This has been a nice discussion withought negative bashing of peoples beliefs. Meteorites and cosmic dust is the closest we may come in our lives to setting on soil outside our solar system. Time will tell what the truth is. Just love everyone as best you can. Cheers Steve
--- On Mon, 3/12/12, e...@meteoritesusa.com <e...@meteoritesusa.com> wrote: > From: e...@meteoritesusa.com <e...@meteoritesusa.com> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make Life's > Components > To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > Date: Monday, March 12, 2012, 4:08 AM > Good points Richard, Michael, (I will > apologize in advance for the length of this post; I started > writing a couldn't stop) > > Divine Creation vs Natural Formation. That is the question. > That is a VERY large part of why I love meteorites so much. > Meteorites have allowed me a look into the universe and > answer some very important personal, spiritual, and > scientific questions as to the origins of Earth, the > planets, and ourselves. Meteorites are keys to unlocking our > past, the formation of Earth, the solar system, stars, > galaxies, and ultimately the universe itself. > > The problem with the divine creation (anthropomorphic > creator) hypothesis is that it's an assumption of > observance. In other words the watchmaker paradox. The > universe exists, how did it come to be? Something must have > "created" it. Right? Not necessarily. That my friends is an > absolute assumption. > > And the argument should stop right there, but it doesn't. > Believers will argue that something can't come from nothing > and non-believers will argue that everything came from what > we perceive as nothing. (The Big Bang) Science and > non-believers go one step further and say "We don't know > what happened before the Big Bang." That is intellectual > honesty and good science. And this might be offensive to > some, and I'm sorry if offends, but speculating that an > anthropomorphic deity started it, is pure speculation, > because no one knows what happened before, in the beginning, > and it creates the creator to explain the unexplained > formation of the observable. Why can't the unexplained stop > and start at "I don't know, lets find out." instead of "god > did it."? > > Evolution, Panspermia, Transpermia, Abiogenesis, Planetary > Science, Astrobiology, Astronomy, Anthropology, Archeology, > they all help explain the universe and world around us. > > Meteorites specifically are absolutely a vital clue to > unlocking the secrets of the universe because they (the > asteroids and comets that make them) not only are they the > very material that formed our planet, every single planet, > planetesimal, asteroid, comet, meteoroid, and spec of dust > floating around our star was once part of another star > before, as are we. It's a cycle, a system, a circular system > of formation and destruction, somewhere in between life > formed. > > Why create a creator to explain the unexplainable? Why not > instead use science to determine origins rather than > speculate on a divine supernatural beginning. Empirical > evidenced fact outweighs speculative assumption every time. > We are in fact part of nature, not separate from it. We need > not transpose an anthropomorphic creatot to explain > something we don't yet know. > > Regardless of whether there is a divine creator, or not, no > one can prove it empirically either way. (yet) That's what > science is for. If there is, science will find out, if there > is not, science will find out. Either way, the truth will > only be the truth when we prove it with evidence, not > speculative assumption of the observable. > > Regards, > Eric > > > > > > Quoting Richard Montgomery <rickm...@earthlink.net>: > > > Hi Michael and List (a different Richard here!) > > > > Contrary to the often mis-conception that 'religion' > and 'God' are > > interchangeable...and considering the 'dangerous' > ground upon which a > > discussion of this sort may be inappropriate for the > meteoritical > > discussion here....allow me this thought: > > > > A person of 'faith' may not rule out transpernmia in > theory; it simply > > expands the pie. A 'religious' person tied > tether-bound to a strick > > doctrine may reject such an 'outlandish' notion > out-of-hand, as it > > disrupts the entire reality from which their foundation > is built. > > > > In short, (in my small and insignificant yet human > perspective), it > > should be rational to allow both transpermia and a > perspective of God > > that trancends all current 'views' of even > Christianity, allowing for > > all three to co-exist....just a thought.... > > > > Richard Montgomery > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Blood" > <mlbl...@cox.net> > > To: "Dick Lipke" <richardli...@comcast.net>; > "Meteorite List" > > <meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com> > > Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 5:02 PM > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another > Way to Make > > Life's Components > > > > > >> Hi Richard, > >> > >> As an Anthropologist > I can assure you all religions have NOT > >> Viewed God as male - some were female and some were > non-gender > >> Specific "spirit." > >> > >> Garry, I agree with > you - interesting topic, but I fear a good many > >> On the list would see it as non-meteorite related > in spite of the fact > >> That transpermia (via meteorites) compels such a > discussion about why > >> People "of faith" would reject transpermia out of > hand. They damned > >> Near tortured Galileo to death for saying the world > was not the center > >> Of the universe (and he lived the remainder of his > life under house arrest). > >> > >> Religious > persecution of scientific recognition of inconvenient > >> facts has always been part of history and continues > to this day - most > >> religions holding the view, "the way we see things > IS the way things are" > >> while others overtly state that view AND feel the > DUTY to kill anyone > >> when sees things differently - hence 9/11. > >> > >> Weird, weird, weird > & weirder. > >> > >> Michael > >> > >> > >> On 3/11/12 2:23 PM, "Dick Lipke" <richardli...@comcast.net> > wrote: > >> > >>> Micheal, > >>> That is an excellent point that has always > baffled me and I could never > >>> understand the thinking > >>> of any religion in this world. All the > different Gods worshiped world wide > >>> have always been considered a male. > >>> Which brings up the problem, "Which came first, > the chicken or the egg." > >>> I think all these religions could be easier to > swallow if their God was a > >>> female. > >>> That would answer the question, she "God" was a > female carrying the first egg > >>> that resulted > >>> in the birth of the universe. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Richard Lipke > >>> > >>> > >>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>> A major element in the problem with most of > those calling > >>>> Themselves Christians these days is that > they > >>>> See God as an anthropomorphic individual. > This makes it > >>>> Difficult to see the "glory" or creation in > anything other > >>>> Than comic book images. > >>>> > >>>> They actually envision God as a big (male) > human who > >>>> Literally, with His hands, shaped Adam out > of mud..... > >>>> They cannot even see what a nearly perfect > allegory that is > >>>> For evolution arising from a primeval > "soup." > >>>> > >>>> Evidence of transpermia is growing - but > don't confuse > >>>> Them with facts. > >>>> > >>>> Odd > >>>> Michael > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 3/10/12 5:58 AM, "Dick Lipke" <richardli...@comcast.net> > wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Years ago I got a lot of questionable > looks concerning my sanity > >>>>> when I > >>>>> brought up > >>>>> the idea of meteorites being "the Johny > Appleseed of of life on > >>>>> Earth" to > >>>>> members of my astronomy club. > >>>>> Needless to say it resulted in > many,many comments of out rage. > >>>>> They reminded me of how it must have > felt to be among the first > >>>>> to refute the idea that Earth was the > center of the Universe. > >>>>> Lucky for me my kind of thinking came > in 20th century, back then > >>>>> they still > >>>>> burnt > >>>>> people at the stake for being possessed > by satin. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> Richard Lipke > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>>>> Meteorites Reveal Another Way to > Make Life's Components > >>>>>> ScienceDaily, March 9, 2012, > >>>>>> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120309104845.htm > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Meteorites Reveal Another Way to > Make Life's Components > >>>>>> Klaus Schmidt, March 10, 2012 > >>>>>> http://spacefellowship.com/news/art27926/meteorites-reveal-another-way-to-m > >>>>>> ak > >>>>>> e-life-s-components.html > >>>>>> > >>>>>> The paper is: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Burton, A. S., J. E. Elsila, M. P. > Callahan, M. G. Martin, D. P. > >>>>>> Glavin, N. M. Johnson, and J. P. > Dworkin. A propensity > >>>>>> for n-w-amino acids in thermally > altered Antarctic > >>>>>> meteorites. Meteoritics & > Planetary Science. Article > >>>>>> first published online: 8 March > 2012 > >>>>>> > >> http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1945-5100.2012.01341.x/abstrac>>>> > >> t > >>>>>> > >>>>>> best wishes, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Paul H. > >>>>>> > ______________________________________________ > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Visit the Archives at > >>>>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>>>>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>>>>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > >>>>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>>>> > ______________________________________________ > >>>>> > >>>>> Visit the Archives at > >>>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>>>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>>>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > >>>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>> ______________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Visit the Archives at > >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> > >> Visit the Archives at > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >> > > > > ______________________________________________ > > > > Visit the Archives at > > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > > Meteorite-list mailing list > > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > ______________________________________________ > > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > ______________________________________________ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
