Yes clog, the existential attitude of fear is often justified by such
practical overlays of ‘this works’ upon appearances. And, of course
I’m not sure that you feel this way!

I would also suggest that we both seek perfection (since you would
most likely reject the term ‘nirvana’). In the US, this notion is
common. “In order to form a more perfect Union….”, science studies
appearances in a search for some sort of perfection of a view of
reality etc.

Yes, I know, I’ve “up-leveled” the discussion into more ethereal
realms where you seem unwilling to venture. This is fine too.

Of course, to merely ‘use what we have’ would logically reject change.
But, I digress.

Thanks again!


On Oct 8, 3:03 pm, Clogtowner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi y'all - we have no absolutes in the market or anywhere else. I have
> much experience with the market, and I believe, a good understanding
> of what would happen without the regulations that we do have. Free
> trade has not caused our present situation. Indeed, if we had free
> trade and brokers were liable for their bad moves, instead of being
> able to sell their lousy loans to the Govt. willy nillly, we (I)
> wouldn't be suffering now. I've lived through it before in 1987. I get
> the impression that you seek nirvana or perfection. That is not going
> to happen - I use what we have to best advantage and I find it better
> than most alternatives.
>
> On Oct 8, 4:52 pm, ornamentalmind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > “I generally like to believe in an unfettered free market system.
> > Having said that we have rules and regulations in place for trading in
> > shares/commodities/foreign exchange which I believe are adequate if
> > properly enforced.” – clog
>
> > Oh, yes clog! Many people like to believe in it (an unfettered free
> > market system)…along with other mythologies.
> > Case in point, you follow you preference of said belief with
> > qualifiers. Thus, denuding the adjective
> >  ‘unfettered’. Then you follow this with another fantasy of ‘adequate
> > if properly enforced’.
>
> > I don’t mean to be too harsh with you clog, you seem like a likable
> > enough person and I appreciate your views, it’s just that all of the
> > above equates to unprocessed thinking in my book.
>
> > Hehe, ‘start in the middle and move about a bit.’!!! Well, yes, you
> > say ‘waffling’ and I say ambivalence. In such situations, a preferable
> > statement would be “I have no idea.”, no? :-)
>
> > Having said this, I’ll jump into the fray and suggest that such
> > ‘rules’ and ‘good thoughts’, as common as the memes are, have precious
> > little to do with the full impact and truth of reality.
>
> > On Oct 8, 2:39 pm, Clogtowner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Hi y'all - I generally like to believe in an unfettered free market
> > > system. Having said that we have rules and regulations in place for
> > > trading in shares/commodities/foreign exchange which I believe are
> > > adequate if properly enforced. For example, if I sell a stock and use
> > > the money immediately to buy another stock, I am using unsettled funds
> > > and I am unable to sell that stock until settlement. This is one of
> > > many good rules which go some way to preventing fraud (of course the
> > > system is not perfect and there is always fraud.)
> > > Where do I draw the line? I could write an essay on this one. It is
> > > somewhere between a socialist state and an unregulated free market
> > > economy. It would define the rights of man without infringing on his
> > > freedom. It would start with "do no harm" and end with "for the
> > > greater good" taking into account both, but relying solely on neither.
> > > I've started waffling. I don't know where to draw the bloody line but
> > > I'd start in the middle and move it about a bit.
>
> > > On Oct 8, 2:23 pm, ornamentalmind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > Clog, two questions:
>
> > > > 1. Do you believe in a free and unfettered free market system?
>
> > > > 2. Where do you draw the line?
>
> > > > On Oct 8, 8:52 am, Clogtowner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Hi y'all - yes I agree with Taylor. Especially quoting from Orn "Not
> > > > > everyone is open to supporting the common good." I would doubt that
> > > > > anyone here would not support the common good, but we have differing
> > > > > views on how to do it. I believe in a free enterprize, free market
> > > > > system. I saw the results of an excessive welfare state when I was
> > > > > younger, Having said that, I don't consider myself a right wing
> > > > > fanatic - there is a line to draw and I hope it wouldn't be too far
> > > > > from Orn's.
>
> > > > > On Oct 8, 10:26 am, Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > <<Clearly some have vested interests and/or ideological beliefs
> > > > > > against some of them. That is why I said "...most of us.." meaning 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > majority in the USA. Not everyone is open to supporting the common
> > > > > > good. >>
>
> > > > > > Interesting that you seem to imply that those who disagree with you
> > > > > > have a character flaw.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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