In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
David Wilson-Okamura <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
>From: Adrian Pay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 23:19:40 -0000
>
>Has anyone been struck by Horace 1.24 ("quis desiderio sit pudor..."). Who
>is Quintilius
The facts (or what passed for facts) are stated in the commentaries,
e.g. Nisbet and Hubbars; we are told that he came from Cremona, and some
sources give him the name Varus; but that may be no more than confusion
with the Quintilius Varus who was routed by the Germans.
> and why "nulli flebilior quam tibi, Vergili" (Quintilius
>turns up in the Ars Poetica and a fragment of Philodemus)
He was in with the Epicurean set at the Bay of Naples, as Vergil was
too: see P. Herc. Paris 2, a sequence of vocatives: Plotius (so much for
those who gave tried to cut Tucca out of Vergil's literary executorship)
and Varius and Vergil and Quintilius.
>
>Lines 13-16 seems to be referring to Georgics Book IV - does Horace know
>what Vergil's agenda is in Book IV.
If Q. died in 23 BC (Jerome; but that may be back-inferred from the date
of Odes 1-3), H. had read the fourth Georgic; but in any case he might
have heard Vergil reciting a draft long before it was given to copyists.
At any rate, we do not need to be constrained by the need to prove that
H. had read the poem, but may take it for granted. On that basis,
Nisbet-Hubbard assert: 'He seems to be hinting at, and implicitly
contradicting, the story of the recovery of Eurydice, which Virgil had
told in the _Georgics_. His view of the power of poetry is more
commonsensical than his friends.' Anyone care to agree or disagree?
>
>The last stanza refers back to Odes 1.10, the hymn to Mercury. Here the
>picture is rather grimmer: compare "tu pias laetis animas reponis /
sedibus
>virgaque levem coerces / aurea turbam" with "quam virga semel
horrida...
>nigro compulerit Mercurius gregi".
It is a question of point of view: in 1.10 the focus is on the destiny
of _piae animae_ in the next world, in 1. 24 on their loss to this.
Is one supposed to remember that
>Augustus is seen as Mercury on earth on Odes 1.2?
Probably not: that is Mercury in a different capacity.
>
>Does anyone know what to make of Odes 4.12 (another one addressed to
>Vergil); again there seems to be some sort of intertextual play with the
>Georgics.
Some people have tried to dissociate this Vergilius from the poet;
'iuuenum nobilium cliens', 'rerum pone moras et studium lucri'. 'misce
stultitiam consiliis brevem', suggest a man on the make and are a little
hard to apply to Vergil even as the mock-insults of a close friend.
Perhaps you'd like to elaborate your view of the identity and the
intertextuality.
Leofranc Holford-Strevens
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Leofranc Holford-Strevens
67 St Bernard's Road usque adeone
Oxford scire MEVM nihil est, nisi ME scire hoc sciat alter?
OX2 6EJ
tel. +44 (0)1865 552808(home)/267865(work) fax +44 (0)1865 512237
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (home) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (work)
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