My intent was not to bash Debian. My anger is aimed at an *attitude*, not the distro. Debian is a fine distro for those it is aimed at (not me). It is not, IMO, a general purpose distro which is what Debian says it wants to be and certainly not newbie friendly. That is not bashing the distro but telling it like it is. It may be hurtful to some but the you can't go around in denial of a problem forever.
The point that I was trying to make was to counter the initial comment that Debian *always* works. Then was told that I *deserved* it for not having an more open system and the solution was to buy more hardware. Most users have computers from major OEMs. My case is far from unique. It is the norm. In fact most are worse off than I because they have laptops which tend to be even more proprietary. So the attitude that the world is wrong and Debian is right just does not cut it as far as I am concerned. I think the strategy that Debian is using is faulty if it wants to get more users. It is a good strategy if it wants to be open and free and advertise as such. They won't get it both ways until computers themselves are open and free, and I do not see that happening. Most users buy what gives the best value for the money and are not buying based on ideology. In many cases people just cannot afford to buy from System 76. My HP quad core Intel from Costco was at least $200 less than anything that I could get from anyone else. In most cases it was over $400. I *did* shop around. I was willing to compromise a bit, but am on a limited budget. This is a reality check and not an attempt to bash anyone. There are some things that you can change and some that you can't. Just saying something isn't going to make it become reality. Debian can say what it wants, but the proof will be if people actually find it user friendly and start using it in greater numbers. Telling someone that it *always* works is always going to bring out people who raise exceptions, just as saying that something cannot be cracked bring out armies of hackers to prove otherwise. This also illustrates that Debian folks just do not get desktop users and what they want. They do not want to install something only to be confronted with barriers. That is why Debian has become marginalised. and will continue to complain about sour grapes as other distros continue to leap frog them. It is *not* the users fault if you do not understand users and meet their needs. Roy Using Kubuntu 11.04, 64-bit Location: Canada On 19 April 2011 14:33, Jeremiah Bess <[email protected]> wrote: > This is getting to be an interesting thread. I can see what you are talking > about Ken about distro-bashing. But Roy brings up a good point: Where are > the distros that just work? I am finishing up a TDY 6 months away from home. > I came out with my 2 year old laptop with Win 7 and Backtrack dual booting. > I removed backtrack and installed my favorite distro (Mandriva which I use > at home on several computers). The speed and reliability of Mandriva were > not present on my laptop, and made me seriously reconsider why I used it in > the first place. I tried several other popular distros, SuSe, Ubuntu, etc, > but I just couldn't get the performance I wanted from any of them. > > I know Ubuntu is Debian based, but they seem to be two different beasts. In > the case of Markas, Roy, myself, and tons of other users searching for a new > distro, which ones are the ones that just work? > > Jeremiah E. Bess > Network Ninja, Penguin Geek, Father of four > > > On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 13:23, Ken Muller <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Not to be a dead horse, but arguing about which Linux distro is the best >> ends up with people simply going in circles. >> I've never installed a Linux distro that didn't do at least one thing >> well, and thats exactly what makes Linux what is...choice! >> There are those of us that love Debian and will always attempt to defend >> it, but if you've had problems with it then it's not the distro for you. >> Distrowatch.org is a great place to find a ton of information about most >> distros out there. You can even search based on what you are looking for, >> beginner, KDE, server, GNOME, secure, etc. >> Remember...some of us have had lots of trouble with Windows...not one >> beats us to death trying to convince us how great it is tho. >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Linux Users >> Group. >> To post a message, send email to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe, send email to [email protected] >> For more options, visit our group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/linuxusersgroup > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Linux Users > Group. > To post a message, send email to [email protected] > To unsubscribe, send email to [email protected] > For more options, visit our group at > http://groups.google.com/group/linuxusersgroup -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Linux Users Group. To post a message, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit our group at http://groups.google.com/group/linuxusersgroup
