And then you went for breakfast. Very nice write-up and a real keeper for me with two SDLs. We have very few MBs in our junk yards and no PNPs that I've found. I'll bet there are plenty of Camrys out there though.
Jim learned you good. Harry Watkins Newton, MS 86 SDL Silver 85 300D Euro 86 SDL Gold 81 240D manual trans ----- Original Message ----- From: "Loren Faeth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Gather round, Y'all and I will fill you in on my cheap A/C experiment for > my 400k SDL (Toada/MB hack) > > Since Jim Cathy is the inspiration to all us who are broke or cheapskates, > I'd like to credit Jim for his assistance and inspiration. I probably > would not have started this adventure if not for 2 occurrences: 1: A post > from Jim that some Camrys (Camrii?) also have ND 10P15Ccompressors as does > my SDL, most 201s and some 124s. 2: The opening of a GenUwine Pick n pull > yard within a reasonable distance. Y'all would not be reading this if Jim > had not encouraged me to write up my findings. > > Here is the situation: Been gassing up the A/C on the SDL for each of the > last 3 years. Last fall the KLIMA relay bit the dust too. The compressor > is leaking out the old seals, so its death is approaching. So in order to > avoid the bad car-ma of having bits of the innards of the compressor strewn > through the innards of the A/C system, we deemed it was time to buy a new > compressor. So, here is the approximate tally: > > Compressor $475-500 > KLIMA ~ $100 > Receiver/drier ~$25 > Gas ~$25 > etc > > So, in order to keep my cool, I was looking at $700+ for a car the probably > would not bring over $1500 on a good day. I decided that was too much to > spend on the SDL, wonderful as it is. I was contemplating just using it in > the winter and letting it rust away, as a sacrifice to the rust > demon. Then the 2 above mentioned incidents occurred in close proximity. > > On my first foray to the PNP, I was discouraged. I found only 1 10P15C > with the right hose setup. A very tired old compressor that looked like it > had quit and had the belt cut off years ago. I decided to pass on that > one. This week I did some more searching and asked Jim again what cars > also had 10P15C compressors. Between Jim and the searches I found out that > these cars had the 10P15C compressor: > 83-86 Camry > 85-87 Corolla > Some 4-runners > some integra > and Lincolns from some year (maybe 85?) to 1991 > (there may be more) > > If your car has a 10PA15C, then that compressor is used on most later > Toyotas. Read on for more detail. > > Armed with this info. I went to the PNP again, a week later. I found some > in the Lincolns, but they looked like a bear to get out. It looks like you > have to drop the engine/front subframe, then pull the compressor....bad > news. So I kept looking. I found LOTS of later Toyotas with 10PA15C > compressors. I had some info that many of the later 124s and 126use the > 10PA series. My 88TE has the 10PA15C. I know it was said that the P and > PA series are NOT interchangeable, but I found a nice clean 10PA15C on a 90 > Camry and removed it along with a chunk of both hoses. It was charged, so > it looked like a good compressor. Turning it by hand it seemed to work > great. I held it up close to a 10P15C and discovered that the manifolds > were different sizes and I could NOT use the MB manifold from my P > compressor on the PA series. Hmmmmm. I found 2 older camrii with the > 10P15C compressor. both looked old and fairly dirty. I decided to try the > better looking of the 2. I figured if it held gas, that it was better than > the compressor on my car. It had a full charge of gas, so I picked it > off. Nice thing about camrii: all you need to pop off the compressor is a > 12mm socket and rachet and a 3" extension. 2 bolts for the hoses, 3 bolts > for the mounting and snip the wires. It is ALL done form the topside! Wow! > > SO, I checked out with my haul ($25 each + a $10 core charge) and figured I > had at least a couple of options: > 1. Swap the clutch and manifold and use the 10P15C from the 86 camry. > 2. Figure out a way to bolt up the PA, and have a good reliable > compressor, if I can find a MB manifold for it. (Still have to swap the > manifold and clutch > 3. Figure out the way to bolt up the PA, swap the clutch and do a hack job > to use the Toada hose sections spliced into the MB hoses (shudder) (Don't > do this on a good car!) > > When I got back, I took off the compressor form the SDL. It appears it > might be the original. If it made 400K, that is pretty good service. I > know it made at least 230k, because i have never changed it. Either way, I > think it has given good service. Looking at the compressor mount on the > engine, it looks like the mount is specific to the P series. I am guessing > the PA mount is different. > ***If anyone has a spare PA compressor mount on your junker, spare OM 603 > or just sitting on a shelf, I'd like to have one!***** > > I decided in order to get the car in running condition ASAP, i should use > the P series from the 86 Camry. If I can find a MB manifold and a > OM engine mounting bracket for the PA, then I can try fitting it later. > > I have not worked on any AC clutch since the old Yorks. Getting the clutch > apart was an adventure. First remove a 12 mm nut. The Yorks use a tapered > shaft to hold the clutch. The ND has a straight shaft with a key. If you > have a puller, you might get one to work for the MB clutch. I pried it off > with 2 screwdrivers. Not bad on the MB clutch, but on the toada, it is > recessed inside the pulley. On the toada, I used a plastic drift to punch > the shaft back. That got it started. then i used a pin punch through the > pulley slots to persuade it off. Next is a big snap ring that holds the > pulley on. Got those off and removed the pulleys on both compressors. > > Having the clutch and pulley off, the coil is next. If I wanted to hack > the wires on the car, I could just use the same coil. I wanted to keep the > car harness original, so I opted to change the coils. The coil is held on > by another big snap-ring. when I had both coils off, I started cleaning > parts, especially the stuff that was loose and the area around the manifold > on both compressors. With clean parts, I installed the MB coil on the > Toada compressor, and put on the snap ring. then the pulley and the snap > ring. Next was a small spacer that was on the MB shaft but not on the > Toada shaft. Then the clutch, secured with a washer and the 12mm (Wrench > size) nut. > > Not too bad, once you figure out how they are put together and how to get > the clutch off. > > I was too late to get gaskets for the manifold and o-rings for the hoses > today. One place in town has both, and another could have them in the > morning. I forgot to order these from Rusty ahead of time! > > I ordered a new receiver/drier from Rusty for this one and some more parts > for other cars. All that is left now is to swap the manifolds (4 bolts) > and install the "new" compressor. > > It looks like I will have working A/C for less than $100. Not bad for a > cheapskate! > > Most MB later than 87 have the PA series of compressor. I am not positive > which years and models have which. Just look at the tag on the back end of > your compressor. Another way to tell is the P series I have seen have the > speed sensor wires coming out the rear of the shaft. The PA series have > the speed sensor wired coming out the bottom center, on the outside > radius. For any of you that have a 10PA series compressor on your MB and > want a cheap fix when you compressor craps out: 87 up Camrys are > plentiful. Just pick out a newish looking one, make sure it is charged > when you take it off (no leakers), remove 5 bolts, snip the wires and take > it home. Buy a compressor manifold gasket kit with o-rings (Rusty has > them) change out the manifold and clutch and install it. > > One caveat when reinstalling the clutch: The distance between the pulley > and the clutch is critical. The ND clutches seem to be self-spacing. If > there is a spacer in your MB Clutch, be sure to transfer it to the "new" > compressor. Check the clutch for engagement before you > reinstall (energize the coil and be sure the pulley turns with the > shaft) Also check the pulley for free spinning with the coil de-energized. > > One note about SDL A/C: as most of you know, the SDL on R-12 is barely > adequate when in slow traffic/city driving. On 134a, you might as well > shut off the a/c and open the windows. The 90 Camry had a 10PA17C. This > has a slightly larger displacement than the 15C. I would really like to > get a MB manifold and the correct mounting bracket for my OM603 engine, > because I think this compressor, with a switch back to freeze12 or some > other R-12 substitute will give better results than the original. It would > be nice to be cool in city driving on 100 degree days! > > POSTMORTEM: When i took the manifold off the compressor from the SDL, the > old black o-rings were clearly eroded. The manifold is sealed to the > compressor with 4 o-rings. It appears the true culprits were the o-rings > not the compressor shaft seal. It is possible the shaft seal also leaks, > so I am moving forward with the replacement. The old compressor does pump > well, but I think my chances of success are better with the replacement > that was known to hold a charge. So, If your compressor hails from the > R-12 days, before you condemn it, try removing the manifold, and replacing > the o-rings. Current AC O-rings are green and may be used with R-12 or 134a. > > YMMV > > Loren Faeth
