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Norm S/V Bandersnatch Lying Julington Creek 30 07.695N 081 38.484W The fire triangle is dead, long live the fire quadrangle which adds the Ignition Energy to get the fire started. Others use chemical reaction but it isn't always such as an electrical fire. Once started, you're down the three legs to maintain it. If the Ignition Energy isn't removed, you may well have a rekindle. Avoid starting the fire in the place. Sometimes easier said than done but proper maintenance and safety precautions eliminate most fires before they begin. Norm - Agreed totally. Be prepared to respond quickly and accurately. Have adequate training and equipment. Norm - Agreed. That's why I created and installed the duct and fan to blow fresh air into my engine room - to enable me to "respond quickly and accurately". I think my next move will be to have a wired smoke alarm system that will sound an alarm everywhere on the boat loud enough to awaken everyone and indicate where the fire is. Do NOT add air to the engine room if theres a fire. You're only feed it more oxygen an increase the fire. Norm - Here I disagree. I believe that whether or not I blow fresh air into the engine room, or any other enclosed space, the fire will proceed at about the same rate. I believe it is more important to get to the heart of the fire quickly. In face, once the electricity is shut off to an electrical fire, the fire will be a less active smoldering fire where the primary problem will be smoke hiding the heart of the problem. Emergency stop all equipment. Isolate the engine room from fuel and electricity (remote shutoffs). Norm - Not necessarily all equipment. If underway safe navigation requirements may have priority, such as passing traffic, entering an inlet or passing through a tight or very active channel, the main engine may be left on. It is not likely that the engine itself is the fire problem. While I already have electrical shutoffs for the Main Buss, I do like the idea of an Emergency system to supply things such as emergency lighting, the ER venting fan, and the fresh water pump that would be useful in a fire situation. Switches outside the most likely fire spaces to control these devices would be used. Use the fire extinguisher or installed extinguishing system in the engine compartment. Give it a little time to work. Opening the hatch/door too soon could start the fire anew. Norm - For an electrical fire, fresh water would be my first choice because it penetrates well and is a very easy cleanup. Once the power is off, the insulation just smolders and is easily cooled off with water. Same for wood and insulation. I have watched boats burn to the waterline and sink due to an electrical fire that was not aggressively attended to. Since there is already plenty of air in the area opening a door/hatch will have little effect. Don't ventilate unless/until you're prepared to deal with a bigger fire. Instead, get more extinguishers or have a spray (not full stream) hose ready. Norm - Ventilation is necessary to comply with CT's Rule One, "respond quickly and accurately". I have to know where the fire is, be able to get to it, and to put it out. I can't see through smoke. I just don't buy the "make the fire room airtight and the fire will go out, open the doors and the fire will bloom" approach. One of the first things firemen do in a burning building is smash out the windows. Virtually all people die from smoke long before the fire cooks them. While waiting thirty seconds or so, do (minimum) Pan-Pan announcement. Norm - I will do nothing to deliberately attract the attention of cops unless absolutely necessary because their "help" can (and sometimes has) make the situation worse. I must be judicious in asking for help of all kinds. It is not just cops. I have also had problems made worse by well intentioned "Good Samaritans". Judgement is needed, and unfortunately, good judgement is learned by making bad decisions. That is just life. The trick is to start small so bad decisions result in small harm. Walk before running. If you are ever in a position to help someone the first concern is flotation for anyone in the water, then a line to any vessel drifting onto a violent grounding situation, like rocks in swell. Other than that, proceed deliberately, establishing communication first. Attempt to evaluate condition of the compartment before opening door (sight glass, porthole, etc. If you can't check first, be prepared when opening the door for flames to start up quickly and to have a fair amount of smoke exit. Norm - I agree completely. Dark smoke is incomplete combustion (oxygen starved fire). White smoke is complete combustion/steam. Norm - Perhaps this is most true in a house fire. On a boat some normally progressing fires can be very smoky. In my electrical fire the Styrofoam was very smoky with little flame. Electrical fires are also very smoky with little flame even though they are getting plenty of air. Diesel wicking up on something and burning can be very smoky like a oil lamp with the wick turned up too high. Use the hose to spray water. Turn the hose in a circular pattern. That will cut down on smoke and reduce the temperature of the room. It could reduce the temperature enough to extinguished the fire as the small spray droplets will absorb heat faster (than a full stream) by turning to steam (which itself can burn so be careful). Norm - Agreed. I have seen gasoline fires put out with a big fan spray of water just cooling the fire right out. Dewater, check for damage. Fix root cause. Reduce grog level. Norm - For me it would be: Dewater, stabilize everything, then Increase Grog Level to celebrate doing everything right and surviving a potential disaster. Repairs (including "Fix root cause.") tomorrow, including of course, a full report to our friends on the LIst for their forewarning. CT 30°24'43.07"N 88°34'1.90"W P.S. - Thank you CT, for such an intelligent and lively discussion. This is just the thing the List was created for.
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