Linux-Advocacy Digest #782, Volume #32 Tue, 13 Mar 01 04:13:06 EST
Contents:
Re: Middle Aged Fat Asses (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your ("Nigel
Feltham")
Re: There is money in Linux ("Erik Funkenbusch")
Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your (Matthew
Gardiner)
Re: The Linux office, a possible future..... ("GreyCloud")
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software ("GreyCloud")
Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your computer")
("Nigel Feltham")
Re: Need help setting up classroom for Linux ("Adam Warner")
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software ("GreyCloud")
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Re: Dividing OS to groups. ("GreyCloud")
Re: Microsoft's .NET Vision ("GreyCloud")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Middle Aged Fat Asses
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 21:04:54 +1300
I think I know what you're on about. My teacher at school, who took
Computer Studies, thought he was the absolute genius because he new Microsoft
Word 97 in and out, but, he knew sweet-bugger-all about computers and
operating systems, that was shown in the fact that when he set-up Novell
Netware 5, he gave EVERY STUDENT ADMINISTRATION PRIVILEGES! I know what you
are talking about Charlie, however, I would not restrict the comment to just
"middle aged fat ass men", this is what happens to most lusers, who master one
aspect of a computer, may be using Word, or using the start menu, and in their
eyes, that gives them the title of "Computer Genius" or "System
Administrator", which they are clearly not, then when they try Linux/UNIX or
some other operating system, they realise that computing is more than that one
aspect they mastered, but instead of accepting they don't have all the answers
and going away and learning Linux, they post on COLA declaring that Linux is
too hard, or some other anecdotal garbage to make they feel better again, as
they cannot handle the fact, that they over estimated their abilities.
Matthew Gardiner
Charlie Ebert wrote:
> Why is is that everytime the subject of Linux comes up in an
> office, about 25 middle aged fat asses fly into the conversation
> to profess the advocacy of using Windows powered boxes.
>
> Windows boxes are so easy to install. I tried to install Linux
> and it was SOO DIFFICULT! Every PC crashes, so why pick the OS
> which is hardest to install! Oh my!
>
> They are so concerned about install and setup they forgot the
> REASON this BECAME IMPORTANT! It BECAME IMPORTANT BECAUSE,,,,
> MIDDDLE AGGGED FATTTASS MAN ARE YOU LISTENING TO ME HERE,,,,
> IT BECAME IMPORTANT BECAUSE WINDOWS IS AN UNRELIABLE PEICE
> OF SHIT OPERATING SYSTEM WHICH ISN'T CAPABLE OF UPTIMES EXCEEDING
> A WEEK! IT'S THE FUCKING OPERATING SYSTEM WHICH HAS MADE THIS
> RE-INSTALLATION ISSUE EXTREMELY IMPORTANT TO YOU!
>
> The next concern MIDDLE AGED FAT ASS MAN has is that Linux
> doesn't have Microsoft Office. MAFAM can't use a computer unless
> it has his favorite! MAFAM, use Star Office or Gnome or KDE office.
> Use Evolution! Do not rely on MAFAM products from Micro-crash anymore.
>
> There must be a device which uses centrifical force or some other means
> which will transfer MAFAM's brain from this lower extremeties back
> up to his cranium where it belongs.
>
> MAFAM also has this terrible difficulty in understanding why it's important
> to know LINUX is ready for business when you refer to the largest
> super computer clusters being built from Linux. MAFAM thinks that's
> GEEK BRAINS STUFF and that doesn't APPLY TO MAFAM WORLD!
>
> Nothing in MAFAM's world needs to have GEEK BRAINS stuff as long as
> you have a GOOD PLAN!
>
> MAFAM lives by the GOOD PLAN philosophy.
>
> See you all on the wide track MAFAM'S!
>
> Charlie
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your
Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 13:40:01 -0000
> Yep. Someone has to finally say it. That was a second reason I set out to
get
> Linux in 1994. UNIX of any flavour will always have that Big Iron mystique
to
> it. Interestingly, Linux is used on modern Big Iron, as in Beowulf
clusters to
> make supercomputers.
Linux has changed a lot in those past years hasn't it - I recently
reinstalled my 1994
vintage copy of slackware on an old laptop out of curiosity and was amazed
at the
differences :-
No loadable modules (only a 1.0 series kernel),
only 2 window managers (fvwm and twm),
display limited to 640x480 (I was using a 1997 laptop so no suitable display
drivers - no framebuffer either in those days),
Tricky configuration (remember configxf86 - not up to xf86config standards),
limited diskspace (no LBA support so limited to 500mb on IDE drives),
Limited applications
No ELF binaries (not introduced until 1.2 kernel).
On the plus side it is still more reliable than Win9x (and win3.1 - the
only MS gui available at
the time).
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: There is money in Linux
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 02:14:51 -0600
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > Yet I get to hear about the odd Linux company whose stock is slipping
and
> > sliding downwards.
>
> So is Microsofts stocks.... they around $56 / share now... back when they
> started it was about $45 / share.
> That was in 1982.
That would be quite a trick, since they didn't IPO until 1994, and they were
founded in 1975.
Additionally, their stock price was over $100 on IPO, and has since split 8
times, giving them an adjusted price (relevant to their IPO price/shares) of
over $800 if they had never had any splits.
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 21:15:05 +1300
Problem is that it doesn't include a DVD player to allow you to play DVD
movies, besides that, the SUN Blade 100 is a nice machine, although it won't
set the world on fire, it will allow most users to do what they want to do.
Matthew Gardiner
GreyCloud wrote:
> "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > The even if Windows was ready and Itanium was ready:
> >
> > 1. The Itanium is bloody expensive when compared to other 64bit CPU's
> > 2. Windows XP 64bit Server is unproven, hence, the uptake will be flat, if
> > not, totally non-existant.
> > 3. There is bugger-all software for Windows XP 64bit, and even if there
> was,
> > it would be considered "first generation 64 solutions", yet another reason
> > why there will be a slow uptake.
> > 4. Very soon (I am pretty optimistic), SUN has included a DVD drive in as
> > an option in their SUN Blade 100 workstation, all that will be needed is a
> > DVD player, and you will find many geeks/nerds/techno-enthusiasts will go
> > out and buy a SUN Blade 100.
> > 5. The apps are already there for Solaris, either in 64 bit or 32bit,
> > either one has no performace loss, unlike 32 bit code on Intels Itanium
> > processors that will run really shitty (from what I have heard).
> > 6. From what I see, SUN is first trying to win over developer support
> > (through their "big admin" site and other dinky little things), and once a
> > significant number of people have jumped on board the Sparc bandwagon, the
> > finally assult will be on the desktop (which may happen after the next
> > revision of Solaris that will most likely include GNOME 2.0 (which will
> have
> > Natilus)), that will allow the average user to have the power and
> stability
> > of UNIX, whilst maintaing the ease of use of Windows/MacOS.
> >
> > Matthew Gardiner
>
> That pretty much sums it up! BTW, I looked at Suns' buy site and DVD is an
> option.
------------------------------
From: "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Linux office, a possible future.....
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:18:49 -0800
"Pete Goodwin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> says...
> > > Where is it? Where? Where?
> >
> > Take your pick of Linux distributions.
>
> And each one of the distros has a way to go yet.
>
> > > > Imagine most, if not all, office workers in a company using Linux
with KDE or
> > > > Gnome.
> > >
> > > Imagine all the bug reports... 8)
> >
> > Fewer than those that get send to Microsloth.
>
> I doubt that, after using KDE for a while. More bugs than I'd care to
> shake a stick at.
>
> > > Ah, there you've got me. Ours is still 10 BaseT. 100 BaseT coming
soon!
> >
> > Perhaps yours, but all of the companies I deal with are upgraded.
>
> This is England, where we can't seem to get broadband for the home off
> the ground.
>
Don't feel too bad about the broadband part. My cable tv outfit is owned by
Paul Allen.
He's been promising for a year now and still no broadband! :-(
It sure would make life with my wife easier if I could get what he's
advertising.
He promised that we would get a hub for 5 computers and 7 e-mail accounts
for $40.
> > > > Imagine 25, 100, or 1000s of office workers connected to a central
backbone.
> > >
> > > Can you imagine the network traffic?
> >
> > A switched backbone negates most traffic.
>
> Is that why the Internet is nicknamed "the world-wide wait"?
>
> > > I'm not sure I'd like a myseterious research group to hijack my
machine
> > > and use it for their purposes!
> >
> > There is where we disagree. Most office workers don't care, and wouldn't
even
> > notice. As long as the spreadsheet, word processor, and e-mail work,
they'd
> > never know.
>
> Probably not. Though the researchers might be a little miffed since I
> reboot my machines several times a day (device driver work).
>
> > The tools were quite primitive 10 years ago.
>
> They've improved that much have they? Judging by what I've seen in Linux,
> there doesn't seem to be that much improvement. Catching up with Windows,
> maybe, but otherwise the good ol' script file is still there.
>
> > Perhaps, but tried and true technology as MPI and the UNIX clustering
tools are
> > pretty well tested.
>
> And you want everyone to use clustering for everything is that it? What
> happened to... gasp... choice?
>
> > > If you're talking about making computers be a network device you need
one
> > > thing first. A fast reliable network. That can happen in the office.
> >
> > Not a "network device" a stand-alone computing node. There is a big
difference.
>
> With or without a disk?
>
> > > Where it won't happen is in the home. There are _still_ a lot of
people
> > > dialling up with 56k modems. Can you imagine having a diskless machine
as
> > > it tries to download an app across a 56k link? Or maybe you'll try
> > > running X across such a link? Sluggish, did you say?
> >
> > Who said ANYTHING about diskless? No one but you. A modem connected unit
would
> > not be part of the cluster, but certainly remote adminstratable.
>
> Weren't the Network PC's going to be diskless?
>
> > > Please! There's a big difference between Windows and CP/M.
> >
> > The mentality is very similar. A small island onto itself. UNIX the idea
has
> > always been grouping the power of the computers.
>
> Nothing wrong with small islands. Nothing wrong with cooperation either,
> for that matter.
>
> > > As for UNIX being able to do, why aren't they doing it, why aren't
they
> > > the leading force on the desktop?
> >
> > The reason for that has a lot to do with AT&T, Microsoft's monopoly,
etc.
> > Anyone sufficiently educated with the history of the PC and modern
operating
> > systems could conclude it isn't because Microsoft did anything well.
>
> Or perhaps UNIX sat back and did nothing about it?
>
> > > What's the UNIX equivalent of Corel Draw?
> >
> > There are several packages, what did you have in mind for particular
features?
>
> How about general purpose ones?
>
> > Do tell, why isn't Star Office "there" yet? I have been using it over a
year,
> > before that I was using Applix.
>
> Fonts, Printers, overall Sluggishness.
>
> > Tell me what isn't "there" yet about these packages?
>
> They're behind what we have on Windows.
>
> > > I'm sorry but the number of desktop
> > > applications on Windows easily outstrips those on UNIX.
> >
> > Number, yes, unique to a task, no.
>
> More choice!
I wonder, over here we have plenty of choices. Sometimes companies go belly
up because of bad management. I remember the Amiga back 1987, and back then
there really wasn't anything to compare to it or beat it for its low cost.
For the money the graphics were the best. Unfortunately, it was bought out
by
Commodore and things stayed stagnant. I still haven't seen a system utilize
multiple moving backdrops (lack of a better word) since. I really don't
know what goes on in England with computers or how the citizens there are
taxed or treated in regards to computers. ???
> --
> Pete
> All your no fly zone are belong to us
------------------------------
From: "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:21:49 -0800
"Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:98jp51$qsa$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Ketil Z Malde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>
> > > Democracy has very little to do with republic, and vice versa.
> >
> > I don't agree - the Roman republic was heavily inspired by the Greek
> > democracies.
>
> So? They still have very little in common.
> You can be a republic country,but not democratic, and vise versa.
>
> > > Nazi germany was a republic.
> >
> > And a democracy. NSDAP was elected, you know. Now, the party was
> > using methods that weren't exactly democratic...
>
> Nope, Nazi germany refers to *after* Hitler got the reins.
> After that, germany wasn't a democracy.
> The german constitution was idiotic, Hitler declared intent was to end the
> democracy in germany.
> And the foolishness of the post-WWI pre-Hitler goverment in germany didn't
> help a bit, not to mention the stupid Versay(sp?) treaty.
>
>
>
BTW, does anyone have or know where to see this treaty?? I'm curious.
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Customising Wrap-Up Screen. (WAS: "It is now safe to shut off your
computer")
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 08:24:02 -0000
> Yep, you can (put BootGUI=0 in MSDOS.SYS), but the original
> query/misunderstanding/whatever was whether the mode co80 trick worked on
> anything other than Win95.
Doesn't seem to work on the OSR2 version of win95 either.
------------------------------
From: "Adam Warner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Need help setting up classroom for Linux
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 21:31:24 +1300
In article
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> "Bob Hauck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> On Mon, 12 Mar 2001 12:36:38 -0800, GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I've read it mentioned in O'Reilley's book "Volume three" "X Window
>> > System User's Guide" that a teacher could type on his computer
>> > examples and have these examples show up on the students computers.
>>
>> > Not sure how this could be accomplished and maintain some security.
>>
>> The easiest way is to set up a VNC server on one computer and have the
>> rest connect in "listen" mode. This mode allows any number of clients
>> to connect to the same server. Actions taken by one will show up on
>> all, and you don't have to allow the students to connect to your real
>> desktop.
>>
>> --
>> -| Bob Hauck
>> -| To Whom You Are Speaking
>> -| http://www.haucks.org/
> Thank you much! But, this VNC server, is it distributed with linux or
> do we have to get it from a download site?
> Best I've heard yet!
VNC is very useful:
http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/
(first link on google).
It's free software.
Regards,
Adam
------------------------------
From: "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:32:17 -0800
"Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:98jn9e$ott$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Stefaan A Eeckels" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > In article <98ih6r$egm$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> > "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>
> > > Nope, at least not with GPL.
> > > 2)
> > > ...
> > >
> > > b) You must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in
whole
> or
> > > in part contains or is derived from the Program or any part thereof,
to
> be
> > > licensed as a whole at no charge to all third parties under the terms
of
> > > this License.
> >
> > Yep. The license is $0.00, the charge for the media is $75 + shipping
> > (with apologies to Sun).
>
> What Sun has to do with it?
> It has its own OSI approved license.
> Beside, what prevents me from taking the binaries/source and put them on
an
> FTP?
> There would be immediate decline in the money the producer will be making.
>
The answer is quite elementary my dear Watson! Its free for the download!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 09:03:09 +0100
In article <98jp51$qsa$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> "Ketil Z Malde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>
>> > Democracy has very little to do with republic, and vice versa.
>>
>> I don't agree - the Roman republic was heavily inspired by the Greek
>> democracies.
>
> So? They still have very little in common.
> You can be a republic country,but not democratic, and vise versa.
>
>> > Nazi germany was a republic.
>>
>> And a democracy. NSDAP was elected, you know. Now, the party was
>> using methods that weren't exactly democratic...
>
> Nope, Nazi germany refers to *after* Hitler got the reins.
> After that, germany wasn't a democracy.
> The german constitution was idiotic, Hitler declared intent was to end the
> democracy in germany.
> And the foolishness of the post-WWI pre-Hitler goverment in germany didn't
> help a bit, not to mention the stupid Versay(sp?) treaty.
It's "Versailles". The main reason for the rise of Nazism
were the reparation payments exacted from the Germans by
the WWI allies. They caused hyper-inflation (stamps of
one billion marks) and economic stagnation, and deep-rooted
enmity against the rest of Europe.
The constitution wasn't that bad; it just proved that
proportional representation can give too much influence
to the party in the power broker role.
--
Stefaan
--
How's it supposed to get the respect of management if you've got just
one guy working on the project? It's much more impressive to have a
battery of programmers slaving away. -- Jeffrey Hobbs (comp.lang.tcl)
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Stefaan A Eeckels)
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 09:07:12 +0100
In article <98jn9e$ott$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> "Stefaan A Eeckels" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> In article <98ih6r$egm$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>
>> > Nope, at least not with GPL.
>> > 2)
>> > ...
>> >
>> > b) You must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in whole
> or
>> > in part contains or is derived from the Program or any part thereof, to
> be
>> > licensed as a whole at no charge to all third parties under the terms of
>> > this License.
>>
>> Yep. The license is $0.00, the charge for the media is $75 + shipping
>> (with apologies to Sun).
>
> What Sun has to do with it?
These are the terms Solaris 8 is licensed under.
> It has its own OSI approved license.
> Beside, what prevents me from taking the binaries/source and put them on an
> FTP?
> There would be immediate decline in the money the producer will be making.
Linux distributors have learned that there isn't too much
renevue lost to the likes of CheapBytes, or the availabity
of ISO images or packages on public FTP servers.
Besides, if I sell bespoke software under the GPL, the customer
isn't going to put it up for distribution unless they perceive
it's in their business interest.
--
Stefaan
--
How's it supposed to get the respect of management if you've got just
one guy working on the project? It's much more impressive to have a
battery of programmers slaving away. -- Jeffrey Hobbs (comp.lang.tcl)
------------------------------
From: "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Dividing OS to groups.
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:50:13 -0800
"Brian Pauw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:98jf6b$2r8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In alt.destroy.microsoft GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > "J Sloan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> Giuliano Colla wrote:
> >>
> >> > Ayende Rahien wrote:
> >> > > Most of the design team from VMS worked on NT.>
> >> >
> >> > Apparently working under different directives.
> >>
> >> Yes, after some thought it does seem like quite a stretch
> >> to claim that windows nt is derived from vms. At most there
> >> could be some similar philosophies in things like scheduler
> >> or memory management algorithms, but they are completely
> >> separate and different OSes.
> >>
> >> For one thing, vms was very stable, it could run for years.
> >>
> >> I'm also told that VMS has a number of key features and
> >> capabilities that have no equivalent in windows nt.
> >>
> >> So, perhaps the list should look like this:
> >>
> >> Unix derived OSes and close relatives:
> >> Solaris, Linux, *BSD, Irix, HP-UX, AIX, SCO,
> >> Unix-on-Mach (NeXT, MacOS X, MkLinux)...
> >>
> >> Microsoft OSes
> >> msdos, win3x, win 9x, winnt/2k.
> >>
> >> Traditional Data Center OSes
> >> VMS, MVS, etc...
> >>
> >> Other
> >> AmigOS, classic MacOS, etc
> >>
> >> jjs
> >>
> > Yes. That looks about right. BTW, cutler was hired and fired a few
times
> > during his nt days.
> > I've heard on the grapevine, then, that cutler disagreed with gates and
crew
> > about how to
> > design a decent o/s. The real funny part is that Gates used DEC vaxes
to do
> > business in house
> > rather than use windows!
> > Banks and the stock market AFAIK use a lot of vms systems and ibm
vs
> > systems.
> > I don't know what happened to Data General, but i'm curious to find out.
>
>
> I think you forgot AS/400 there.... and what was the os on atari's??
> brian.
>
Thank you! Forgot all about them! Very good computers, the AS/400's were!
Got a story about IBM and the gov. on that!
The Navy Dept. invited IBM to come out to a shipyard and survey their needs
for computing. IBM spent over $2 million on analysis and recommendations...
the Navy sat on it! Didn't do squat! Too many chiefs and no Indians!
When I asked them to show me their systems and capabilities they were very
cold. I asked them what the problem was and they explained it to me. I
did write a contract for IBM AS/400's, 3 of em, for CAD/CAM, and
was approved quickly... the secret, as I suspected, was never put more than
2 sheets of paper on a bureacrats desk or he won't look at it. (Looks like
too much work!) I put it on 1 page! The ADP dept. printed a 500 page
document!
------------------------------
From: "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsoft's .NET Vision
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:53:04 -0800
"Peter Hayes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:29:36 -0700, Mike Martinet
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Peter Hayes wrote:
> > >
> > > On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 17:58:09 GMT, "Bryant Charleston, MCSE"
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > <snip>
> > > > I hadn't been paying much attention to their ".NET"/Activation
plans, but
> > > > thanks to the enlightenment of this link and thread, I'll start
keeping an
> > > > eye on it now. I can see that it's implementation will probably
irritate
> > > > more than a few people!
> > >
> > > It might irritate most people in the short term, but like a lot of
other
> > > things, after a while Joe Public will accept it as the norm and go
along
> > > unquestioningly with it.
> > >
> > > A few years down the line "free" software will be just a memory in the
> > > minds of the oldies who will regail stories over the table at coffee
break.
> > >
> > > I think this is their game-plan. Suffer the anger of the small
percentage
> > > who understand what's going on for the longer term advantages of
> > > reinforcing the monopoly.
> > >
> > > Peter
> >
> > I have to disagree. This is all purely speculation, but from what I
> > know of non-technical people, they want to use computers like they use
> > TVs, VCRs or toasters. And although a lot of people will pay a cable
> > bill, they won't pay a per-use charge to record a sitcom or heat up a
> > poptart.
>
> Pay-per-view is being pushed hard by Sky television in the UK. I've no
idea
> how successful they are, but they started with PPV boxing matches at a
> tenner a time, and have now moved on to football (soccer) matches. So
> presumably Joe Soap is paying up.
>
> > Software has been largely invisible for these people - they
> > buy a PC from a department store, everything's on it, they plug it in,
> > sign on to AOL and they're done. They WILL NOT put up with constantly
> > re-registering something that in the past just kept working. Most
> > people don't NEED computers like they need toasters or refrigerators.
> > They'll go back to (or stick with) older software or they'll stumble
> > onto someone who'll introduce them to Open Source. I've said it before,
> > and I'll say it again, .NET/Whistler will help Linux if they're even
> > marginally annoying. Most people don't think in terms of software and
> > OSs. They just want to email, get sports scores, download porn, etc.
> > If MS makes it even slightly more difficult to do these simple things
> > they'll see large-scale defection. Maybe not TO Linux, but definitely
> > AWAY FROM XP.
>
> I suspect XP is aimed more at the professional market where Gates knows
> there are a great many IT managers and executives who will install the
> latest and "greatest" from MS no matter what.
>
> Then there is always the juicy prospect of the .NET service pack. Service
> packs for current MS OS's and Office products may well include a
> registration requirement which will ensnare the unsuspecting customer into
> a .NET pay-as-you-go cycle.
>
> Peter
Aw crap! Looks like the old 'Ivory Tower' syndrome all over again!
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