a copy of Windows 2000, Windows ME, or Windows XP (when it
>> comes out) as soon as possible, and forget about Linux because it
>> obviously isn't cutting the mustard as a profitable solution.
>>
>> Spot The Flaw.
>
>
><sarcasm>
>Ohh! I found the flaw! ..
>
>Buy an OS that is already slated to be outdated, and then have to buy that
>OS's replacement knowing full well that XP is due to be replaced by the
>still-in-development 'Windows 2002' .
>
>And all the while need a bigger/better/faster computer just to support the
>inevitable three-digit priced over-bloated "upgrade".
></sarcasm>
>
>Linux was not developed, nor was it created to turn a profit. Nor is profit
>the goal of the open-source community. Trying to capitalize on a "product"
>that, through its original design and licensing, never was intended to be
>bought and sold as a "profitable" product was a ludicrous idea that many are
>finding out.
>
>It was designed to be a powerful, viable alternative to buggy, bloatware
>produced by a company that tries to force end users into the upgrade-game
>where the only purpose was to turn a profit, and as a free alternative, show
>the world that you did not HAVE to charge an incredible amount of money to
>end users, and tie them into dependency on a single company to provide the
>only solution they should ever need.
>
>Neither is superior to the other in the eyes of the user who can make the
>most of the platform they work with.
>
>Though technical superiority can be acheived quite easily, as demonstrated,
>without the need to spend billions on R&D and marketting hype. :>
Exactly. Linux works, as opposed to Microsoft Works. :-)
(I'm using it right now, in fact.)
>
>"It's no longer cool to be fooled."
> -Trey Azagthoth
>
>
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- and then there was Microsoft BOB...ugh
EAC code #191 17d:09h:17m actually running Linux.
Linux. The choice of a GNU generation.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Red Hat Fisher Beta
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:49:04 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Edward Rosten
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:41:04 +0000
<96te46$2te$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>> bad.... I've spent more time getting a modem to work under Win NT.
>>
>> Then you don't understand what you are doing. You should be even
>> touching a computer in an administrative capacity.
>
>Then you've never administered more than a few computers ever. Hardware
>can be a problem under any OS. Win NT is an exception.
Um...not to be a wet blanket or anything, but ... how is NT's
dealing with bad hardware (the BSOD) better than a kernel panic
under Unix or bombs under MacOS or ... ??
Or are you saying NT crashes regardless of hardware? :-)
[rest snipped]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- actually, that's a thought
EAC code #191 17d:09h:20m actually running Linux.
This space for rent.
------------------------------
From: Peter Hayes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"!
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:46:41 +0000
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:26:03 +0000, "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> >Printing is a fundamental requirement. Configuring a printer has to be
> >> >addressed with more maturity than expecting the user to fiddle around
> >> >with drivers on a per application basis.
> >>
> >> Those aren't "drivers", they're mere lp commands.
> >
> > Nope.
>
>
> Correct. For some reason, best known to the GIMP developers, it ships
> with many different printer drivers.
>
> > Let's see. You want to print from The Gimp? You can select file or lp,
> > or whatever you've called your printer. Select lp. So far so good. Now,
>
> Yep.
>
>
> > ****despite the fact that my printer queue is called "Epson" to match
> > my
> > Epson Stylus Color****,
>
> What sort of garbage ASCII (is postscript text) garbage or random bytes
> garbage?
Dunno - never printed from The Gimp without setting the filter. You'll have
to ask Pete Goodwin that one :--)
but I am assured that.....
> > it will print garbage. You ***still*** have to go to "setup" and select
> > your printer instead of the default "PostScript Level 1", then save
> > settings. Then it does a reasonable, but not outstanding, printout.
>
> No, you don't. You've got GIMP sending raw postscript to the printer.
> It's a stupid default, but hey. If you remove that, you should be abe to
> print PS level 1, 2 or 3.
I'm sorry, I must be thick, but I have to go to the setup box to select my
Epson printer, thereby removing the default. That's the step Pete Goodwin
missed.
> > So it's a ***lot*** more than just "lp commands", it's setting "drivers"
> > on a per application basis.
>
> No, not on a per application basis. This is one app, GIMP which is odd.
> Try selecting a specific driver under netscape. You can't all you do is
> select a queue. The print system sorts the rest out.
So GIMP has a different approach to printing. Is it the ONLY Linux app that
behaves in this way? To answer that you'll have to know EVERY Linux app.
And therein lies a measure of uncertanty. Is the next app I install likely
to print garbage unless I have a ps printer.
> > Ok, they're filters to convert whatever The
> > Gimp outputs into whatever the Epson understands, a lot more than "mere
> > lp commands". A filter on a Windows machine to convert WSP to what your
> > printer understands is called a "driver" so it's valid to call your
> > filter on a Linux machine a "driver". A "driver" by any other name...
>
> Correct . GIMP ships with drivers other than PostScript.
>
> > And to anyone not aware of the fact that The Gimp requires you to set up
> > a printer specifically for itself and doesn't use system-wide settings,
> > it's a disaster.
>
> Incorrect in general. My GIMP printed to my default printer with no
> intervention. The problem seems to be that some GIMPs try to dump
> postscript to the printer avoiding the system filters, which is dumb.
It would seem that the version shipped with Mandrake 7.2 falls into that
category
> They still select the correct default printer.
Somewhere in there the default printer selected by The Gimp must bypass the
processing set up during the installation of the OS, by CUPS in my case.
That's really dumb, I agree.
Unless, of course, the drivers supplied with GIMP are tuned for printing
images, I don't know.
> >> I can understand the notion that learning lp commands is a tremendous
> >> burden on the user, but if the only alternative is monopoly crapware,
> >
> > There's no reason on this earth why a single system-wide printer
> > configuration is the sole province of monopoly crapware.
>
> No. It works fine under Linux for all apps except some GIMPs. Whinge to
> the GIMP developers since this is a GIMP problem, not a Linux problem.
ALL apps, except GIMP??? I hope so.
> > I'm not "trolling on Usenet", whether Pete Goodwin was is a matter of
> > opinion. To my mind he has a valid complaint - why doesn't The Gimp use
> > the system-wide printer configuration by default, instead of defaulting
> > to something else?
>
>
> It does use the default printer.
It's not using the default printer because the default printer is
"your_printer_plus_the_corresponding_filter/driver", unless you print
directly to the printer port.
> It just tries to bypass the system drivers.
Very Microsoftesque "I know better than you". Fortunately, unlike Windoze,
it can be fixed.
Peter
------------------------------
From: "Masha Ku'Inanna" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:56:18 -0500
Reply-To: "Masha Ku'Inanna" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Oh in that case, I'll set Win2k up as a mail server on a 486...oh hold
> > on, that won't work will it? Maybe Linux lives on after all...
> > --
>
> A superior OS like Win2k wants to have SOMETHING to work with, not some
> leftover hw from your childhood...
>
>
A superior OS can make do with whatever hardware platform it is installed
on, and can utilize every ounce of power from that hardware, and not just
run with mediocre performance on greater hardware requirements.
Especially when a Linux/UNIX box at 133mhz can out-perform a P-II Win2k
server in terms of stability, uptime, and performance.
Windows will never push hardware to its full potential. It is a superior
platform only when you want to bog down powerful hardware with incredible
bloat.
------------------------------
** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can send mail to the entire list by posting to comp.os.linux.advocacy.
Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
******************************
