>In this technique, notice that the hand is very, close >to the bridge.
>But, it is not correct to say that one gets a very >thin tone. My
>experience is that with current string tensions similar to >those of
>renaissance lutes, the results are not very satisfying. >There are current
>thoughts in which baroque lutes were strung with a >considerably less
>amount of tension that we now use. After all, lighter tension >strings
>make a set-up which is much less wear & tear on the baroque >instrument,
>considering that the overall tension is much less
I think for Toyohiko Sotoh to follow though with a recording on an
original instrument warrants some consideration and thought.
However don't forget that the French Baroque lute, is quite different
than the German Baroque lute, in design ( string length, size etc.) and
musical culture, and changing times.
The French Baroque lute was already finished, by the time the
German Baroque lute was in it's glory. Allot can happen in a 100 years
musically speaking!
It was the German Baroque lute that was left to fight it out with the
keyboard, and the French B lute was obsolete 100 years or so before.
Ed are you basing your theory on iconographical evidence? If so, Baron
very clearly states to play half way between the rose and the bridge, at
least for the German style. I think with less tension one could risk the
clashing of courses, when played with any forcefulness, some that would be
needed in 1750.
MT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Edward Martin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Michael Thames" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Greg M. Silverman"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Jon Murphy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 2:51 PM
Subject: Re: Neceffarie obferuations
> Michael,
>
> The fingers seen in most paintings of baroque lutenists are not a 90
> degree angle, but not as soft an angle as for thumb under technique. You
> are correct, in that the thumb is seen protruding towards the rose, and
> that is a position seldom seen in our times. Toyohiko Satoh has changed
> his technique, in following closer to what icongraphical sources show us.
>
> In this technique, notice that the hand is very, very close to the bridge.
> But, it is not correct to say that one gets a very thin tone. My
> experience is that with current string tensions similar to those of
> renaissance lutes, the results are not very satisfying. There are current
> thoughts in which baroque lutes were strung with a considerably less
> amount of tension that we now use. After all, lighter tension strings
> make a set-up which is much less wear & tear on the baroque instrument,
> considering that the overall tension is much less. Recent experiments
> have shown that one can get an astonishingly beautiful sound played by the
> bridge with a protruding thumb, at very low tensions. Case in point,
> listen to Toyohiko Satoh's Weichennberger CD. He plays on the bridge,
> with very low tension strings on an original 11 course lute by Grieff. It
> is definitely not a very thin tone. Also, he uses all gut with no metal
> at all on the strings. I am uncertain, but I think he uses only 70% of
> usual tensions, overall - maybe even as low as 60%.
>
> In order to make this situation (playing with technique shown on
> icongraphical sources) work, one needs a light tension. With heavier
> tension played very close to the bridge, one gets a brittle sound. But,.
> with slack strings, the results are very clear and beautiful.
>
> ed
>
>
>
> At 09:09 AM 7/22/2005 -0600, Michael Thames wrote:
>> The really strange thing is that most all thumb out, hand positions
>>shown in paintings show the fingers at a 90 degree angle to the stings,
>>and
>>I've never seen anyone play this way thesedays. If you try it whether on
>>gut or nylon one gets a very thin tone. Perhaps the trend in the early
>>1600's was towards a thin percussive tone?
>> MT
>
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