Linux-Advocacy Digest #57, Volume #33 Sat, 24 Mar 01 14:13:06 EST
Contents:
Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for prime
time? (Simon Brooke)
Re: Linux dying (Chad Everett)
Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for prime
time? (Simon Brooke)
Re: GPL Like patents. (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Linux @ $19.95 per month (T. Max Devlin)
Re: German armed forces ban MS software <gloat!> (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for prime
time? (Simon Brooke)
Re: What is user friendly? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Unix/Linux Professionalism (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Kulkis not Chad, Gates (was Re Unix/Linux Professionalism) (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Linux dying ("Chad Myers")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Simon Brooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for
prime time?
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.lang.java.tech,comp.os.linux.development.apps
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:00:49 GMT
on Friday 23 March 2001 23:23, Charles Lyttle wrote:
> Flacco wrote:
>>
>> > More info is needed. How big is your data base? How many concurrent
>> > accesses do you need to support? What are the skills of the
>> > maintainer?
>>
>> Small to medium DB - 50-100 tables, many with a few dozen records for
>> lookups, some with a couple tens of thousands for primary tables, and
>> several with hundreds of thousands or maybe a million or two records
>> for detail-type records.
>>
>> Concurrent accesses - light to medium use. I would suspect maybe a
>> hundred or so concurrent users - of those, maybe fifty would be
>> involved in operations that update the DB off and on.
>>
>> Maintainer skills - well, that would be me - like I said, I'm fairly
>> to Linux/Apache/etc, but have some experience in NT/IIS/etc., both
>> administration and programming.
>>
>> I'm trying to get an idea of what people are using to build web-based
>> applications, and how their tool choices work for them.
> Sounds like you are at the low end of wanting to contact the
> commercial vendors and see what they have to offer. Make sure you have
> a good business analysis in hand and don't let them talk you into
> changing your business to meet their software. To me it sounds a
> little large for mySQL, but i've seen postgres that big.
Depends what you mean by concurrent users.
If you have 100 users all hitting the same server in the same second,
maybe you have a problem. If you have 100 users with different database
login identities using the server at the same time, then my connection
pooling system would require 100 real database connections. That raises
two problems, neither insuperable. The first is that Postgress compiles
out of the box for a max of 32 concurrent real database connections,
and you have to tuns something in the compile-time config to get more;
the second is that each real database connection consumes a certain
amount of real memory. I *think* you'd easily get 100 on a 256Mb box,
but I'm not certain.
Of course if your 100 users share a smaller number of login identities
then my connection pooling system would be able to (safely) share
connections, provided not everyone hit the database in the same second.
But as to whether postgres can handle databases this size, the answer
is yes and much bigger. The point at which you might consider switching
to Oracle at the back end is the point at which you need (for example)
to take backups without taking the database offline. Oracle is a very
good database, but so is postgres and postgres is a lot easier to
administer.
> Any postgres users have some input? How about scripts, etc. to work
> such a system?
The joy of JDBC is that you don't need anything special to make the
system work. Here, however, is a quick'n'dirty backup script
#!/bin/bash
#########################################################################
#
#
# dbbackup.sh
#
#
#
# Purpose: Dump all databases to backup media.
#
#
#
# Author: Simon Brooke
#
# Created: 1st February 1999
#
# Copyright: (c) 1999 Simon Brooke. All rights reserved.
#
# $Revision: 1.4 $
#
# $Date: 1999/04/09 13:58:12 $
#
#
#
#########################################################################
if [ $USER != "postgres" ]
then
logger -s "ERROR: $0 must be run as user postgres!"
exit 1
fi
DUMPDIR=/mnt/dumps
if [ -d /usr/local/pgsql/data ]
then
DATADIR=/usr/local/pgsql/data # Standard postgres install
else
DATADIR=/var/lib/pgsql # RedHat install
fi
PATH=/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/bin:/sbin:/usr/local/pgsql/bin
pid=`/sbin/pidof postmaster`
echo "attempting to kill postmaster:"
kill -TERM $pid # kill the supposed postmaster
# process....
killall -TERM postmaster # Just to make sure....
sleep 10
echo "restarting postmaster in local-only mode:"
postmaster -S -D$DATADIR # restart it not listening on
# the socket
sleep 1 # wait for it to get started
pid=`/sbin/pidof postmaster`
echo "now dumping databases:"
cd $DATADIR/base
for db in *
do
if [ -d $db ]
then
echo "Now dumping $db"
pg_dump $db > $DUMPDIR/$db.dump
echo "Now vacuuming $db"
echo "vacuum;" | psql $db 2>&1 | grep -v 'DEBUG'
else
echo "ERROR: $db: not a directory?"
fi
done
echo "now killing the local-only postmaster..."
kill -TERM $pid
killall -TERM postmaster
sleep 10
echo "...cleaning up shared memory ..."
ipcclean
echo "...and restarting socket listening postmaster"
# This next block is copied from /etc/rc.d/init.d/postgresql
# Any changes should be kept in sync with that
# but remember this one runs as postgres!
postmaster -i -p 5432 -D$DATADIR > /var/log/pgsql &
echo "Return value was $?"
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
'graveyards are full of indispensable people'
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chad Everett)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dying
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:01:24 GMT
On Sat, 24 Mar 2001, Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:99hefe$tsa$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >>Red Hat has started charging for their update services
>> >>in a futile attempt to actually make money sometime in
>> >>the next 10 years.
>>
>> Redhat has just been reported to have "broken even" for the last quarter,
>> and thus to have exceeded market expectations[1].
>
>They still lost $600,000 this quarter. It boils to $0/share but they
>still lost money. There was no profit.
>
>Oh yeah, and this:
>
>"Shares of Red Hat have lost 91 percent of their value since
> reaching its 52-week high of $64-1/16, while the Nasdaq
> Composite has lost 62 percent in the same period."
>
Since Microsoft has lost about 52% of its value since reaching
it 52-week high of 115 (about one year ago), you are probably
not suggesting that these stock values are much of an indication
of the health of the company. Right?
------------------------------
From: Simon Brooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for
prime time?
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.lang.java.tech,comp.os.linux.development.apps
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:06:41 GMT
on Thursday 22 March 2001 11:10, Paul Colquhoun wrote:
>
> Unless you need any of the advanced features of PostgreSQL,
> then mSQL or MySQL would be faster.
This is a myth. In real world systems, except where both
(i) the majority of queries hit single tables only *and*
(ii) the proportion or read to writes is high to very high,
Postgres outperforms MySQL. See e.g.
<URL: http://www.phpbuilder.com/columns/tim20001112.php3>
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
'graveyards are full of indispensable people'
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: GPL Like patents.
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:08:09 GMT
Said Roberto Alsina in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
>T. Max Devlin wrote:
>
>> Said Roberto Alsina in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu, 22 Mar 2001
>> [...]
>>>Stupid, potty mouth, and snob.
>>
>> Even that part wasn't worth responding to, but I wanted you to know I
>> read your response.
>
>Stupi, potty mouth, snob, and a chicken.
Guffaw.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:08:10 GMT
Said Austin Ziegler in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
13:15:27 -0500;
>On Fri, 23 Mar 2001, T. Max Devlin wrote:
>> Said Austin Ziegler in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Wed, 21 Mar 2001
>>> On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, T. Max Devlin wrote:
>>>> Show me a more
>>>> moderate opinion than the one I have, and I'll adopt it.
>>> You've been shown significantly more moderate positions than you have.
>> I'm afraid you're in error. If this were the case, I'd have adopted
>> them. QED
>
>Not QED at all. The problem is that you've redefined your extremist
>(and illogical) point of view as "moderate." The reality is that you
>aren't in touch with reality.
And you should know, being the Grand High Master of Reality, eh?
>>> For the most famous one, you might even want to look at ESB. Your
>>> obvious and stated hatred for anything not-GPL demonstrates no
>>> moderation at all.
>> Spoken like a true extremist.
>
>I'm reporting facts -- and I'm an extremist for it?
You are an extremist for calling it that.
>If I really thought
>you were anything other than a fool, I'd take the time to go through
>and find your messages where you've demonstrated exactly what I just
>said above. Of course, you'd still lie and shift around it.
No, I'd hang my head and admit that I'm a twelve year old retard who
trolls Usenet. Christ, get a grip. I'm a moderate, you're an
extremist, and so you get worked up and start impugning my intelligence
and my integrity. Big surprise.
(BTW, I'm a 37 year old network manager who *posts* to Usenet.)
>>>> I am trying to use the term "free software" to communicate; obviously
>>>> the fact that my definition differs from what the FSF less strictly
>>>> uses, but it isn't a political issue with me so much as a rational one.
>>> Rationality is not one of your strong suits; at least you've never
>>> managed to demonstrate it on Usenet.
>> I'm far better at being reasonable than I am at being rational, that
>> much is true.
>
>You've not managed reasonability, either, so this claim of yours is a
>null value statement.
Of course, how could I forget? The Grand High Master of Reality is also
the Honorary Guardian of Reasonability. A thousand apologies, your
magniloquence.
>>> Communication is probably your
>>> weakest skill: you've managed to confuse even the most basic of
>>> matters.
>
>> As if I would for a moment believe you had a valid ability to critique
>> the communication skills of anyone you disagree with. Sorry, I won't
>> credit you with that much integrity until there is some reason to
>> believe you possess it.
>
>I possess it. I just tire of arguing with someone who is a committed liar
>and a fool.
I'd thought you'd provide more of a challenge, honestly. Its not very
entertaining when you fold so easily.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:08:11 GMT
Said Russ Allbery in comp.os.linux.advocacy on 23 Mar 2001 00:36:09
>In gnu.misc.discuss, T Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> Said Russ Allbery in comp.os.linux.advocacy on 22 Mar 2001 00:41:38
[...]
>> In comparison to the rampant misrepresentations others have made, I
>> can't see how my trivial ignorance is at all important, let alone worth
>> noting.
>
>The definition of "free software" goes to the heart of the reason for the
>FSF's existence. It's the name of the foundation. By saying that their
>definition is vague and involves an umbrella over a bunch of different
>things, you're casting doubt on the entire foundational purpose of the
>organization. I hardly consider that trivial. I think you were doing
>them a real disservice by your representation of their position.
I think they undermine their position themselves far more by considering
public domain software or BSDL to be 'free software' in the way GPL
software is free. I'm a bit shocked, actually, to find that they do so.
>>> By stating that you don't read their web pages and then making
>>> statements about what they say and believe, you're implying at least to
>>> me that you're just making things without even a basic attempt at
>>> research.
>
>> I don't understand what your problem is.
>
>My problem is that you appear to be saying stuff off the top of your head
>that's inaccurate, and you get huffy and defensive when people try to
>correct it.
Welcome to the human condition. I'll apologize for it as soon as I
don't have to deal with it myself from every other goober on the planet.
>When people suggest that if you do a modicum of research in
>the area you're expounding on you could avoid misrepresenting other
>people's positions, you get aggressively defensive. That attitude offends
>my sense of fairness. Disagree with people all you want, but I think we
>all owe our compatriots in debate a basic level of honesty, research, and
>accuracy concerning their positions.
When I have any slight reason not to suspect the honesty and accuracy of
someone's position, I think you will find I'm the picture of civility
and deference. I simply cannot apologize for finding boors to be
boorish, I'm afraid.
>> I read the FSF's web pages, years ago; I'm not their spokesman, just
>> someone correcting some obvious fallacies about the GPL.
>
>I'd think you'd want to regularly review the largest body of available
>discussion and interpretation of the GPL if you wanted to argue "obvious
>fallacies."
Well, its either spend my time reading that, or spend my time pointing
out obvious fallacies (which it does not require reading that to notice
or correct.) So how exactly have you responded to my comment that this
specific matter is relatively trivial?
>In-depth discussion of the GPL without reference to the goals
>behind it, the intentions of the author, and the interpretation of the
>author seems rather pointless to me given that the GPL is a political
>instrument. If the GPL were a purely technical document, I could see the
>argument for a context-free discussion of it, but it's not.
I'm afraid it is. Legal texts are far more context-free than any
technical document ever was.
>> You're implying there is some grave and telling difference between their
>> position and my opinions, and there's not.
>
>If you do not believe that BSD-licensed software is free software, there
>is a *drastic* and *grave* difference between your stance and that of the
>FSF and RMS.
No, only a difference in our wording. They use the term 'copy-left', I
think, for what I believe is "free software". But that's only a
metaphorical idea on my part. It is apparent that I'll have to
generally adopt their terms when discussing the matter with others.
Which means I will talk only about copy-left software, as I simply can't
consider BSD software to be "free", considering how many billions Gates
made on bits and pieces of it.
Ironically, I could well end up as the "anti-John Dyson", ranting on and
on about how it is deceitful and dishonest to call BSDL "free". But
apparently I have more sense than that.
Thanks for your time. Hope it helps.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:08:12 GMT
Said Roberto Alsina in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
[...]
>> Not a good enough reason, I'm afraid.
>
>Not good enough for you? I know that already. It is good enough for
>honourable men, though.
Apparently, you have no authority to speak for honorable men, I'm
afraid.
[...]
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux @ $19.95 per month
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:08:12 GMT
Said Marada C. Shradrakaii in comp.os.linux.advocacy on 24 Mar 2001
>>
>>You're forgetting about the Win2K mouse cursor drop-shadow.
>
>I don't think that's a new idea. I seem to recall trying a GWM (old window
>manager) theme that offered a big triangular mouse pointer with a pattern
>imitating a drop-shadow.
Well, see, that's the thing. It doesn't *imitate* a drop shadow. It's
not like the mouse pointer is bigger, but part of it is painted to look
like a shadow. The effect is much more expensive (in terms of
processing resources) than that; it actually has a drop shadow.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,soc.singles
Subject: Re: German armed forces ban MS software <gloat!>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:10:50 GMT
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sat, 24 Mar 2001
06:04:28 -0500;
>"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>>
>> Said Aaron R. Kulkis in alt.destroy.microsoft on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
>> >"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Said Aaron R. Kulkis in alt.destroy.microsoft on Thu, 22 Mar 2001
>> >> >Chad Everett wrote:
>> >> [...]
>> >> >The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club.
>> >> >
>> >> >The second rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club.
>> >>
>> >> Obviously, Aaron really liked this movie. I suppose nobody has to
>> >> really guess why.
>> >>
>> >
>> >Yes...I did like it. And it just showed up on cable last night, to
>> >remind me of exactly WHY I liked it.
>>
>> [...vague hypothesis justifying schizophrenia as a healthy mental
>> state...]
>
>I never said anything of the sort. I merely said that YOU CAN
>LEARN from them.
>
Followed by a vague hypothesis justifying schizophrenia as a healthy
mental state. Regardless, the only think one can learn from
schizophrenics is what neurobiological deficiency causes their aberrant
behavior.
>> >In fact...if you look in life, practically everyone you know who is
>> >really successful...does exactly that. One of your identities is
>> >T. Max Devlin, USENET poster. I'm sure that you have a whole host
>> >of other identities which you quickly transition between throughout
>> >the day. In some situations, you are Mr. Devlin, technologist.
>> >When you go home, you become "Daddy". When you go to your parents
>> >house, you revert to "[some other name] son of [mom] and [dad]"
>>
>> If you confuse your *role* with your *identity*, Aaron, you need to go
>> see a psychiatrist.
>
>You need to dare to budge away from your comfort zone.
You need to see a psychiatrist, and I mean that seriously, Aaron, not as
a simple Usenet flame.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: Simon Brooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux + PostgreSQL + Apache + JDBC + Tomcat JSP / Servlets: Ready for
prime time?
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.lang.java.tech,comp.os.linux.development.apps
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:12:46 GMT
on Thursday 22 March 2001 09:08, Flacco wrote:
>
> In the past, I've used NT/VB/IIS/ASP/MTS/SQLServer for web apps. I'm
> a recent Linux convert, and would like to look into using
> Linux/Apache/Tomcat/JDBC/PostrgreSQL for some future projects.
>
> From what I see so far, I like it conceptually, but I wonder how this
> combination performs in the real world, in terms of speed and
> reliability, on modest hardware (say, dual P700's with 256MB).
Don't know about that sort of hardware. Performs fine on our single
processor Pentium II/300 with 128Mb... ;-)
Actually we also have a dual PII/300 with 256 megs on which we run all
the above plus Oracle, and that performs fine too.
> I don't want to invest a lot of time in this kind of environment if
> there are performance problems under load, if services stop running
> unexpectedly, if ports mysteriously shut down, etc. etc.
Mysterious shutdowns are a Micro$loth habit. You will have to push a
Linux box *very* hard before anything falls over.
> Would you recommend replacement implementations for any of the
> components I've listed to make the environment more reliable?
No, tomcat/postgres makes a very solid engine.
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
'graveyards are full of indispensable people'
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,soc.singles
Subject: Re: What is user friendly?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:21:54 GMT
Said Quantum Leaper in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sat, 24 Mar 2001
>"." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
[...]
>Major problem is losing the Hardware related and a minor problem something
>that is software related, atleast in my book.
That's a bit simplistic, but I think we can all understand it.
>> No OS is magic and able to handle all known hardware problems, but holy
>> shit.
>>
>True but alot of Linux advocates seem to think Linux is 'magic'.
No, you have it backwards. Linux advocates think Linux is good
software. Windows is 'magic' in comparison, because no scientific
knowledge is sufficient to guess how it's going to crash, today. Linux
isn't magic, because its bugs or failures are repeatable and verifiable,
whereas Microsoft's are non-repeatable, semi-random, and entirely
deniable. Its apparent that being proprietary is not sufficient to
produce such bad code; it must, logically, be a matter of outrageously
bad design (if it can be said to be "designed" at all; the bolting and
clipboard assembly of MS software doesn't leave much room for design.)
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Unix/Linux Professionalism
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:23:09 GMT
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in alt.destroy.microsoft on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
>J Sloan wrote:
>>
>> "." wrote:
>>
>> > > a) I would expect that you are as capable of finding out about Todd
>> > > Needleham as much as anyone else; certainly you don't expect Aaron to
>> > > keep private records. So if you want very badly to get an URL, I'd
>> > > suggest plunking the name into some search engines. I haven't a clue
>> > > whether you'll find anything, but then I'm not the one that supposes
>> > > there's some convenient evidence that will conclusively prove anything
>> > > either way.
>> >
>> > I did a search on google and deja for 'Todd Needleham', but nothing came up
>> > at all on google (three links for 'needleham')
>>
>> I think you want "Needham", not "Needleham".
>>
>> jjs
>
>Correct. I screwed up the spelling.
Oops, I thought it was me.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Kulkis not Chad, Gates (was Re Unix/Linux Professionalism)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:28:46 GMT
Said Aaron R. Kulkis in alt.destroy.microsoft on Fri, 23 Mar 2001
02:49:18 -0500;
>Chad Everett wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:28:56 -0700, Michael Vester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >WesTralia wrote:
>> >>
>> >> "." wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > In comp.os.linux.advocacy WesTralia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > Starting to sweat, WinTroll? Aaron, you are a clown who got disconnected
>> >> > > from his rubber nose. Sad.
>> >> >
>> >> > Hes not a wintroll, dipshit. Hes a 'penguinista' or something.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> He posts all day from a Win98 box and does everything in his power to
>> >> make UNIX users look stupid.
>> >>
>> >> That's my definition of a Wintroll, what's your definition?
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> -wt
>> >
>> >Aaron has explained many times that the header on his mailer is a fake.
>>
>> Yes, he has explained that many times. Saying it over and over does not
>> make it true. It is very clear at this point that his claim is, in fact,
>> a lie.
>
>it's a simple matter of replacing the identity string in the netscape source
>code, and then re-making the program.
>
>
>Those that doubt the ease with which this can be accomplished are barking
>up the wrong tree.
I don't think anyone here doubts the ease with which it can be
accomplished, and many are familiar with the necessary technique. That
doesn't make it any less of a lie, Aaron, for you to say you've done
this, when apparently that is a fabrication. Simple as it may be,
there's not even a smidgeon of a hint of a reason to believe you when
you say you've already done it. Not anymore.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: "Chad Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dying
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 18:22:17 GMT
"Chad Everett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Sat, 24 Mar 2001, Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:99hefe$tsa$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> >>Red Hat has started charging for their update services
> >> >>in a futile attempt to actually make money sometime in
> >> >>the next 10 years.
> >>
> >> Redhat has just been reported to have "broken even" for the last quarter,
> >> and thus to have exceeded market expectations[1].
> >
> >They still lost $600,000 this quarter. It boils to $0/share but they
> >still lost money. There was no profit.
> >
> >Oh yeah, and this:
> >
> >"Shares of Red Hat have lost 91 percent of their value since
> > reaching its 52-week high of $64-1/16, while the Nasdaq
> > Composite has lost 62 percent in the same period."
> >
>
> Since Microsoft has lost about 52% of its value since reaching
> it 52-week high of 115 (about one year ago), you are probably
> not suggesting that these stock values are much of an indication
> of the health of the company. Right?
Well, considering MS just endured persecution from the government,
their stock is doing quite well. They are still making profit,
revenue is high, they still beat investors estimates, they have
met analysts expectations for earnings all but one quarter in their
public trading life.
When the NASDAQ is down, they're typically up.
Compare that with Red Hat, who considers it a major acheivement if
they only lose x amount vs y amount. Meeting analysts expectations
consists of not losing as much as normal.
And we won't even go into market cap. That $52 that MS has is
after dozens of splits.
-c
-c
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