Linux-Advocacy Digest #117, Volume #34 Wed, 2 May 01 10:13:05 EDT
Contents:
Re: Bought out by MS geeks... ("Tom Wilson")
Re: Linux is paralyzed before it even starts ("Osugi Sakae")
Re: Help: Bought out by MS geeks... ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Linux has one chance left......... ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Intel versus Sparc ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Help (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: My Favorite Linux APP!! (Richard Thrippleton)
Re: Performance Measure, Linux versus windows (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: My Favorite Linux APP!! (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: My Favorite Linux APP!! (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Linux has one chance left......... ("pookoopookoo")
Re: Bought out by MS geeks... (Brian Langenberger)
Re: Linux has one chance left......... (pookoopookoo)
test ("tomz")
Re: OT: Treason (was Re: Communism) (chrisv)
who know GPL? ("tomz")
Re: "Portability is for Canoes" ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Help: Bought out by MS geeks... (Matthew Gardiner)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Bought out by MS geeks...
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 12:10:58 GMT
"Donn Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Tom Wilson wrote:
>
> > Only the terminally stupid limit themselves to a single platform. There
> > really is a demand for porting out there. I've been offered more work in
> > that area than I could possibly accomplish in a lifetime and I'm, by no
> > stretch of the imagination, a guru.
>
> I try to lean as far toward FreeBSD, Linux, and Solaris (as well as
> DEC) as I possibly can, in that order. But at the same time, I have
> to take a realistic view of things. A lot of dream jobs I've applied
> for required a little Windows NT, 2000, and 98 in addition to unix,
> although unix was the primary platform. Waiting for configure scripts
> to finish on Cygwin32 can test one's patience, though, although I
> think it's a great compiler.
>
> I try to minimize my time on Windows platforms (all Windows), but I'm
> willing to bend a little to understand the other platforms. Java is
> pretty neat, because it minimizes portability problems between
> platforms. You do sacrifice some speed with Java, though, but I like
> Java's OO implementation. It seems like it's a little better
> abstracted than C++'s OO, because C++'s OO is like an OO klduge on top
> of C. But C++ is indeed very useful, and I prefer it over C a lot of
> times...
For any package that may need ported, C++ is vastly superior IMHO. Being
able to simply subclass an existing object and make minor,
platform-specific, changes is wonderful. Java is something I played with
only in a Web Applet/Toy sense. It does seem a lot cleaner and better laid
out than C++ as it should when you consider that it has no legacy to
support. Were it not for the speed issues, I'd use it more.
------------------------------
From: "Osugi Sakae" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux is paralyzed before it even starts
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 21:16:33 +0900
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In article <a2GH6.1179$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "MH"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> "> > 1. Why exactly is Linux a bad joke on the desktop? I have been
> running it
>> > as my desktop for close to two years now. It is a great desktop os,
>> > much better than Win98, for what I do. ymmv. So, why is linux a bad
>> > joke?
>
> It's not a joke at all. It is just not suited for most computer users in
> its present state.
> Of course you'll hear various octaves of mewling from the resident
> zealots over this.
I think this depends on what "most" computer users want to do with their
computers. Simple email and web browsing? Almost anything would be
sufficient, linux included. More specialized requirements require a bit
more thought.
>> I've been running it for 4 years, and I have had no problems what so
>> ever with either hardware support, or applications to suite my needs.
>
> Well, Linux really only offers a couple of 'suites', Star Office and
> Applix.
I don't think that is what he meant. Personally, I find 'suites' to be a
waste of time and space.
[snip]
>> > My windows machine at work is pretty much down for the count. It is
>> > so bad that my superviser actually asked me to try putting linux on
>> > it. See, they don't care what os I use, as long as I can get my work
>> > done. When windows loses most of its fonts, occasionally reboots for
>> > no reason, and requires expensive software to do what I can do with
>> > free software in Linux, they know I cannot get my work done.
>
> You've major problems. I've never lost fonts, so I can't say what could
> be causing this problem.
> I have never had spontaneous reboots either. The latter very well could
> be a hardware problem.
Yes, major problems. It is not fun. What are my options? Reinstall?
>> > (Funny thing is that I posted a while back saying that I was
>> > impressed with my win98j machine at work because it had survived
>> > everything I had installed on it (gimp, mozilla, perl, latex, emacs,
>> > a whole lot of windows "shareware" (trying to find a good text
>> > editor) etc.).
>> >
>> > Then it suddenly starts screwing up. Oh, well.)
>
> Gee, you say the machine 'survived everything you installed on it', then
> you go on to ...
> oh never mind. What's the sense.
That is why i called it "funny" - I thought it was doing well and a few
weeks later, it dies. What is the deal with windows?
>> XP is yet another product produced by the Spin Doctors at Microsoft.
>> The latest reports are that Windows XP will require 64MB of Ram,
>> minimum just to get it up and running, and as most people know,
>> Microsoft is always
> over
>> optimistic, so as a general rule, times the minimum requirement by 2.5,
>
> You could say the same about Linux and BSD. Ever read those
> requirements?
for which linux distro with which window manager? KDE is really slow on
my old laptop (p233 with 64meg). WindowMaker is faster than win98se.
--
Osugi Sakae
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Help: Bought out by MS geeks...
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 08:11:57 -0400
Donn Miller wrote:
>
> "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> > I would have said.."YOu know...Unix...THE PLATFORM THAT ALL OF OUR
> > FREAKING SOFTWARE RUNS ON, you ninny!"
>
> Response: "Great, I'll install Cygwin32 on all the NT machines and port
> the Linux code over right away."
Response: If you think our customers will accept a 2nd-rate solution.
>
> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
> -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: This seems to have reduced my spam. Maybe if everyone does it we
can defeat the email search bots. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux has one chance left.........
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 08:14:02 -0400
Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
> pookoopookoo wrote:
> >
> > > You use those deep, complex apps mentioned at the top of your
> > > missive, yet you're boggled by a /text/ editor such as joe or
> > > pico?
> >
> > They're no brainers because they're visual applications.
>
> Funny, although MS Paint was easy to use (and primitive), it's
> taken me quite awhile to get used to using PaintShop Pro and
> the GIMP.
>
> > > Your left hemisphere knows not what your right does.
> > > An obvious commisurectomy!
> > > Chris
> >
> > ??!
>
> A "commissurectomy" is a procedure sometimes used in treatment
> of severe epilepsy. The surgeon severs the nerve bundle that
> transfers information between the two hemispheres of the
> human brain. Each hemisphere then works on its own, apparently
> normally, but certain situations reveal that the right hand
> side is perceiving the world in a very different way from the
> left hand side.
Only when one side or the other is sedated with an IV drip into
the left or right corotid artery.
>
> Chris
>
> --
> Free the Software!
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: This seems to have reduced my spam. Maybe if everyone does it we
can defeat the email search bots. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Intel versus Sparc
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 08:15:37 -0400
Tom Wilson wrote:
>
> "T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Said Tom Wilson in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sat, 28 Apr 2001 15:48:27
> > >"Eddie Dubourg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >news:9c6r2n$26p$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >> > > Please, do you have any more valuable opinions you would like to
> share
> > >> > > about Linux or UNIX? We'd all love to hear more deep thoughts from
> > >the
> > >> > > "Enterprise Engineer" who doesn't know what a core dump is.
> > >> >
> > >> > I'm quite sure James Doohan and LeVar Burton know nothing about core
> > >dumps
> > >> > either.
> > >>
> > >> Unless its the warp core (dumped by 1701-D on many an occasion)
> > >
> > >Hmmm...And right you are!
> > >
> > >Seriously, what exactly IS an "Enterprise Engineer".
> >
> > "Enterprise systems" are what you get when you replace traditional
> > corporate backbone technology (mostly mini-computer based) with Unix
> > system or, if you're incredibly stupid, Microsoft systems. An
> > application like SAP or PeopleSoft are called 'enterprise-wide', and
> > thus an "enterprise engineer" is a technologist who is familiar with
> > such systems.
>
> I'm familiar with the terminology, actually. I just find such terms silly.
> The "Sanitation Engineer" as opposed to garbage collector quality of it.
> And, yes, I agree that applying a Microsoft Solution to a mission-critical
> backbone is "ill-advised" in most cases.
This is why most people who use the term to describe themselves
are...M$ droids.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
L: This seems to have reduced my spam. Maybe if everyone does it we
can defeat the email search bots. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Help
Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 00:25:58 +1200
rob ryan wrote:
> haha I need to find a copy of the gateway os for their microserver.. I
> have got a ex demo one that has a dead hard drive.. I think i can salvage
> the hard drive but i would really like to put some better apps onto the
> system, plus maybe a scsi card..
Sounds pretty bad. The only thing I can suggest is to contact Gateway and
see if they have the custom version of Linux on CD. As far as I know, the
Micro server doesn't use an intel based CPU, it uses a StrongARM CPU which
may or maynot cause some problems depending on your resorcefulness.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Thrippleton)
Subject: Re: My Favorite Linux APP!!
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 13:07:22 +0000
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Take your pick.
>
>Pan/Knode and many, many others.
>
>or how about slrn which has been hiding in V.9 releases for years.
>
>Most of the kde applets are 1.0-x releases...
>
>Come on already Terry, when is Linux going to put up instead of
>hiding?
>
>The Empire State building was built in less time than it takes for
>slrn to go gold at 1.0...
>
>How long is it going to hide?
>
>Flatfish
>
In short, it's just numbers. For open source software, 0.9 means "we
aren't confident it's _entirely_ bug free", 1.0 meaning "almost certainly no
bugs". For commercial software, 1.0 means "It might not be bug free, but
people like <Flatfish> (non-power users) won't buy it if it's 0.9". I
haven't found a single bug in slrn so far. It's all really just a matter of
how people are motivated, and hence how they present their work; the open
source hacker wants honesty and quality, the commercial coder wants to sell.
Richard
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Performance Measure, Linux versus windows
Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 00:34:43 +1200
Salvador Peralta wrote:
> The manager of Microsoft Premiere Support at IBM wrote some simple
> timing routines and compared performance between 3 linux kernels and
> w2k.
>
> I thought people here might be interested in the measure:
>
> http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-rt1/
>
> Novel concept... a post about something other than guns,
> trollfeeding, and taxes in cola.
>
Quite an interesting yarn, whilst CVS'ing I had a small read, and yes, it
does contridict Microsofts so-called NT vs. Linux findings.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: My Favorite Linux APP!!
Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 00:50:52 +1200
> Yep... The Linux world hides behind 1.0 -X versions of software for
> YEARS just so they can have an answer for the instability that Linux
> software seems to exhibit.
>
> Flatfish
>
Your true ignorance really shines through that post. The author of the
software could have chosen to go straight to 1.0, however, most people
subscribe to the philiosphy of: 0.1 first version, each 0.x has a minor
addition, bug fixes etc, however, x.x means there was a major revision of
code, and bug fixes. As with the case of Windows NT, which went from NT 4
to NT 5, thus showing that there was a major revision of code in the 5.0
release.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: My Favorite Linux APP!!
Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 01:14:02 +1200
>> > I'm sure some people will say this is a good thing, that products
>> > aren't
>> > being rushed to release before they're ready. On the other hand, it's
>> > a handy excuse as to why your product is unstable simply to never go to
> 1.0.
>> Have you found Linux software to be generally unstable Eric?
>
> Depends, really. I've found most window managers to be very unstable.
> There are a few that are quite good, but most are buggy at best.
>
> Star Office i've found to be quite buggy, as was Applix when I last used
> it (it's been a while).
>
> Generally speaking (with a few exceptions, such as TeX), the more complex
> a
> piece of software is, the higher the incidence of bugs and instability.
> To my knowledge, TeX (not LaTeX) is the only piece of generally available
> non-trivial software that can claim to be bug-free. (Knuth fixed the last
> bug many years ago and has some kind of reward if you find a bug).
>
> But in any event, the frequency of bugs is irrelevant to this
> conversation, which is that lots of Linux software sits behind 0.x version
> numbers for years.
>
I've been running StarOffice since version 5.0 and have never experienced
any problems with it. KDE 2.1.1 is extrememly stable, and I have just
upgraded to the latest KDE library (KDE 2.1.2), and it is even more stable
and responsive. For around 2 months I have been using Corel Photopaint, and
again, I have no problems. The program hasn't crashed, it is as reliable as
the Windows counterpart in everyway. So please, before you start bantering
on about Linux, run it for four to five years, then come back and comment.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
From: "pookoopookoo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux has one chance left.........
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 09:33:03 -0400
"Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:9cokr1$36a$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Port edit.com, because every Linux editor is FAR too complex and
> > bass-ackwards to be of any use to a regular user (like me)
>
> If you can' manage to use kedit, gedit, pico or xedit, then you shouldn't
> be using a computer.
>
> -Ed
Hehe, I did mean console editors. X is a different story, I think kedit is
perfectly suitable then (apart from some little problems cutting and
pasting)
------------------------------
From: Brian Langenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Bought out by MS geeks...
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 13:50:29 +0000 (UTC)
Donn Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
:> I just *LOVE* Windows software written by Unix programmers (NOT).
: Why? Are unix programmers somehow inferior to MS programmers? Oh yeah,
: unix programmers don't use Hungarian Notation! But seriously, if
: there's one thing I hate about unix programmers, it's that they are
: afraid to give variables meaningful names in programs. Most unix
: programmers will tell you they believe that you should make variable
: names as small as possible, i.e., you should create a variable names "f"
: instead of "fileName" or "file_name". That's just horse-crap, dude.
: Just because unix command names are short doesn't mean every variable in
: your code has to be 2 letters or less.
Egads. In general, variable names should be as small as possible, but
no smaller. If you only need a counter to walk through some loop,
"i" could be a fine choice. But if a variable has greater importance,
a more descriptive name is a must, if only to make it easier to
remember down the line. Heck, the Linux kernel itself is full of
names like "open_files", "mempages" and "clone_flags" which, while
cryptic, are both short yet descriptive enough to be useful.
If someone has to maintain code long enough, either the right
balance between length and description will be achieved or the
coder will go insane - either from too much typing or memory
overload ("what was the xyz variable for again?"). So, one can
only hope that the naming problem will remedy itself.
------------------------------
From: pookoopookoo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux has one chance left.........
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 05:52:12 -0400
>Well, I just ass|u|me|d that a woman would be more likely
>to include "poo" in a street name. A man would use a name
>like "Shit Meister" or "Buster Hymen".
Maybe I'm secure in my masculinity!! lol
Stay loose man.
------------------------------
From: "tomz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: test
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 21:54:26 +0800
------------------------------
From: chrisv <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,us.military.army,soc.singles
Subject: Re: OT: Treason (was Re: Communism)
Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 13:55:14 GMT
T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Said billh in alt.destroy.microsoft on Tue, 01 May 2001 18:18:57 GMT;
>>"T. Max Devlin"
>>
>>> >Get on a night live fire range with an infantry company supported by
>>> >anti-tank, mortar, and arty. It is violence of the first order. To say
>>it
>>> >is not, is simply naive and ignorant.
>>>
>>> Apparently, your intent is to so torture the term 'violence' as to make
>>> it useless. Congratulations.
>>
>>A few of the definitions from the dictionary on my desk:
>
>Ridicule me all you want, Bill, but dictionaries are for children, and
>other people who do not reasonably understand the words they are using.
Guffaw.
------------------------------
From: "tomz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: who know GPL?
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 21:54:57 +0800
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.linux,alt.os.linux,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: "Portability is for Canoes"
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 16:40:08 +0200
"Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> However, to take an application which has been developed for
> a single OS (e.g. Windoze [I use Windoze to cover all versions
> of that product]), and port it, is hideously difficult, because
> the authors generally use whatever calls they feel like. These
> calls are provided by the OS (one level of difficulty in portage),
> or by the compiler (another level of difficulty).
Correct, you are often have to make a choice between portable, and fast.
Being unportable means that you can take advantages of what your enviroments
gives you, being portable doesn't, and sometimes it can be a pain.
> In general, the philosophy of Microsoft is that "portability is
> for canoes". Therefore, unless one is learned in portability and
> designs one's code with portability as a feature, the port will
> be exceedingly difficult and expensive, and therefore much less
> likely to take place.
Not really. It doesn't takes that much to code protable code.
www.wxwindows.com, platform independent GUI, frex.
There are also platform independent libraries for networking, threading etc.
> This difficulty doesn't prevent one from rewriting the application
> from scratch (e.g. the GIMP), but of course that is also difficult
> for complex apps.
Extremely so.
A wise move would be to code most of the program platform independent, and
the parts that require speed or efficency, platform depended.
Usually it's 20% - 80% or 10% - 90%, btw.
> Historically, UNIX programmers are generally much more aware
> of portability than are programmers for other systems. Hence
> the proliferation of the porting of UNIX applications (nmap,
> the GIMP, gcc, X-Windows, yada yada yada) to various hardware
> platforms, and to the more advanced editions of Windoze.
Yes, because they didn't have a choice, not that long ago, if you wanted to
program for a Unix, you had to either go platform independent (using
abstraction libraries) or code for the Unix flavor you were using.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 16:43:25 +0200
"Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:zySH6.6169$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9cf54s$r2p$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > "Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:51CG6.1636$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >
> > > "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:3ae8f1ec$0$21761$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >
> > > <snip>
> > >
> > > > Well - the only claims for stability I make of W2K are simple:
> > > > I have these W2K machines - they have never crashed. They stay up as
> > long
> > > as
> > > > I leave them running. I don't know how better to claim uptime than:
> they
> > > are
> > > > always up. Whatever the history of other previous products might
be -
> > the
> > > > product I use today is reliable and stable. I know this because I
use
> it
> > > and
> > > > it is.
> > >
> > > And what, exactly do we do with our W2K boxes?
> >
> > Keep using them? XP is a big upgrade for desktop/workstations, not so
for
> > servers.
>
> Just from the commercial side of things, I don't see XP taking off for
quite
> a while. So many of these shops have just now upgraded to W2K. I think MS
> would have been better served to have given W2K a miss and just waited
until
> XP was done. The whole thing is more than a little strange when you
consider
> their past marketing efforts. It just doesn't make sense.
XP is currently aimed at workstations & desktops, the servers would come in
about a year afterward, I think
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Help: Bought out by MS geeks...
Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 02:02:44 +1200
MH wrote:
>
>> >> > Guys...my company has been bought out by a company dedicated to MS.
>> >
>> > Gee, I've got some ocean front in Nevada, real chea ....
>> >
>> > Get real.
>> >
>> What relivance has your snide comments have to do my original post?
>
> Are you asking me "what relevance -do- your snide comments ..."?
>
> Answer: None.
> I should have clipped your identification from the top as I do your sig
> from the bottom.
> (=
>
What real world experience do you have in terms of computer related
qualifications? because by the way you present yourself on this newsgroup,
you sound like a desperate, pimply faced 15 year old with a chip on your
shoulder, and feeling very insecure because you have finally realised that
you are not as bright as you pre-emptively thought you were.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
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