Linux-Advocacy Digest #9, Volume #34 Sat, 28 Apr 01 06:13:06 EDT
Contents:
Re: Aaron Kookis: over 340 posts in 6 days! (GreyCloud)
Re: Windows is a virus (GreyCloud)
Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world: (GreyCloud)
Re: Microsoft hit new security 'level' :-) (GreyCloud)
Re: Microsoft hit new security 'level' :-) (GreyCloud)
Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare? (GreyCloud)
Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare? (GreyCloud)
Re: Windows 2K is crappy: a couple of examples (GreyCloud)
Re: Windows 2000 - It is a crappy product ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Windows 2000 Rocks! ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Why do Win advocates suck? Part 1 ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Pete Goodwin is in good company ("Edward Rosten")
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Purpose of advocacy newsgroup (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Pete Goodwin is in good company ("Edward Rosten")
Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world: (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world: (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world: (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare? ("Erik Funkenbusch")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Aaron Kookis: over 340 posts in 6 days!
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:13:11 -0700
Terry Porter wrote:
>
> On Fri, 27 Apr 2001 14:14:52 GMT, chrisv <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter) wrote:
> >
> >>Dunno, but chrisv the infamous Wintroll is well on his way to
> >>equaling Aarons posting score,but the main difference is that Aarons
> >>are entertaining, yours arent.
> >
> > Wow, two lies in one sentence! Is that the only way you feel you can
> > win?
> Is there a competition?
> Im responding to your methods, which I think are poor form.
>
> >
> > The occasional opinion that you don't like does not make one a
> > "Wintroll",
> Please allow me to be the judge of who I believe is a Wintroll.
>
> > something which in fact I am clearly not.
> Not that I've noticed.
> You also post from Windows, why is that ?
>
> > In fact I'd bet
> > the farm I've posted more anti-MS posts
> So what, Ive never posted anti Windows stuff, on Windows newsgroups,
> does that make me a Windows Advocate?
>
> > as anti-Linux. Also, I am
> > clearly NOT "on my way to equaling Aaron's posting score."
> >
> Time will tell.
>
> --
> Kind Regards
> Terry
> --
> **** ****
> My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
> 1972 Kawa Mach3, 1974 Kawa Z1B, .. 15 more road bikes..
> Current Ride ... a 94 Blade
> ** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
You've got a point there! Why are WinTrolls posting here? Go over to a
MS ng and try posting how bad MS is... the flames are higher than
gasoline thrown on a barbeque!
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows is a virus
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:14:53 -0700
The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote
> on Thu, 26 Apr 2001 12:40:16 -0400
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >Matthew Gardiner wrote:
> >>
> >> Andy Walker wrote:
> >>
> >> > What is the technical term to describe a virus?
>
> [snip for brevity: Windows=virus]
>
> >> Windows isn't a virus. A virus is small, compact,
> >>fast, efficient and does
> >
> >No...that's not part of the definition. In fact some viruses
> >are specifically designed to GROW without bounds and/or be inefficient.
> >
> >> the job it was orignally written for. Windows is the complete opposite!
> >
> >Windows does the job it was designed for: Corrupt user's data, and
> >keep the dimwitted moron's expectations so low that they are easily
> >impressed by a whole 36 hours of continous uptime.
>
> Actualy, I for one would think that Windows does a delightful job of
> making money for Bill & Company; the data corruption is merely a lovely
> afterthought ("Corrupt data? Why not try Norton Utilities, or
> the WindowsDefragmentationThingy! [*] Or wait for Microsoft to fix it
> next release...") which gives myriad aftermarket possibilities for
> bodges, hacks, and shims...
>
> :-)
>
> [.sigsnip]
>
> [*] this actually appears to be be from ExecSoft, if I'm not mistaken.
>
> --
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
> EAC code #191 11d:06h:25m actually running Linux.
> I am, you are, he, she, and it is, but they're not.
A very excellent point!
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world:
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:17:03 -0700
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "Glitch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >> Me thinks this is an advertising ploy from Microsoft. For sure Itanium
> > > ain't
> > >> going to be on the average desktop. In fact it will be promoted for the
> > > high
> > >> performance server market. 1GB is nothing on such servers these days.
> > >> The 1GB requirement is to show this is for a real power system. Of
> > >> course I could be completely wrong and Microsoft are admitting just how
> > >> crappy
> > > their
> > >> OS is and that 2GB will be a minimum requirement just to get the thing
> > >> ticking over. Surely Microsoft aren't that crap? :-)
> > >
> > > Not only that, but 1GB of memory costs about $200.
> > >
> > > If you want ECC, it's about $500. Not a big deal for anyone running a
> > > big server.
> >
> > Ever hear of the phrase "it's the principal of the matter"?
>
> If it were the principle (not principal) of the matter, then Linux wouldn't
> even exist, since it would need to have been written completely in assembly
> language to make it the most efficient piece of software on the planet.
OK! Now that you mention this... Is any of MicroSofts' O/Ses written in
assembler??
I don't think so!
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsoft hit new security 'level' :-)
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:19:09 -0700
The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote
> on Fri, 27 Apr 2001 05:17:47 -0400
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >Kelsey Bjarnason wrote:
> >>
> >> [snips]
> >>
> >> "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> news:9c8t75$qoe$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >>
> >> > .net, I would go for it, however, on one condition, I expect 24/7/365
> >> > uptime, and if there is any downtime, I expect atleast $100 for every
> >> > minute I cannot access my data. If my data is corrupted in anyway,
> >> > because of hackers, crackers etc. I expect a minimum compensation
> >> > of $10,000.
> >>
> >> Sounds good. Where can I find a Linux-based server that'll host my
> >> data and guarantee the above repayment rates when the data isn't
> >> accessible?
> >
> >No need....the data WILL be available
>
> Riiiiiight.
>
> And Microsoft will keep it reeeeeeeal secure. Especially if it's
> interesting data about one of their competitors.
>
> (They could rename one of the buildings at 1 Microsoft Way
> "The Ministry Of Data".... :-) )
>
> [.sigsnip]
>
> --
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random sarcasm and Orwellian reference here
> EAC code #191 10d:11h:53m actually running Linux.
> The EAC doesn't exist, but they're still watching you.
I went to 1 Microsoft Way,.... so Yuppie. Long time ago it used to
be just a nice green forest.
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsoft hit new security 'level' :-)
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:20:36 -0700
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9cbcsl$adm$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >> Now it says 'security fix files' have been infected with a virus. How
> > >> does this not substantiate my subject? What's an admin supposed to do?
> As
> > >> soon as they hear about a patch for a security bug they should download
> > >> and install. Next thing they know their systems are infected. It is
> hard
> > >> enough keeping up with Microsoft security patches (over 2 security bugs
> > >> per week in 2000 for Microsoft software - a record) without having to
> > >> check if they are infected as well.
> > >
> > > How is 2 bugs a week a record? I see dozens of patches a week to Linux.
> > >
> > > If you find keeping up with MS patches difficult, you must be literally
> > > livid about keeping up with Linux patches.
> >
> > Have you ever used UNIX before, because most people will know is that as
> > soon as a fix becomes available, the company/distro posts it, compared to
> > Microsoft where you have to wait 3 months for a service pack that is not
> > guaranteed to fix the problems you are facing. I would rather more
> > patches, than waiting in limbo for two months hoping that my server
> doesn't
> > crash because I was waiting for the next service pack to be released.
>
> What does that have to do with "keeping up" with the number of fixes?
>
> In any event, MS releases "hot fixes". There are quite a few of them, and
> they come out between service packs.
>
If one goes to MS site... do you get routed to these hot fixes???
> >
> > Matthew Gardiner
> > --
> > Disclaimer:
> >
> > I am the resident BOFH (Bastard Operator From Hell)
> >
> > If you don't like it, you can go [# rm -rf /home/luser] yourself
> >
> > Running SuSE Linux 7.1
> >
> > The best of German engineering, now in software form
> >
> >
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare?
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:25:18 -0700
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > I don't know what the new zealand dollar is compared to the US dollar,
> but
> > > can it be that bad? Win2k Pro is only $295 US.
> >
> > Sorry, but that's way overpriced! Solaris 8 is only $75 for the CD-ROM
> > set. And it's good for more than just one computer. They also provide
> > StarOffice 5.2. And then you have to add in the "Wife" constant! (What
> > is it good for?) Wasn't hard after I got it.
>
> Great, except that Solaris 8 only runs on a very small subset of hardware.
> If you're talking about Solaris on Sparc, you have to remember that Sun
> includes the price of the OS in their hardware.
Solaris 8 runs on a lot of Intel platforms. That's not a subset.
My IBM Aptiva wasn't supposed to run Sol 8, but it does!
This is a K6 processor based machine at that! Solaris 8 runs on a great
many Intel platforms.
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare?
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:29:33 -0700
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> > >
> > > "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:9c8ve5$t0q$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > Also take in account that the average salary in New Zealand is
> $22,000,
> > > and
> > > > most people have to prioritise, either by a ligit copy of Windows at
> $300
> > > > or pay the rent. Most people would rather pay the rent. Hence
> Microsoft
> > > > is the cause of the digital divide. Go into a store, take $300 off
> the
> > > > price of the computer and you have the price of the computer without
> > > > Windows, and in some cases, it could mean the difference of a computer
> > > > being sold or not.
> > >
> > > The OEM does not pay $300 (which I assume to be about $100 US) for
> Windows.
> > > They pay about US $45 in most cases.
> >
> > Gee! That's odd! How come at COSTCO in Seattle that Windows 98SE is $80
> > to just upgrade?? Mind you that COSTCO is a WHOLESALER!
> > Your figures don't add up!
>
> Wholesale of RETAIL products, not Wholesale of OEM products.
That is correct! What is the price now of Win98ME for one that builds
his own computer?
The $45 amount is bogus! If I pay $80 at Costco and others pay a little
higher, how does $100 OEM become lower???
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows 2K is crappy: a couple of examples
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 01:35:10 -0700
Terry Porter wrote:
>
> On Fri, 27 Apr 2001 17:05:09 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > "Craig Kelley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> > Actually I should have read on to further posts, as this question was
> >> > answered by Eric in a later post.
> >> >
> >> > When I posted this, I thought 'load and unload' allowed users to
> >> > install whatever drivers they liked.
> >> >
> >> > Aparently it only means users can load and unload drivers installed on
> > the
> >> > system by the superuser.
> >>
> >> If it's so benign, then how come it isn't the default?
> >>
> >> What's to stop someone from, say, unloading the SCSI driver?
> >
> > You don't usually give such rights to people you don't trust. What's to
> > stop someone from sending low-level commands to the burner and causing it to
> > lock the SCSI bus?
> Do you mean under Windows?
>
> Under Linux, I can burn cd's as a unpriveliged localuser, plus this CD burner
> is a IDE unit, Linux pretends its a scsi, tho there are is scsi hardware
> on this pc.
>
> I'm not sure I could do any damage to this system via the CD, as a local user.
>
You can't do any damage to a CD during a burn session.
No different than a Back Up or writing to tape!
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Kind Regards
> Terry
> --
> **** ****
> My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
> 1972 Kawa Mach3, 1974 Kawa Z1B, .. 15 more road bikes..
> Current Ride ... a 94 Blade
> ** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
--
V
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windows 2000 - It is a crappy product
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 10:57:34 +0100
> BTW - that is the ultimate Linux tag line! Those ten little words nearly
> sum it all up! "Remember - linux is free if your time is worth nothing."
> They way I see it, over the past couple years, I'm down about $1000.00
> just trying to "startx".
If you're too stupid to use a GUI config tool to set up your Linux box to
go in to X automatically, don't blame us.
-Ed
--
You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows 2000 Rocks!
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 11:03:08 +0100
>>> And up from the big iron like the S/390 in to clusters in the top 500.
>>>
>>> That must be an old list there - isn't it now high up the top 10 (
>>> isn't
>>> there a linux cluster at around number 4)?
>>
>>Sorry. I stand corrected.
>>
>>Well, enev better :-)
>
> Erm, I seem to have missed something here....clusters of what?
>
> S/390 nodes? Beowulf project? Transputer??
>
> I'm genuinely curious now.
I'm not sure. If you look in the top 500 you'll see clusters of Linux
boxes in there. They might be Alpahs.
IIRC, transputer was not a cluster, it was 7 tightly coupled processors.
-Ed
--
You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why do Win advocates suck? Part 1
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 11:06:35 +0100
>>> Can you point me to the vendor who will sell me LCDīs which manage
>>> 1800x1350 *each* without costing more than 4000$ each?
>> ^^^^^^^^^
>>
>> Yowee!
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you have any eyes left?
>>
>>
>> -Ed
>>
>
> My eyes are quiet good, thank you. But I run that resolution on 24"
^^^
Yowee! do you have any desk space left? :-)
> monitors. They are already expensive enough, but LCDīs with anything
> like that are about $5000 each in germany, what I think is a little too
> much.
Definitely. A 17" TFT moniter was the limit of my budget.
> Still Todd thinks his setup would somehow impress. In reality itīs just
> a toy, befiiting his OS. Dual Head, yeah. He probably did not know that
> this works quite well in linux.
IIRC, the newest version of XFree supports dual head on 2 different cards
at once, and can give you a unified root window if the colour depths are
the same.
-Ed
--
You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Pete Goodwin is in good company
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 11:13:28 +0100
>> You claimed that the GIMP problem was a Linux problem. Whilst not a
>> lie, it was definitely an untruth, because it is simply incorrect.
>
> Still no cigar. I stated that Mandrake installed a printer and that The
> Gimp ignored it.
Which is untrue.
If GIMP ignored it you would see no output.
GIMP did _NOT_ ignore the printer. GIMP erroneously marked the data as
raw. Those are two entirely different things.
Now, here is a prefect example of you having posted something incorrect
to the newsgroup.
If you don't believe me, read all the pirinter FAQs and HOWTOS you can
find. Then you will know the truth.
-Ed
--
You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 11:56:17 +0200
"Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:MYqG6.2919$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9cb9kv$4vi$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:3ae8f365$0$21716$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> >
> > > When I think stability and reliability and uptime - I want to know
about
> > > unexpected downtime - scheduled reboots for hardware shouldn't count
> > against
> > > uptime calculations.
> >
> > They aren't, 99.999% reffer to unscheduale downtime.
>
> So they just schedule downtime after every crash and patch
> installation so they don't have to count it? Why shouldn't
> the measurement be of any downtime?
Patch installation, yes, is schedualed downtime. A crash, no.
Consider my computer, the only times it's down have been: power cut > UPS
can hold, hardware upgrade, and not all of them.
Scheduale downtime is usually meaningless when you are talking about OS
stability. Are you going to blame the OS because the computer need to be
re-located, or upgraded?
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Purpose of advocacy newsgroup
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 21:14:32 +1200
kosh wrote:
> A large part of the purpose of an advocacy newsgroup it to put all the
> garbage in one group to keep it from spilling over into the other more
> serious groups. You have to expect flames etc in these groups.
>
> Advocacy groups are intended for the vocal minority who often have nothing
> better then to yell at anyone they don't like. This is not an indication
> of the linux community it is an indication of those who want to just bitch
> about things.
>
> Mac, OS/2, windows, linux, unix etc advocacy groups all tend to be very
> harsh places. However much of the people here support linux I think are
> being paid by ms to do so. They did that to OS/2 to kill it off by
> pretending to be supporters they did more damage then trying to attack it.
>
> So in general take everything you see in this group with enough salt to
> choke you no matter if it is good or bad since a lie is easier to swallow
> surrounded by the truth.
>
To some degree, I agree with you, however, an advocacy group is to, 1.
debate the merits of <name> OS, in this case, Linux. 2. to persuade people,
through logical explainations why they should more to the applicable OS
being discussed by the forum. Yes, occasionally there are logical
discussions in regards to the lower-level workings of the Linux kernel,
however, 90% simpletons post broad comments on issues they know nothing
about. Take Hullo for example, a so-called manager who has an intellectual
capacity of a fish say Windows 2000 rocks, yet giving no indepth reasons on
why he holds to beliefs. Another example would be Erik Funkenbusch, a
person who claims that everything else is inferior to Windows, yet has
absolutely no experience what so ever using Linux, let alone UNIX, making
broad sweeping statements on issues he has no knowledge about, then
suddenly, he refuses to continue to further the conversation, thus the
conclusion can be made that he admits defeat. I admit I do not have all the
answers, and I don't always get things correct, however, at least when I
make a mistake, I have the guts to admit it.
There are two types of people in the advocacy world, logical advocates,
that take each piece of the OS apart, and analyse the good aspects of it to
advocate. Then there are the idiots, such as Hullo, that simply say,
"Windows 2000 Rocks" yet never goes into depth why is does.
Matthew Gardiner
--
Disclaimer:
I am the resident BOFH (Bastard Operator From Hell)
If you don't like it, you can go [# rm -rf /home/luser] yourself
Running SuSE Linux 7.1
The best of German engineering, now in software form
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Pete Goodwin is in good company
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 11:16:58 +0100
>> You were wrong. The Gimp was set up properly, but due to the design of
>> the printing properties sheet, it just beggs to be buggered up by a new
>> user. I would have made the same error as you if not for your story.
>
> I was _not_ wrong. I setup Mandrake to use an Epson style printer as
> default. The Gimp ignored this and my printer printed Postscript as
Gimp did not ignore the printer setting. It stupidly marked the data as
raw. Plain and simple.
> text. Only when I overrode the default in The Gimp did I get it to
> print correctly.
I'll take your word for this.
>> It defaults to printing postscript, which is *correct*.
>
> It is _wrong_ to print postscript on a non-postscript printer. You get
> loads of text but not a picture.
It is correct to send postscript to any printer under Linux. that is the
way the print system works. The filter then sorts it out. What is
incorrect is then marking the data as raw.
I'd like you to note that this is almost identical to the way printing
works under windows, but it is rather more transparent and versatile.
>> It just seems wrong becuase you can click on the happy little drop-down
>> list and select your printer. But doing so is *wrong*.
>
> Yet that's what I had to do to get it to work. So how is that _wrong_?
You could also change the pinter string and remove the raw flag.
-Ed
--
You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world:
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 21:18:01 +1200
Roy Culley wrote:
> In article <9c90jc$ts9$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/2/18505.html
>>
>> As quoted from the article:
>>
>> "According to Microsoft's Windows Logo Program System and Device
>> Requirements, WinXP Personal (i.e., the consumer flavour) has a minimum
>> requirement of 64 megabytes, in line with Win98 (we do still mention it
>> then) and WinME. WinXP mobile is also specced to run in 64, while the
>> requirement for the Professional version is 128. You'll be wanting a gig
>> of RAM for the Itanium one, it says here."
>>
>> 1gig for Itanium! Does Microsoft just assume a business has a bag of
>> million dollar notes sitting in their store cubbord? 128MB for
>> Professional! and remember, thats Microsofts "recommended", x2, and you
>> get
>> the realistic amount of memory. Microsoft claimed 64MB for Windows 2000
>> Pro, when in the real world, you would need atleast 128MB to run at a
>> decent speed. When I Microsoft going to realise that if they want to
>> move the maximum number of people to this new platform, decrease the
>> system requirements by de-bloating and de-bugging it, or else the penguin
>> will bite your ass.
>
> Me thinks this is an advertising ploy from Microsoft. For sure Itanium
> ain't going to be on the average desktop. In fact it will be promoted for
> the high performance server market. 1GB is nothing on such servers these
> days. The 1GB requirement is to show this is for a real power system. Of
> course I could be completely wrong and Microsoft are admitting just how
> crappy their OS is and that 2GB will be a minimum requirement just to get
> the thing ticking over. Surely Microsoft aren't that crap? :-)
>
Need I wheel out the SUN Solaris example, and OS that is Itanium ready,
yet, the demands are similar to the 32bit x86 version.
Matthew Gardiner
--
Disclaimer:
I am the resident BOFH (Bastard Operator From Hell)
If you don't like it, you can go [# rm -rf /home/luser] yourself
Running SuSE Linux 7.1
The best of German engineering, now in software form
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world:
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 21:22:22 +1200
>> Me thinks this is an advertising ploy from Microsoft. For sure Itanium
> ain't
>> going to be on the average desktop. In fact it will be promoted for the
> high
>> performance server market. 1GB is nothing on such servers these days. The
>> 1GB requirement is to show this is for a real power system. Of course I
>> could be completely wrong and Microsoft are admitting just how crappy
> their
>> OS is and that 2GB will be a minimum requirement just to get the thing
>> ticking over. Surely Microsoft aren't that crap? :-)
>
> Not only that, but 1GB of memory costs about $200.
>
> If you want ECC, it's about $500. Not a big deal for anyone running a big
> server.
If 1 Gig of memory only costs $US200, thats around $NZ500, I would love to
know where you get your memory from!
My supplier, to get at least 1 gig, I would have to purchase 2 x 512MB
PC133 SDRAM Infineon Dimms at $549.00 wholesale, thats not including GST.
Considering Joe Business owner will have to pay $825 incl. GST for the
memory, 64bit Window will be an expensive offering.
Matthew Gardiner
--
Disclaimer:
I am the resident BOFH (Bastard Operator From Hell)
If you don't like it, you can go [# rm -rf /home/luser] yourself
Running SuSE Linux 7.1
The best of German engineering, now in software form
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Another example of Microsoft not living in the real world:
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 21:28:58 +1200
>> Ever hear of the phrase "it's the principal of the matter"?
>
> If it were the principle (not principal) of the matter, then Linux
> wouldn't even exist, since it would need to have been written completely
> in assembly language to make it the most efficient piece of software on
> the planet.
>
>
Did you ever remember the first year of programming at university when they
weighed up Assembler vs. Higher level languages such as C/C++? Since the
computer world began, there has always been a trade off between speed and
portability. NT was designed to be platform independent. However, Apple
didn't want to have anything to do with the PPC version, Digital Alpha
already had a great OS. MIP's had IRIX, like the Alpha, did not need
replacing, then there was the x86 platform where Microsoft had most of its
success.
As for assembly OS, the lower levels of BeOS were written in Assembly to
offer speed, however, to maintain a level of portability, the top layers
were written in C, as they had two versions to maintain, PPC and x86.
Matthew Gardiner
--
Disclaimer:
I am the resident BOFH (Bastard Operator From Hell)
If you don't like it, you can go [# rm -rf /home/luser] yourself
Running SuSE Linux 7.1
The best of German engineering, now in software form
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Importance, or lack, of Marketshare?
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2001 04:39:01 -0500
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > Great, except that Solaris 8 only runs on a very small subset of
hardware.
> > If you're talking about Solaris on Sparc, you have to remember that Sun
> > includes the price of the OS in their hardware.
>
> Solaris 8 runs on a lot of Intel platforms. That's not a subset.
> My IBM Aptiva wasn't supposed to run Sol 8, but it does!
> This is a K6 processor based machine at that! Solaris 8 runs on a great
> many Intel platforms.
Solaris 8 supports only a subset of NIC's, and doesn't seem to support
PCMCIA NIC's at all, such as the Xircom cards. Nor does it seem to support
any ISA NIC's.
It only supports a single ISDN Adapter, and only a handful of sound cards.
It doesn't support common multiport serial cards, such as the RocketPort and
it
It doesn't support many SCSI cards, such as the SIIG or similar cards, nor
does it seem to support EIDE cards like the Promise or Highpoint cards.
There are a boatload of video drivers unsupported, like the vast majority of
the Hercules cards or dual head Matrox G450. It doesn't support GeForce or
GeForce2, nor does it support 3dfx cards like the Voodoo3, 4 or 5. These
are *COMMON* cards, very common, and very pervasive.
Of course, if you're building a system, you can certainly build one to meet
the HCL, but if you've already got a system, chances are you can forget
about it being compatible.
------------------------------
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