Just hang around folk guitarists. Low F#, 2nd fret, 6 string (or 12
string "6th course") to play a full D chord when "Dropped D" tuning of
the low E string is not being used. Same on 6 course lute, except when
"Dropped F" is used- (until the 7th course came along).
On 5/14/2015 3:12 AM, Martin Shepherd wrote:
Hi Sean,
There are lots of occurrences of that first inversion F chord in 6c
lute music, Italian, French, English, you name it. It's as though, as
you say, they wanted a low bass note, but didn't have a low F so they
made do with an A. I agree the "problem" would be solved if they just
played the octave A, which would have been easier if they had it on
the "bass side" of the course. As far as I know, this is quite rare
in 6c iconography but not totally unknown.
M
On 14/05/2015 10:21, Sean Smith wrote:
Oddly - and confusingly to this bundle of threads - it was Capirola
that first suggested it. The final chord to Nunqua fuit (53r) wants
clarification - that low A in the F chord is a curious note, isn't
it? In the vocal original, no note went to the lower octave (which we
don't have in this tuning of the 6c anyway) and neither was there a
third. Did he want just any old low note there - even the 3rd will do
even though nothing leads to it? A solution is to play only the 6th
octave where the 3rd falls into a better place and adds the lightest
hint of 3rd to the root-5th. What do other players suggest here?
Sean
And if I might ask you a lute question, what do you make of the final
chord in 'Nunqua fuit' in the Capirola (f53)?
Sean
On May 13, 2015, at 1:42 AM, Monica Hall wrote:
I am sorry to say that what Michael has said in this article is
highly contentious and doesn't support the idea that the 4-course
guitar was deliberately strung so that the strings of the fourth
course could be used independently.
1. The three examples which Michael refers to are flawed and can't
be taken as proof of the stringing arrangement which he proposes.
Giovanni Smit 4-course guitar (Vienna Kuntsthistorisches Museum SAM 49)
This is actually one of a pair of similar instruments dating 1646.
The present stringing is just what the Museum has come up with and
gives no indication of the original arrangement. It is uncertain
whether the bridge, or the spacing of the strings is original.
What is not clear from the photos is that both instruments are very
small with a scale length of only 37cms - much smaller than what is
considered the norm for 4-course guitar;
Michael says "The Smit guitar was undoubtedly tuned according to
Ex.2a" i.e.with a bourdon on the 4th course. We simply don't know
whether this was so. It would certainly have been tuned at least a
minor 3rd higher than what is assumed to be standard 4-course guitar
pitch today. Pitch: c" (or d" ). Hardly suitable for the 16th
century 4-course repertoire.
The two other drawings which he has reproduced are just artists
impressions - they are not photographs. The Cellier drawing may not
be accurate. There are obvious errors in the some of the other
drawings in the manuscript. The illustration of Carlo Cantu dates
from the 1630s or later and may actually be of a 5-course guitar.
French/Flemish iconography.
The illustrations in the Morlaye books and in Phalese clearly show
the strings equally spaced on all courses.
There are at least two other illustrations showing normal string
spacing.
Harvey Turnbull pl. 17a & 18 & p. 141. Both show the strings of
the 4th course close together.
17a French - engraving from Bib. Nat. Paris.
18. Atributed to Tobias Stimmer 1539-1584. Swiss painter and
illustrator. Died in Strasbourg. One of 10 engravings in N.Y. Public
Library - Astor, Llennox and Tilden Foundation.
There is also an illustration of a 4-course guitar in a Spanish
source Francisco Guerrero - Sacrae Cantiones (Seville, 1555). It is
difficult to see the spacing but it seems to be equal. Harvey
Turnbull pl. 16a & p. 141.
I have posted these on my earlyguitar.ning.com site. This topic was
discussed there in some length a few weeks ago.
Bermudo
What Bermudo says does not really underline the universal use of
standard tuning. Like so many people Michael has just taken the
sentence out of context. He has omitted part of it and is just
reading into it what he wants.
Bermudo says that "They usually put on the 4th course another string"
which suggests that they did not always.
f.96 - Suelen poner a la quarta de la guitarra otra cuerda, que le
llaman requinta. No se, si quando este nombre pusieron a la tal
cuerda: formava con la dicha quarta un diapente, que es quinta
perfecta: y por esto tomo nombre de requinta. Ahora no tienen este
temple: mas forman ambas cuerdas una octava: segun tiene el laud, o
vihuela de Flandes Este instrumento teniendo las tres, o quatro
ordenes de cuerdas dobladas, que forman entre si octavas: dizen tener
las cuerdas requintadas.
They usually put on the fourth course of the guitar another string
which they call "requinta". I do not know whether when they gave
this name to this string {in the past] it made the interval of a 5th
with the fourth course, and for this reason it has this name. Today
it is not tuned in this way; instead the two strings form an octave
in the same way as on the lute, or "vihuela de Flandes" [i.e. another
name for the lute]. Because this instrument [i.e. the lute] has three
or four strings doubled in octaves they say that it has its strings
"requintadas".
On a purely practical level it simply isn't necessary to string the
guitar in this way to avoid six-four chords. Invariably the upper
octave note on the fourth course is doubled on one of the higher
courses in 4-part chord and if players were worried about six-four
chords they could simply have omitted the fourth course altogether
from chords which have the 5th of the chord on the 4th course. In
fact in the Leroy books this is what often happens; the Morlaye
books are less discriminating. Also quite frequently the 4th course
is to be tuned down a tone and this eliminates the second inversion
chords in some keys. It just isn't necessary to go to such length.
I think people should be more careful in the way that they evaluate
their information...
Monica
----- Original Message ----- From: "Sean Smith" <lutesm...@mac.com>
To: "lute" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 1:13 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vihuela Stringing
There may be reason to rethink the splitting of the 4th course in
renaissance guitar technique. In the December 2012 LSA Quarterly,
Michael
Fink has strongly argued for playing the octave seperately in the
lowest
course of the renaissance guitar under cetain circumstances and for
certain reasons.
Apparently the Giovanni Smit chitarrina (1646) is a prime example. He
reproduces the plate (6.5) from James Tyler's 2002 book and it is a
significantly wider space within that course.
He also reproduces the drawing (~1583-1587) by Jacques Cellier for
presentation to Henry III of France. It requires a bit of photoshop
magic
to bring it out but it, too, has a wider split at the 4th course.
The Commedia dell'Arte Guitar (ca. 1630?) in the print of actor Carlo
Cantu ("Buffetto") printed as the frontispiece in Tyer's 1980 book also
reveals course IV is split wider.
He further shows the usefulness of playing the octave over the full
course
in a variety of examples.
Sean
On May 12, 2015, at 9:35 AM, Martin Shepherd wrote:
Let's not get confused here - the "split course" technique consists of
stopping only one string of a unison course so that the course produces
two different notes. This was used by Capirola, Fuenllana, Bakfark,
and
possibly others. Playing the strings of an octave course separately
is a
completely different technique, not used (as far as I know) before
Mouton
in the late 17th century.
Martin
On 12/05/2015 18:25, Lex van Sante wrote:
Yes, for instance in Rechercar XIII one has to finger one string of
the
fourth course and plucking both of them.
Op 12 mei 2015, om 18:18 heeft Monica Hall het volgende geschreven:
Does Capirola say that you should play one or other string of an
octave
strung course?
Monica
----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Wilke"
<chriswi...@cs.dartmouth.edu>
To: <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>; <dwinh...@lmi.net>
Cc: <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:20 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vihuela Stringing
I suppose he meant Capirola.
Chris
[1]Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
At May 12, 2015, 8:27:26 AM, Monica Hall<'mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk'>
"Fuenllana (1554) prescribes playing only one of the two strings in
the
course in some passages (as does Dalza - does he?)"
As far as I am aware this is not what Fuenllana does. What he
does do
is
play two different notes on the same course - stopping one string
of a
course and leaving the other unstopped.
References
1. https://yho.com/footer0
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