Linux-Advocacy Digest #504, Volume #32 Mon, 26 Feb 01 20:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: Something Seemingly Simple. (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: Time for a Windows reinstall! ("Goober")
Re: why open source software is better (phil hunt)
Re: why open source software is better (phil hunt)
Re: Business (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: Is this odd security behaviour by MS? (David Steinberg)
Re: State of linux distros (Aaron Kulkis)
Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (Scott Gardner)
Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (Scott Gardner)
Re: Time for a Windows reinstall! ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Whistler/.NET will Help Linux (Steve Mading)
Re: Time for a Windows reinstall! ("Edward Rosten")
Re: why open source software is better (phil hunt)
Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (Scott Gardner)
Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux (Scott Gardner)
Re: The Windows guy. (Steve Mading)
Re: The Windows guy. (Steve Mading)
Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"! (Steve Mading)
Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"! (Steve Mading)
Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"! (Steve Mading)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: Something Seemingly Simple.
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 18:46:48 -0500
Richard Bos wrote:
>
> Joona I Palaste <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Radians are more natural than degrees. Radians are based on a
> > fundamental measurement of all circles ever (ie. the constant pi), but
> > degrees are based on an entirely arbitrary human-specified number (360).
>
> Not _entirely_ arbitrary; it was chosen because it is so easily
> divisible, and was therefore natural to the number systems used by the
> Babylonians and their neighbours.
360 degrees is conventient regardless of what numbering system you used.
If we were a base-13 society, 360 would STILL be divisable by 5.
>
> Richard
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: "meow" is yet another anonymous coward who does nothing
but write stupid nonsense about his intellectual superiors.
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "Goober" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Time for a Windows reinstall!
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 23:35:53 -0000
I have the opposite problem with win2k.
If I download a file from the internet onto the desktop, it does not appear
to be there, but it does appear if you use explorer to look at the desktop
folder on the hard drive. Very weird.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (phil hunt)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: why open source software is better
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:40:26 +0000
On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 14:42:05 GMT, Ernest Schaal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>BACK ON TOPIC:
>
>While I would agree that there are advantages to open source software if you
>are a programmer, those advantages don't apply for the computer user.
Some do, for example the reduced cost, reduced vendor lock-in, and
increased reliability.
>When I started using computers (1962), computer programmers and computer
>users were synonymous because we had to write the programs we ran. For
>instance, I started out with Fortran, and later moved to BASIC, Pascal, etc.
>Nowadays, it doesn't make sense to write all your programs, or to spend time
>modifying them.
>
>For instance, I use Microsoft Word a lot. When I started with the earlier
>versions of Word (late 1080s), I also needed PageMaker in order to do
>newsletters and brochures. Since that time, Word has improved to the point
>that I do significant desktop publishing with it.
IMO Word improved up to about 1995. Since then it's got worse.
--
*****[ Phil Hunt ***** [EMAIL PROTECTED] ]*****
"Mommy, make the nasty penguin go away." -- Jim Allchin, MS head
of OS development, regarding open source software (paraphrased).
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (phil hunt)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: why open source software is better
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:53:43 +0000
On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 13:05:54 -0500, David Masterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>>> "phil" == phil hunt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> Consider:
>
>> 1. proprietary software must capture a market and get revenue from
>> it; the more revenue it gets, the more successful it will be, from a
>> proprietary software company's point of view
>
>> 2. it can make more profits if it has no competition, because if
>> there is competition, the per-item sales price can reduce to near
>> zero
>
>> 3. one effective way of preventing competition is to stop
>> competitors from making competing software, by commodifying
>> protocols, e.g. by obfuscating or patent-encumbering them
>
>> 4. therefore, commercially successful proprietary software will
>> always tend to harm users' interests in ways that open source won't
>
>> This is my paraphrase of an argument is given in more detail by
>> Ralph Levien in his essay "The decommoditization of protocols".
>> <http://levien.com/free/decommoditizing.html>
>
>The subject line for this message should be "why open source software
>is better for the *customer*".
Why?
--
*****[ Phil Hunt ***** [EMAIL PROTECTED] ]*****
"Mommy, make the nasty penguin go away." -- Jim Allchin, MS head
of OS development, regarding open source software (paraphrased).
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Business
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 18:49:56 -0500
Jon Johanson wrote:
>
> Hey Aaron,
>
> Are you still beating your wife and molesting your children?
False premise.
I've never engaged in either.
Conversely, Drestin has PUBLICLY STATED that he does what I said he does.
>
> "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > Hey, Drestin
> >
> >
> > Still pimping out your wife?
> >
> > --
> > Aaron R. Kulkis
> > Unix Systems Engineer
> > DNRC Minister of all I survey
> > ICQ # 3056642
> >
> >
> > H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> > premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> > you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> > you are lazy, stupid people"
> >
> > I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> > challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> > between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> > Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
> >
> > J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> > The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> > also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
> >
> > K: Truth in advertising:
> >
> > Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
> > Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
> > Special Interest Sierra Club,
> > Anarchist Members of the ACLU
> > Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
> > The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
> > Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
> >
> >
> > A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
> >
> > B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> > method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> > direction that she doesn't like.
> >
> > C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
> >
> > D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> > ...despite (C) above.
> >
> > E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> > her behavior improves.
> >
> > F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> > adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
> >
> > G: Knackos...you're a retard.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: "meow" is yet another anonymous coward who does nothing
but write stupid nonsense about his intellectual superiors.
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Steinberg)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Is this odd security behaviour by MS?
Date: 26 Feb 2001 23:50:27 GMT
Adam Warner ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: I'm sure Erik will be able to clear up any misunderstanding :-)
Or, perhaps Chad will explain again how he figures that Microsoft is doing
a much better job at keeping its users up to date on security issues than
the makers of OpenSSH.
--
David Steinberg -o)
Computer Engineering Undergrad, UBC / \
[EMAIL PROTECTED] _\_v
------------------------------
From: Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: State of linux distros
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 18:50:32 -0500
moooo wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> >
> >
> > Reefer wrote:
> > >
> > > "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skrev i meddelandet
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > You really are on a reefer, aren't you
> > >
> > > >Hence his nickname.
> > >
> > > Said from a man that manages to get people to start 3-4 hate threads about
> > > him, just in the last couple of days...
> >
> > Annoys the fuck out of you, doesn't it.
> >
> >
> >
> You annoy the fuck out of me i know that much
And your point is?
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: "meow" is yet another anonymous coward who does nothing
but write stupid nonsense about his intellectual superiors.
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Scott Gardner)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 23:49:30 GMT
>>> > "Those who would trade liberty for safety deserve neither"
>>> > --Benjamin Franklin
>>>
>>> I'm not trading liberty for safety. I get more liberty without guns
>>> around than with.
>>
>> You are so naive, you are dangerous.
>
>I would rather not have someone as hot headed as you running around armed
>with a handgun.
>
I'm going to jump in here with a personal example:
I am a Naval Officer. I have a permit to carry a concealed handgun.
I have had required formal training in the safe and proper use of said
handgun. I subjected myself to a background check and fingerprinting
before I was issued my concealed-carry permit. Had I not inherited my
handgun from my father, I would have been subject to a waiting period
before purchasing my handgun. I have no transgression on my criminal
record more serious than a speeding ticket.
These are the much same criteria my state uses before anyone is issued
a concealed-carry permit, and most states are equally strict, if they
even allow concealed-carry at all. Tell me exactly WHY you think that
I, and people like me, should not be allowed to own and carry
handguns??
Scott Gardner
LT US Navy
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Scott Gardner)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:06:11 GMT
On Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:45:00 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>Case in point...that little British fiasco of 1775-1778.
Geez, Aaron, I like to think I'm as tolerant as the next guy, and I've
never complained in the fifteen years I've been reading USENET posts
about criminal abuse of bandwidth, but to post those ten words, you
quoted the entire previous post, and added your
sigfile-with-a-pituitary-gland-problem, giving us this final score:
total post -- two hundred and thirty-one lines
added content -- one line
Show a little restraint, please.
Scott Gardner
LT US Navy
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Time for a Windows reinstall!
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:08:45 +0000
> If I understand you correctly, you are saying that a third party
> software pkg called Nero screwed up and filled up your HDD. Now your pc
> runs slow and you blame MS for this. How is MS to blame for this ?
As I understand it, a 3rd party app screwed up and a reinstall of Windows
is required. The fault lies squarely at Micros~1's feet, since apps
screwing up should not harm the os.
-Ed
--
| u98ejr
| @
Share, and enjoy. | eng.ox
| .ac.uk
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Whistler/.NET will Help Linux
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:09:05 GMT
Tom Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: I think the comparison with the Napster thing really isn't applicable.
: Actual theft was taking place on Napster. I'm surprised it took as long as
: it did to take them to court and shut them down.
I'm sick and tired of this misrepresentation of the crime of copyright
infringement. IT ISN'T THEFT UNLESS YOU DEPRIVE THE ORIGINAL OWNER
OF THE THING IN QUESTION! (And, no removing the oppurtunity to make
profit doesn't count.) Plagerism is not theft. Illegal copying is
not theft. Theft is REMOVING something from its original owner and
taking it with you, not making a second copy of it without permission.
I hate that the big companies misuse this term all the time. It
belittles the real crime of theft.
Theft is bad for two reasons:
#1 - It allows someone to gain something without giving back to the
community something of equal value, which undermines the whole
concept of trade and markets that the entire economy is based on.
(Money is just an abstraction of barter. Money is a count of how
much worth you've given out to others, in the form of work, or giving
them physical stuff, etc)
#2 - It deprives someone else of the thing they've already worked
to achieve.
Copying intellectual property is only bad for reason #1. It does
not have reason #2. While still bad, it is not on the same level
as thievery.
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Time for a Windows reinstall!
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:09:56 +0000
In article <OSBm6.30030$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Goober"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have the opposite problem with win2k. If I download a file from the
> internet onto the desktop, it does not appear to be there, but it does
> appear if you use explorer to look at the desktop folder on the hard
> drive. Very weird.
And that said feature is patented.
-Ed
--
| u98ejr
| @
Share, and enjoy. | eng.ox
| .ac.uk
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (phil hunt)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: why open source software is better
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:13:47 +0000
On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 03:30:34 GMT, jtnews <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I like open source software because
>it tends not to get cluttered by creeping
>featurism, the adding of superfluous
>and mostly unused features. Therefore,
>you can understand it a lot
>easier and are more likely to be able
>to fix it yourself.
>
>If the original author starts going in a
>direction that doesn't satisfy the needs
>of the users, the source tree can simply
>be replicated and a new author can take over.
>In this sense, open source software is
>one of the purest forms of competition.
I've added this comment to my website at
<http://www.vision25.demon.co.uk/ip/oss-better.html>
--
*****[ Phil Hunt ***** [EMAIL PROTECTED] ]*****
"Mommy, make the nasty penguin go away." -- Jim Allchin, MS head
of OS development, regarding open source software (paraphrased).
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Scott Gardner)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:15:39 GMT
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 21:03:40 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>Conclusion: The mere RUMOR of Stinger Missiles kept all Soviet
>attack craft (both fixed-wing and helicoptors) from flying
>anywhere within range of this band of men.
>
>Add to that the mountainous terrain, and you are only a small
>step from the heavily-forested mountains which almost completely
>negate the effectiveness of air superiority even without
>effective defensive anti-aircraft systems.
I can vouch for this. I'm in an E-2C squadron (kind of like the
AWACS, but we don't need two dozen people to get the job done...), and
we always brief MANPAD threats like the Stinger to be effective up to
about 15,000 feet AGL (Above Ground Level). No problem, we fly higher
than that on normal mission profile. But now consider a mission over
mountainous terrain, with peaks up around 6-7 thousand feet. That
puts the MANPADs a lot closer to us...
Scott Gardner
LT US Navy
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Scott Gardner)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft seeks government help to stop Linux
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:17:02 GMT
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 00:42:57 -0000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] () wrote:
>>> >The Iowa-model battleships would be nice, just make sure to adapt nuke
>>> >artillery shells to its guns. That way, Redmond becomes MS-Parking Lot v.1.0.
And they could code-name it "Glass-Top"!
Scott Gardner
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Windows guy.
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:19:35 GMT
Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: On 23 Feb 2001 18:49:48 GMT, Steve Mading wrote:
:>Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>But what if the Lambourghini (sp?) was the first car ever made, and
:>was not called "Lambourghini" but was in fact just called "car",
:>because it started the whole idea of "car"? Then someone else comes
:>along and makes a knockoff copy of it called "beetle", that appears to
:>have the same features, if you don't examine it too carefully.
:>
:>Pipes on Unix came first.
: Are you sating that UNIX was the first OS to have IPC ? (didn't
: Multics have it for example ?)
Perhaps. Multics was also multi-process, and I assume so were its pipes.
(I don't know enough about it to be authoritative, though)
:>But what if a C compiler didn't support malloc(), or printf()? Those
: If it didn't support those, it wouldn't be a C compiler. The ISO C
: language definition clearly says that those are supposed to be supported.
And Pipes are an INTERPROCESS tool, by definition. DOS didn't have
more than one process. It had a single "process" that lived forever,
often replacing its program code with a newly loaded EXE or COM
file, but that's not the same thing as starting a new process.
(Program != Process). Piping is impossible under that type of
environment, even using MS's temp file technique. Why is it
impossible? Because you can't communicate between two processes
when only one process can actually exist. DOS 'pipes' are a method
for a process to communicate with ITSELF, not to other processes.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Windows guy.
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:21:27 GMT
Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: Wrong.
: Pipes REQUIRE multitasking.
: Pipe are an INTER-PROCESS COMMUNICATION method....*NOT*
: short-hand for system-generated tempfiles between seperately
: run processes.
Dos didn't even techncially have seperate one-at-a-time processes.
By the CS meanings of the word, it had one process that lived
forever, frequently replacing it's code with a new load from an
EXE or COM file.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"!
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:27:58 GMT
Peter Hayes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 13:34:47 +0000, "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:> >> Correct. For some reason, best known to the GIMP developers, it ships
:> >> with many different printer drivers.
:> >
:> > So there are one set of drivers for CUPS and one set for The Gimp...
:> > any
:>
:> Incorrect. CUPS does not have any drivers. It uses GS.
:>
:> > more applications that ship with drivers for printers? Does any of this
:> > sound _wrong_ to anyone?
:>
:>
:> Depends what you consider wrong, but I don't bother with the gimp drivers.
: Looking into it again, the GIMP drivers give you on the spot choices for
: paper size, and type (glossy, photo-glossy, transparancy) so may have some
: advantages.
Gimp doesn't HAVE its own printer drivers. What it has is its own user
interface for talking to the SAME drivers that all the other apps use.
The dialog box that lets you pick those settings you mention is not the
driver. Those are settings that would be open to other programs to pick
as well, but they never bothered to make a user interface to access them.
This is also where the mistake in Gimp is coming from - it lies to the
print queue (where the driver is {called a 'filter' in Unix parlance}.),
telling it "Here's some raw data for you in the printer's own native
codes", when in fact this is not the case and it's just giving out
postscript just like every other app is.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"!
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:29:26 GMT
Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: In article <976cgt$drc$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
: [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
:> : So there are one set of drivers for CUPS and one set for The Gimp... any
:> : more applications that ship with drivers for printers? Does any of this
:> : sound _wrong_ to anyone?
:>
:> Yup. It sounds like you got it wrong. The drivers GIMP is using are
:> the same drivers everyone else could use if they felt like it, they
:> just aren't dumb enough to want to.
: I got it wrong?!? Surely you mean Linux Mandrake got it wrong? Or The
: Gimp?
No, I mean you got it wrong when you claimed there were different
drivers being used by Gimp.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another Linux "Oopsie"!
Date: 27 Feb 2001 00:35:40 GMT
Mart van de Wege <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Peter
: Hayes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>
:> I then thought CUPS must be to blame, but from what you say it
:> would seem to be GIMP, but how is it that some people don't
:> have the problem?
:>
:> Peter
: Well,
: Steve Mading pointed out his configuration *always* filters
: printer output, even if it is labeled raw. It appears that
: different distros apply different filtering policies. I don't
: what distro Steve is running (he didn't mention, or I missed it)
Redhat 6.2 & Suse 7.0 both have working Gimps for me. (I can't
speak about RH 7.x because I haven't used it yet.) I got it
to work at my place of work, and then realized that we have
big lazer printers that are postscript capable anyway, so that
isn't a good test. So I tried at home, on my Canon Bubblejet 660c,
definately NOT a postscript printer, one that needs to use the
filters to go from postscript to whatever the BJC660 uses.
Gimp prints fine for me there as well.
: but I would consider that behaviour as broken, because if I
: state that I want unfiltered output to my printer I don't want
: my system to second-guess me and filter it anyway. OTOH, I
: compulsively check out every option before doing something, so
: my chances of getting caught by the Gimp's behaviour would have
: been smaller than Pete's, although I dare not say zero.
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