Karen On Sat, 5 Jun 2010, Olivia Norman wrote:
I agree with you! I've heard that "this works on JFW, so it must be accessible" so many times! I'll be excited to see them loose some of their strangle hold on the market. Olivia "Innovation distinguishes between a leader and a follower" Steve Jobs On Jun 5, 2010, at 1:47 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:I will reserve comment on Freedom Scientific as a company. While I too feel for those who will lose their jobs, I am more concerned for those who are emotionally attached to jfw. Those who feel they have no choice but to use windows. Those who are told that everyone uses jfw, and that you are not a good blind person if you are not using it. those who fear going through the training process again, if they ever got real training in the first place. Frankly I hope no one takes over the program. One of the blights on access is the assumption that say banks and other commercial companies make that if a site works with jfw, then it is fully accessible for all computer users experiencing vision loss. That came from the strangle hold jfw had on the state and government market. so removing the program all together opens the door indeed for a real accessible level playing field. something rooted in w3c suggestions, not on specific products. The adaptive market becomes one with many consumers making computer choices based on their individual tastes and desires, not a one size fits all lump of people. But someone is going to have to help those lost sheep know that they now have more choices. Karen On Sat, 5 Jun 2010, Allison Manzino wrote:Wow, That is just amazing. I thought Freedom would have gone under a long time ago given their high prices and lack of tech support at least in my opinion. I think that people are tired of paying $1500 for a screen reader. I use Window-Eyes that is currently being paid off via a payment plan. But Jaws kept crashing on me after version 6. I hope they will get someone to take the project over, since I know that windows users outnumber Mac. If I remember correctly, and this was way back in the late nineties I believe, JFW used to be owned by Henter Joyce. They also own Blazie I think. I think this might finally level the playing field for all of us. I don't have anything against Freedom, I just want technology to be accessible and affordable for everyone. Allison On Jun 5, 2010, at 2:07 PM, Teresa Cochran wrote:Well, it strikes me as being at the rumor and discussion level as of yet, but I wouldn't be surprised to see FS move in that direction. Personally, I won't be getting any more JAWS upgrades, and I'm perfectly happy with the Mac and Alex. :) Teresa On Jun 5, 2010, at 9:42 AM, Kawal Gucukoglu wrote:Off topic, but I feel everyone will be interested especially those people who run Fusion on their Macs. Begin forwarded message:From: "Ibrahim Gucukoglu" <ibrahim_gucuko...@sent.com> Date: June 5, 2010 9:36:33 AM GMT+01:00 To: "Kawal Gucukoglu" <kawal_gucuko...@sent.com> Subject: Fw: [bcab] End of Freedom? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colin r. Howard" <co...@pobox.com> To: <b...@freelists.org>; <access...@freelists.org>; <av...@googlegroups.com>; <ntexpr...@googlegroups.com>; <jaws...@freelists.org> Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2010 1:30 AM Subject: [bcab] End of Freedom?Greetings, I am posting the main text from a thread just seen on the Blind Audio List which I am surprised not to have seen on the BCAB or AccessUK groups. Ought we to give much credence to this? I, for one, would welcome any comments from Sight and Sound. From: "Otto Zamora" <donttreado...@bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 05:44:14 -0400 Morning, In an advocate meeting yesterday, the subject came up reference Freedom Scientific, the company that among other things sports JFw. Because the company is in the state of Florida, it came up on a flag by an analyst. Seems this company is having bad money troubles, not surprising given the economy, but talk is that they are now looking to sell off some of their division, mainly their JFW area. I am not sure who if anyone will buy this division, considering that there is an entity now selling a fully integrated package for only $700. Besides a comprehensive screen reader, if the user chooses to get the package, there is a browser, along with a customed and fully accessible web sites, word processing, and E mail. all of this can apparently be accessed either on line, or as individual program. ad to that, the entertainment mogill, and you have a powerful tool indeed for the kind of money they are asking for. Another side of the equation is the apple company, now selling computers already with speech on board right out of the box and off the shelf. Put these two aspects together, and you have a deadly combo that might very well result in a abrupt end to the JFW program. Considering the way that technology is growing, older versions of JFW, will only work for a short while until the programs controlling the OS, begins to outgrow the application. In seeing this package, one of the things which was pointed out to me, was the learning curve, which for the new package being sold by Mr.. Mike Calvo, is very short. The user has the option to learn as little or as much as they want without real loss. From: "Alison Trelfa" <codamu...@uwclub.net> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 15:36:47 +0100 Hello, Otto, I wonder whether many jaws users would move to another speech program as yet as many of the packages that are not standard probably wouldn't be supported by the out of the box speech. I run Sonar and Sibelius 5.25, both of which are using scripts that have been written by folk who specialise not only in Jaws, but only in the two programs. I suppose those people who only need computers for basic commands may well get away with speech such as you describe, but I don't think that Jaws would just be dismissed out of hand because Freedom is going. I think Jaws has changed hands once before if I'm not mistaken? Correct me if I'm wrong there. I would be very sorry to see Jaws go under, but I'm not worried yet. There is a huge following for Jaws and I believe that someone would take it over. From: "Otto Zamora" <donttreado...@bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 10:49:36 -0400 hi, You are correct, I am just stating that from what we were told, they are having a hard time finding someone who will take on the project,especially since as you point out, most people are not using anything that is high end, and from what we also have heard, people are tired of having to pay $1500 and change, when there now is a program which will do speech and more for only $700. Given the economy, for many people, the sedition may be financial. From: Geoff Long <ge...@tisab.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 16:20:04 +0100 Hi Alison, I wonder how many JAWS users have to pay for their own equipment. I use window-eyes, which is considerably less expensive, and as I had to pay for my training and kit from my own pocket, it makes a big difference. From: "Dr Norman Waddington" <normanwaddington...@btinternet.com> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 16:36:22 +0100 Hi Geoff, I need no introduction to you on this list. I am a Jaws user and have paid all the way through out of my own pocket from version 3.5 methinks if I remember correctly. From: Anders Holmberg <and...@pipkrokodil.se> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 17:37:37 +0200 Hello! Also we have nvda as a very good and free alternative. And Hal or supernova which costs less money than jaws. From: "Mike Stewart" <stewar...@verizon.net> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2010 10:58:45 -0600 The entry price is steep, but upgrades only run about $100-$140 or so... From: "Alison Trelfa" <codamu...@uwclub.net> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 21:31:33 +0100 Hi, Geoff, It is expensive to get jaws I agree with that. The problem I have is that there are no other programs that support the music side as far as I know. If all programs worked as well as microsoft office or outlook express then I think Jaws would really be struggling. Most of the other programs that I know of don't support many programs apart from the basics. From Colin Howard, for whom a small place near Southampton in Southern England, has the honour of providing a home. 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