Frank Griffin a écrit :
On 03/25/2011 12:34 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
My two cents as an user:
Presumably, FLOSS supporters are satisfied with the state of the current
ISOs, and https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=523 would address
extending install functionality without changing the content of the
existing ISOs, which should be an improvement over where we are now
without corrupting the FLOSS purity of the existing ISOs.
Not all "FLOSS supporters" believe that ISOs should be "pure".
I would label myself a FLOSS partisan (having contributed in FLOSS
projects for 10 years), and yet I don't really make a fuss if an
ISO contains non-free software, especially if such software is
necessary for good use of some peripherals...
Neither do I.
By labelling "FLOSS supporters" only the partisans of aforementioned
"purity" (a term which, in any political context, should really give you
shivers), you are making the community as a whole a disservice. It is
not "the purists" vs. "the realists", or some other caricatural
reduction of reality.
The labeling was for typographical convenience, simply a way to
differentiate one camp in this discussion from the other, and was pretty
obviously not a part of the intrinsic arguments.
I'm on neither side in this; my interest is in having the install
support wireless networking, which has nothing to do with whether there
is one ISO or two. All the necessary files are already in the distro, I
just want the install to use them if they're available. That is not a
FLOSS/non-FLOSS/sorta-FLOSS issue. I install cooker/cauldron only, and I
haven't installed from an ISO since I got involved with cooker except as
an occasional test.
I don't care how many ISOs there are, or whether the installer gets
these files from the moon. I just figure I have a better chance of
seeing this implemented if I point out that two ISOs steps on as few
toes as possible, given the current contents of the DVDs. If you want to
take up cudgels about merging them for an additional 1% or so of user
experience, be my guest.
From what you say, there are not a lot of points of disagreement
between us, on this issue.
We both have contributed to open source for a long time, you apparently
mostly on developement/packaging, myself mostly translating/ aide in
forums, with some contributions to development. (Currently an
apprentice packager.)
You find 2 isos a minor inconvenience, but in practice normally install
online, from cooker/cauldron.
Myself, I find a single DVD that contains everything I need to get a
fully working system (in terms of hardware/drivers) a major convenience,
and do not have the luxury of the bandwidth necessary to install from
the internet.
I don't know if you have ever installed from Mandriva's 3-cd set, but
juggling 3 cds on installing a package is a hassle that I very much
prefer to avoid. One iso is great.
As well, I appreciate very much the ability to do a complete, fully
working reinstall without internet access.
(To facilitate this, I keep packages installed from sources other than
the DVD in a separate partition.)
The single DVD is not only useful for myself. It is handy to promote
Linux as well. Unfortunately, with missing firmware and drivers, the
DVD will not fully work on many systems. And new users prefer a
_single_ iso that just works. Having to juggle isos is a deterant.
On the question of space on the DVD, you must admit that all the
(non-free) firmware and drivers (not already included) would not take an
enormous amount of space.
Note that on the Mandriva 2010.2 DVD, for example, the 2 biggest games
take about 100 M and 40 M repectively.
It is simply a matter of priorities.
In sum, it is easy to understand your point of view, as you don't
(normally) use isos.
Please understand the point of view of those who do, particularly those
who have serious bandwidth restrictions.
<aside>
There are others who militate for a "free-only" DVD, but seem to be
unaware that no distro contains only "free" software, not even Fedora.
Just as no distro runs on "free/non-proprietary" hardware.
</aside>
--
André
