I played with a Bollywood band last November, does that count?
See programmes (and Frisch' interesting book on these) by Le Baroque
Nomade or Jordi Savall's Xavier album for musically inspired
intercultural fusion in early music.
Or the Italian baroque sonata's composed by Petrini at the Chinese
court in the 18th century, but there's no fusion involved. In Japanese
traditional music are a few Western influences, among these a koto
tuning refered to as âDutch tuning', a remnant of the time the Dutch
had a trading post in Hirado, and later Deshima.
David
On Fri, 9 Feb 2018 at 05:09, George <[1]georgefos...@att.net> wrote:
My favorite east meets west: John McLaughlin and Shakti. Check out
Happiness is Being Together. On YouTube.
> On Feb 8, 2018, at 6:31 PM, G. C. <[2]kalei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Kiitos Arto, minà ¤ tykkà ¤t hyvà ¤in kitarristin. Cool album
>
> On Fri, Feb 9, 2018 at 1:14 AM, Arto Wikla
<[1][3]wi...@cs.dartmouth.edu>
> wrote:
>
> Dear lutenists
> Here is my favorite eastern-western music from my youth:
> THE PAUL BUTTERFIELD BLUES BAND - EAST WEST (1966)
> [2][4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwMqBvBLJio
> (btw: that is good music even today! :-) )
> Perhaps Tristan will find some similiar ragas?
> best,
> Arto
>
> On 09/02/18 01:57, Tristan von Neumann wrote:
>
> Yep, and Apes don't look like Humans. There is no other
relation
> whatsoever, pure coincidence that they look alike....
> If you had listened as much to the tracks while finding the
right
> spot to make it sound ok without too much manipulation, you
would
> notice more that just modes.
> But as I said - if you don't want to hear the gestures, and
how
> Sweelinck directly refers to the Raga (and Dowland too), then
you
> don't listen as closely.
> If we sat together in front of the stereo and I could point
it out,
> you would probably be surprised not to have heard it.
> Am 09.02.2018 um 00:39 schrieb Susan Sandman:
>
> I do hear similarities between the two. But I hear
similarities
> among lots of musics â from Steve Reich to "space music" to
> troubadour songs in similar modes, and do not think it means
direct
> contact or transmission of the sort I think you are
asserting.
> I find the unique musical gestures of each more interest, and
the
> unique tone colors of the instruments used more important
than
> unifying features of mode or raga however illustrated.
> Susan
> On Thu, Feb 8, 2018 at 10:38 AM Tristan von Neumann
> <[3][5]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
<mailto:[4][6]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de>>
> wrote:
> Thank you Susan!
> I am aware of Schenker - I studied musicology back in
the day.
> This would be indeed the best approach, but I guess it
is
> possible to
> find the exact match when analyzing just what is there.
> Indian understanding - as it appears to me - basically
*is*
> Schenkerian,
> so I guess this step could be skipped.
> What is your opinion about the Echo Fantasy?
>
[5][7]https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/sweelinck-echo-
> fantasia-ex-a-raga-asawari
>> Am 08.02.2018 um 16:31 schrieb Susan Sandman:
>> [6][8]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenkerian_analysis
>>
>> Perhaps the theoretical approach of Schenker would be
> helpful to
>> communicate the similarities you are finding between the
> Bull
> Fantasia,
>> Raga Yaman and maybe Castello. Schenker's system is
> based on the
>> dynamic pull of scale tones. While to me the
> particularities of the
>> musical elaborations unique to each composer/era/culture
> is of more
>> interest, his approach might clarify the unity of what you
> are
> hearing.
>> Please consult the above link.
>> Susan
>> [7][9]www.ElizabethanConversation.com
> <[8][10]http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com>
> <[9][11]http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 7, 2018 at 7:02 PM Tristan von Neumann
>> <[10][12]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> <mailto:[11][13]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de>
> <mailto:[12][14]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> <mailto:[13][15]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de>>>
> wrote:
>>
>> I would not dare to call you a fool if you actually
> took your
> time to
>> listen :)
>> In case of my experiments I grant you, there is room
> for doubt.
>> But with Fantasy X and XII: Did you *really* listen?
>> (I hope your disbelief did not impair your hearing.
> This
> human trait has
>> been proven scientifically.)
>> And if it's not connected, I would be very happy to
> know:
>> how do you explain the total weirdness of especially
> those two
>> fantasies? There is nothing remotely resembling this,
> and I
> have played
>> and listened a lot. I would very much love to get
> other
> keyboard pieces
>> in that style then, regardless :)
>>
>> However (also to you, G. C.) - it is not the
> compatible mode,
> it is also
>> basic motives of the Raga that can be found exactly
> at the
> right place,
>> and the matching .
>> I have yet to organize a real meeting between for
> example a
> singer and a
>> keyboardist.
>> If anything, this could be a nice intercultural
> exchange.
>>
>> My old musicology professor by the way does agree
> with the
> finding.
>> Though due to tempo inconsistecies (if oyu change
> tempo
> digitally, it
>> sound terrible) I did not post it:
>> If a Hindustani flute player matches Fantasy XII, it
> sounds
> like a
>> Castello Sonata. I will try and prepare a mix with
> that, but
> I have not
>> yet found the right music source.
>> Anyone interested may get an mp3 in private email.
>>
>>
>>> Am 07.02.2018 um 23:32 schrieb Arto Wikla:
>>> Well, I listened carefully all those example
> combinations
> of Bull's
>>> harpsichord pieces and the suggested similiar(?)
> raga
>> performances, and
>>> sincerely I could not find much in common between
> them,
> just two
>>> different sound clips connected. Tristan von
> Neumann is of
> course
>> free
>>> to name me also "fool" even after I really
> listened his
> medleys, but
>>> while I definitely strongly disagree his idea...
> ;-)
>>>
>>> all the best,
>>>
>>> Arto
>>>
>>> On 07/02/18 07:53, Tristan von Neumann wrote:
>>>>> Those who would even want to listen are fools.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, those who wouldn't.
>>>>
>>>> Am 07.02.2018 um 06:48 schrieb Tristan von
> Neumann:
>>>>> I can't believe almost no one is excited about
> this
> discovery.
>>>>>
>>>>> All those who *still* doubt me, listen to this
> epic Raga
> Yaman
>>>>> accompanied by John Bull's Fantasy XII.
>>>>> I did nothing but adjust the pitch and placement
> of the
> tracks.
>>>>>
>>>>>
> [14][16]https://soundcloud.com/tristan
> -von-neumann/fantasy-xii-raga-yaman
>>>>>
>>>>> Those who would even want to listen are fools.
>>>>> Like the pope who wouldn't look through
> Galilei's telescope.
>>>>>
>>>>> Those who will listen will hear.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> To get on or off this list see list information
> at
>>>>> [15][17]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~w
> bc/lute-admin/index.html
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
>
> References
>
> 1. mailto:[18]wi...@cs.dartmouth.edu
> 2. [19]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwMqBvBLJio
> 3. mailto:[20]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 4. mailto:[21]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 5.
[22]https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/sweelinck-echo-fantas
ia-ex-a-raga-asawari
> 6. [23]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenkerian_analysis
> 7. [24]http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
> 8. [25]http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
> 9. [26]http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
> 10. mailto:[27]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 11. mailto:[28]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 12. mailto:[29]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 13. mailto:[30]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
> 14.
[31]https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/fantasy-xii-raga-yama
n
> 15. [32]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> [33]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
--
*******************************
David van Ooijen
[34]davidvanooi...@gmail.com
[35]www.davidvanooijen.nl
*******************************
--
References
1. mailto:georgefos...@att.net
2. mailto:kalei...@gmail.com
3. mailto:wi...@cs.dartmouth.edu
4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwMqBvBLJio
5. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
6. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
7. https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/sweelinck-echo-
8. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenkerian_analysis
9. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
10. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
11. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
12. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
13. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
14. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
15. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
16. https://soundcloud.com/tristan
17. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~w
18. mailto:wi...@cs.dartmouth.edu
19. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwMqBvBLJio
20. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
21. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
22.
https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/sweelinck-echo-fantasia-ex-a-raga-asawari
23. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schenkerian_analysis
24. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
25. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
26. http://www.ElizabethanConversation.com/
27. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
28. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
29. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
30. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
31. https://soundcloud.com/tristan-von-neumann/fantasy-xii-raga-yaman
32. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
33. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
34. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com
35. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/
