> On Dec 10, 2025, at 18:48, David Walters via groups.io > <[email protected]> wrote: > > I totally disagree with your underlying thesis here: that unless we get rid > of capitalism, there can be no real action on climate change (correct me if > I'm wrong here).
Has there been any action that matters on climate change after more than 30 years of international efforts? > > Much can be done "under capitalism". Our air is actually much cleaner now > thanks to the Clean Air Act(s). Thanks to de-industrialization, much of our foul air and water has been exported to Asia - along with the jobs. Clean air and water, moreover, is a moving target since today we have microplastics and PFAS chemicals in our air and water. Moreover, we have a global problem with no global clean-air act. > The same is true with numerous environmental regulations won under "bourgeois > democracy". It is what one fights for. Even if we went to steady-state > economic growth, we have to replace fossil fuel in order to mitigate climate > change. Who are "we" in your sentence? Wall Street and global finance will decide whether or not we will "replace fossil fuels" and they have already decided not to replace them for a variety of reasons. The reality of trillions of dollars of stranded assets is one reason why we all must die, with the poorest going first. Also, I quote "replace fossil fuel" in your sentence because no fossil fuel has ever been replaced in the history of capitalism AFAICT. We burn more coal today than ever, more oil, more gas. > You have something, IMHO, of a defeatist position. I say that because simply > opposing any development I'm not opposing any development, just development that is organized and led by banks and billionaires. > (nothing about what this might actually look like) doesn't inform us of what > we should be doing...it is "nothing can be done short of workers revolution" Nothing short of class struggle: It is necessary to take the profits away from one of the most powerful and homicidal industries in the history of capitalism. That's a transitional struggle, a non-reformist reform. It's not a call for "nothing short of workers revolution." > ...so stop gripping about climate change? I don't know. There are > implications to this position, "de-development communism" regarding what to > do now. Many immediate demands can be won (thus the concept of "immediate") > as part of the development of independent working class political action. If > we replaced all fossil fuel generation and made a real conversion of > transportation vehicles to low carbon that would be a great advance > regardless of the mode of production we live under. > > What do you tell the billion or more folks with no access to electricity? That they have the right to determine how to develop their own energy independently of the US and the World Bank. Those nations are not the problem. The highest per-capita emissions are in the US. The highest overall emissions are from China, the workshop of world capitalism. Europe, too. > Or another half a billion with intermittent energy access? At every level, > people want jobs, and the "stuff" those jobs can buy. All that just to > survive. You have no...transitional perspective at all. How do you suppose > folks with be won over to your philosophy on this? With a program of transitional demands that can actually address the problems rather than fail to address them for another three decades. That is time that we do not have. Mark -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#39681): https://groups.io/g/marxmail/message/39681 Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/116655555/21656 -=-=- POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. #4 Do not exceed five posts a day. -=-=- Group Owner: [email protected] Unsubscribe: https://groups.io/g/marxmail/leave/13617172/21656/1316126222/xyzzy [[email protected]] -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
