Enabling capture of core dump files and then using gdb to work out where C level stack trace is for when process is crashing is all I can think of.
> On 31 Oct 2022, at 7:38 am, stuart mcgraw <smcg4...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Thanks for the vhost suggestion. I hadn't thought of that but it turned out > we didn't need to. > > After more testing it turns out that a .wsgi script with simple hello world > script per > > > https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/develop/user-guides/quick-configuration-guide.html#wsgi-application-script-file > > is exhibiting the problem: with no incoming requests at all the mod_wsgi > process after sitting there for anywhere from a few minutes to a few hours, > dies with a segmentation fault. Any idea what else I could look at? > On Wednesday, October 26, 2022 at 12:10:38 AM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: > The LogLevel can be set just in a VirtualHost context if is under separate > host. If you are then using separate log files for differential VirtualHost > it should at least be semi segmented from everything else. > >> On 26 Oct 2022, at 4:34 pm, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@gmail.com >> <applewebdata://ADD45F64-DF89-430B-BCD1-ADC44F659EBF>> wrote: >> >> > >> I was grepping all the log files for any messages within a minute or two >> before the segfaults so if a request was logged anywhere I should have seen >> it. >> >> I'll mention the LogLevel Debug setting to them, but there were complaints >> before that LogLevel Info was too noisy so I'm not sure that will fly. >> >> I'll look into the possibility of errant app threads and post back if >> anything turns up. Thanks very much for your help with this. >> On Tuesday, October 25, 2022 at 11:05:28 PM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: >> The only way I can think of that you may get a request which wasn't logged, >> is if an internal Apache request was triggered via an internal redirect from >> another Apache module. There still has to be an original request, but it >> would be logged as different request URL to where it got internally >> redirected. >> >> Since you are using mod_wsgi daemon mode you can likely see better evidence >> of all requests being handled if turn on verbose debugging mode, but would >> be quite noisy. >> >> LogLevel debug >> WSGIVerboseDebugging On >> >> Graham >> >> >>> On 26 Oct 2022, at 3:33 pm, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@gmail.com <>> wrote: >>> >> >>> I didn't compile mod_wsgi myself so I can't say 100% but the person who did >>> said so and there is a source directory on the machine named mod_wsgi-4.9.4 >>> with a mod_wsgi.so file whose sha1 checksum matches that of the file in the >>> apache modules/ directory, so I'd say I'm 99.9% sure. >>> >>> But the chances of >1Gi requests being made seem pretty small. The urls >>> haven't been publicized, there are only a handful of known users accessing >>> the urls infrequently as testers and nothing in the application would >>> generate requests of that magnitude. >>> >>> This may be out of scope for you, but are you aware of any (reasonably >>> normal) circumstances under which a mod_wsgi process could receive a >>> request that wasn't logged by Apache? Or perhaps I could modify the >>> mod_wsgi source code to print a message to a file when a request was >>> received (which I could then correlate with the Apache logs to answer the >>> question.) Because usage is very light and this is only for short term >>> debugging, I don't think locking or anything fancy would be needed? >>> >>> And I am still wondering about library mismatches or conflicts since >>> Apache, Python, mod_wsgi and C-based Python modules (eg psyocopg2) used by >>> the app were all built from source. It is possible that some version >>> mismatch there causes some memory corruption that is later manifest when >>> one of the mod_wsgi housekeeping threads runs? I would like if possible to >>> rule this out or at least put at the bottom of the list. >>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2022 at 8:35:07 PM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: >>> I know you said you were using mod_wsgi/4.9.4, but are you absolutely sure? >>> Apache/2.4.54 made a breaking change by changing the default for >>> LimitRequestBody directive, which would cause mod_wsgi daemon process to >>> crash when there were sent large request bodies over 1Gi. This was fixed in >>> version 4.9.4, but am wondering whether your production system has older >>> version than your development systems use and you just aren't aware of that. >>> >>> https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/release-notes/version-4.9.4.html#bugs-fixed >>> >>> <https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/release-notes/version-4.9.4.html#bugs-fixed> >>> >>> As to back ground threads, mod_wsgi has a couple of background threads >>> which check for idle activity, deadlocks and things, but they touch so >>> little they have never caused issues in the past. Beyond that, the request >>> handler threads themselves should be stuck on a select loop if no requests >>> are happening. >>> >>> >>>> On 26 Oct 2022, at 1:12 pm, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@gmail.com <>> wrote: >>>> >>> >>>> Again, thanks for those suggestions. >>>> >>>> The OOM killer seems not to be an issue. I've been told there are no >>>> signs of it in the system logs and no signs of memory problems via >>>> monitoring during nomal operations. >>>> >>>> Nor did "WSGIDestroyInterpreter Off" have any effect, the segfaults are >>>> still occurring after that was added and Apache restarted. >>>> >>>> My understanding of how mod_wsgi works is pretty sketchy. IIUC you are >>>> saying that the mod_wsgi processes are sitting there, waiting on a >>>> select() call or the like, to receive a request from the mod_wsgi code >>>> within Apache; and in that state they cannot simply spontaneously crash -- >>>> it must be that either that the process received request from Apache (via >>>> the mod_wsgi module) or there is some independent thread running in the >>>> Python part of the mod_wsgi process (which is running my wsgi app) that is >>>> causing the crash? >>>> >>>> I based my claim that there were no requests coincidental with the >>>> segfaults based on the lack of log messages within a second or two for >>>> some of the segfaults. (Its a moderately busy server so of course there >>>> were also some close in time but for seemingly unrelated pages: eg, >>>> python, php or c cgi, or html.) Is it possible that the mod_wsgi >>>> processes are getting woken up by something that does not produce an >>>> apache access log entry? >>>> >>>> I'm still working on the python thread hypothesis (this is a production >>>> server so changes aren't easy.) >>>> On Sunday, October 23, 2022 at 2:12:02 PM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: >>>> How much memory do the processes use? Maybe the system OOM process killer >>>> is killing the processes as they consume lots of memory and the system >>>> thinks it is running low. There were some potential problems introduced >>>> with Python 3.9 with how process are shutdown and that causes embedded >>>> systems to fail on shutdown. >>>> >>>> See: >>>> >>>> https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/release-notes/version-4.9.1.html#features-changed >>>> >>>> <https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/release-notes/version-4.9.1.html#features-changed> >>>> >>>> You can try setting: >>>> >>>> WSGIDestroyInterpreter Off >>>> >>>> as mentioned in those change notes and see if it goes away. >>>> >>>> Other than that, if you are confident that no new requests are arriving, >>>> can only suggest you work out if there are background threads running in >>>> Python. >>>> >>>> You can do that be adding code as described in: >>>> >>>> https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/user-guides/debugging-techniques.html#extracting-python-stack-traces >>>> >>>> <https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/user-guides/debugging-techniques.html#extracting-python-stack-traces> >>>> >>>> and triggering a dump of running threads by touching a file in the file >>>> system. >>>> >>>> It might also be helpful if you can work out how to have the system >>>> preserve core dumps from Apache so they can be used to extract a true >>>> process stack trace as that may give a clue. >>>> >>>> Graham >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 24 Oct 2022, at 3:51 am, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@gmail.com <>> wrote: >>>>> >>>> >>>>> Thanks for that suggestion. I passed it on to the site admin made and he >>>>> made the "application-group=%{GLOBAL}" change, but unfortunately it made >>>>> no difference, the segfaults are still occurring as before. Is there >>>>> anything else I can look at? The current configuration is: >>>>> >>>>> WSGIDaemonProcess jmwsgi processes=2 threads=10 \ >>>>> display-name=apache2-jmwsgi locale=en_US.UTF-8 lang=en_US.UTF-8 >>>>> WSGIScriptAlias /jmwsgi >>>>> /usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb/wsgifiles/jmdictdb.wsgi \ >>>>> process-group=jmwsgi application-group=%{GLOBAL} >>>>> >>>>> Would changing to "process=N threads=1" or "processes=1 threads=N" >>>>> provide any useful info? Apache, mod_wsgi and the other web server >>>>> components were all built there (ie, they are not from distro-supplied >>>>> packages.) Are the symptoms consistent with a mismatched library or some >>>>> other build configuration issue? Or conversely, maybe they make that >>>>> unlikely? >>>>> On Friday, October 21, 2022 at 11:48:51 PM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: >>>>> Try changing it to: >>>>> >>>>> WSGIScriptAlias /jmwsgi >>>>> /usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb/wsgifiles/jmdictdb.wsgi \ >>>>> process-group=jmwsgi application-group=%{GLOBAL} >>>>> >>>>> You are possibly using a third party Python module which isn't designed >>>>> to work in Python sub interpreters. That application group value forces >>>>> the main Python interpreter context to be used, which can avoid problems >>>>> with crashes, or thread deadlocks when such broken modules are used. >>>>> >>>>> https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/user-guides/application-issues.html#python-simplified-gil-state-api >>>>> >>>>> <https://modwsgi.readthedocs.io/en/master/user-guides/application-issues.html#python-simplified-gil-state-api> >>>>> >>>>> That option on WSGIScriptAlias has same affect as WSGIAplicationGroup but >>>>> is more specific. For same reason, your use of WSGIProcessGroup is >>>>> redundant as process group setting on WSGIScriptAlias takes precedence. >>>>> >>>>> Graham >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On 22 Oct 2022, at 2:35 pm, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@ <>gmail.com >>>>>> <http://gmail.com/>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> My apologies for the delayed response, I thought I had my google email >>>>>> forwarded to my main email account but... :-( >>>>>> >>>>>> My intent was that the processes run in daemon mode. I had missed the >>>>>> info about the WSGIRestrictEmbedded directive when I went through the >>>>>> doc, I'll ask the admin there to add that. The full configuration for >>>>>> wsgi is: >>>>>> >>>>>> WSGIDaemonProcess jmwsgi processes=2 threads=10 \ >>>>>> display-name=apache2-jmwsgi locale=en_US.UTF-8 lang=en_US.UTF-8 >>>>>> WSGIProcessGroup jmwsgi >>>>>> WSGIScriptAlias /jmwsgi >>>>>> /usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb/wsgifiles/jmdictdb.wsgi \ >>>>>> process-group=jmwsgi >>>>>> # Serve static files directly without using the app. >>>>>> Alias /jmwsgi/web/ /usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb/ >>>>>> <Directory /usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb> >>>>>> DirectoryIndex disabled >>>>>> Require all granted >>>>>> </Directory> >>>>>> >>>>>> The server has a number of virtual hosts and there were a few mod_wsgi >>>>>> "Loading Python" messages in the error log for one of them (for ssl) but >>>>>> nothing looking errorish and only a few, nowhere near the number of >>>>>> segfault messages: >>>>>> >>>>>> [Sat Oct 01 07:50:12.090697 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 731154:tid >>>>>> 140442461062912] [remote *.*.*.*:40566] mod_wsgi (pid=731154, >>>>>> process='jmwsgi', application='www.edrdg.org >>>>>> <http://www.edrdg.org/>|/jmwsgi'): Loading Python script file >>>>>> '/usr/local/apache2/jmdictdb/wsgifiles/jmdictdb.wsgi'. >>>>>> >>>>>> But the wsgi configuration stuff is outside all the virtutal hosts. >>>>>> >>>>>> When the server starts, there are a couple messages in the main error >>>>>> log file like: >>>>>> >>>>>> [Sat Oct 01 06:42:26.499086 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 731041:tid >>>>>> 140442622753728] mod_wsgi (pid=731041): Starting process 'jmwsgi' with >>>>>> uid=33, gid=33 and threads=10. >>>>>> [Sat Oct 01 06:42:26.499518 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 731039:tid >>>>>> 140442622753728] mod_wsgi (pid=731039): Starting process 'jmwsgi' with >>>>>> uid=33, gid=33 and threads=10. >>>>>> >>>>>> and these are followed/interleaved with the "Initializing Python" and >>>>>> "Attach interpreter" messages but after server startup the messages are >>>>>> limited to the sets of three I showed: "Initializing Python" and "Attach >>>>>> interpreter" followed sometime later by the Segmentation fault. >>>>>> >>>>>> Does any of that help? >>>>>> On Sunday, October 16, 2022 at 4:16:09 PM UTC-6 Graham Dumpleton wrote: >>>>>> What other mod_wsgi configuration is there besides the WSGIDaemonProcess >>>>>> directive? That alone only creates a mod_wsgi daemon process group, but >>>>>> does not tell mod_wsgi to use it. Thus cannot tell whether you are using >>>>>> embedded mode or daemon mode. The logs are also odd in that would expect >>>>>> to see other messages in there around when processes are created if >>>>>> using daemon mode, plus an indication of whether a message is being >>>>>> generated from an Apache child process or mod_wsgi daemon process. >>>>>> >>>>>> So can you supply the other parts of the mod_wsgi configuration so can >>>>>> see if properly using daemon mode or not. Also look for logs from >>>>>> mod_wsgi in any per virtual host specific error log file and not just >>>>>> main Apache error log if you separate them. Finally, if you are only >>>>>> intending to use mod_wsgi daemon mode, ensure you add the directive: >>>>>> >>>>>> WSGIRestrictEmbedded On >>>>>> >>>>>> outside of all VirtualHost definitions so that any attempt to >>>>>> intitialise/use Python in main Apache child processes is disabled. >>>>>> >>>>>> Graham >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 17 Oct 2022, at 8:07 am, stuart mcgraw <smcg...@ <>gmail.com >>>>>>> <http://gmail.com/>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I am author of a Flask application running under Linux/Apache mod_wsgi >>>>>>> that is experiencing intermittent, random segmentation faults. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What is unusual is that the mod_wsgi process segfaults are occurring >>>>>>> not at startup when mod_wsgi is loaded, or at when an incoming request >>>>>>> accesses the app, but when the wsgi processes are just sitting there, >>>>>>> quiescent. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From a user's point of view, everything looks fine, the mod_wsgi >>>>>>> processes and the app respond with the right results with no sign of >>>>>>> trouble at the client's browser. But looking at the Apache logs shows >>>>>>> the wsgi processes periodically segfaulting and getting restarted with >>>>>>> no correlated incoming requests. They die sometimes after running for >>>>>>> a few minutes, sometimes after a few hours. There are no incoming >>>>>>> requests to the the wsgi app logged near the time of these crashes. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> For example: >>>>>>> [Mon May 30 22:35:43.040387 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 2575903:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] mod_wsgi (pid=2575903): Initializing Python. >>>>>>> [Mon May 30 22:35:43.099053 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 2575903:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] mod_wsgi (pid=2575903): Attach interpreter ''. >>>>>>> [Tue May 31 01:29:06.434000 2022] [core:notice] [pid 2876203:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] AH00052: child pid 2511562 exit signal Segmentation >>>>>>> fault (11) >>>>>>> [Tue May 31 01:29:07.466268 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 2605661:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] mod_wsgi (pid=2605661): Initializing Python. >>>>>>> [Tue May 31 01:29:07.517413 2022] [wsgi:info] [pid 2605661:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] mod_wsgi (pid=2605661): Attach interpreter ''. >>>>>>> [Tue May 31 04:14:59.405491 2022] [core:notice] [pid 2876203:tid >>>>>>> 139929303559104] AH00052: child pid 2575903 exit signal Segmentation >>>>>>> fault (11) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My wsgi app is still being tested so other than infrequent requests >>>>>>> generated by me and a few other people there is very little traffic to >>>>>>> it. However the web server itself is handling some continuous moderate >>>>>>> volume of traffic to other apps including to C, Python and PHP CGI apps. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What I know about the environment (if any other info would be useful >>>>>>> I'll try and dig it up): >>>>>>> >>>>>>> $ cat /etc/*release >>>>>>> PRETTY_NAME="Debian GNU/Linux 11 (bullseye) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Apache, mod_wsgi, python were all built from source by the site's >>>>>>> administrator. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are (at least) two Python's on the system: >>>>>>> /usr/bin/python3 -- 3.9.2 >>>>>>> /usr/local/bin/python3 -- 3.10.1 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Apachche/mod_wsgi is was supposedly built against python-3.10. From >>>>>>> the http server header: >>>>>>> Apache/2.4.54 (Unix) OpenSSL/1.1.1n mod_wsgi/4.9.4 Python/3.10 >>>>>>> PHP/7.4.23 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Apache .conf file uses: >>>>>>> WSGIDaemonProcess myapp processes=2 threads=10 \ >>>>>>> display-name=apache2-myapp locale=en_US.UTF-8 lang=en_US.UTF-8 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> $ /usr/local/apache2/bin/httpd -V >>>>>>> Server version: Apache/2.4.54 (Unix) >>>>>>> Server built: Oct 13 2022 00:07:38 >>>>>>> Server's Module Magic Number: 20120211:124 >>>>>>> Server loaded: APR 1.6.5, APR-UTIL 1.6.1, PCRE 10.36 2020-12-04 >>>>>>> Compiled using: APR 1.6.5, APR-UTIL 1.6.1, PCRE 10.36 2020-12-04 >>>>>>> Architecture: 64-bit >>>>>>> Server MPM: event >>>>>>> threaded: yes (fixed thread count) >>>>>>> forked: yes (variable process count) >>>>>>> Server compiled with.... >>>>>>> -D APR_HAS_SENDFILE >>>>>>> -D APR_HAS_MMAP >>>>>>> -D APR_HAVE_IPV6 (IPv4-mapped addresses enabled) >>>>>>> -D APR_USE_SYSVSEM_SERIALIZE >>>>>>> -D APR_USE_PTHREAD_SERIALIZE >>>>>>> -D SINGLE_LISTEN_UNSERIALIZED_ACCEPT >>>>>>> -D APR_HAS_OTHER_CHILD >>>>>>> -D AP_HAVE_RELIABLE_PIPED_LOGS >>>>>>> -D DYNAMIC_MODULE_LIMIT=256 >>>>>>> -D HTTPD_ROOT="/usr/local/apache2" >>>>>>> -D SUEXEC_BIN="/usr/local/apache2/bin/suexec" >>>>>>> -D DEFAULT_PIDLOG="logs/httpd.pid" >>>>>>> -D DEFAULT_SCOREBOARD="logs/apache_runtime_status" >>>>>>> -D DEFAULT_ERRORLOG="logs/error_log" >>>>>>> -D AP_TYPES_CONFIG_FILE="conf/mime.types" >>>>>>> -D SERVER_CONFIG_FILE="conf/httpd.conf" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> $ bin/httpd -M >>>>>>> Loaded Modules: >>>>>>> core_module (static) >>>>>>> so_module (static) >>>>>>> http_module (static) >>>>>>> mpm_event_module (static) >>>>>>> authz_core_module (shared) >>>>>>> authz_host_module (shared) >>>>>>> unixd_module (shared) >>>>>>> dir_module (shared) >>>>>>> access_compat_module (shared) >>>>>>> env_module (shared) >>>>>>> alias_module (shared) >>>>>>> log_config_module (shared) >>>>>>> ssl_module (shared) >>>>>>> mime_module (shared) >>>>>>> socache_shmcb_module (shared) >>>>>>> setenvif_module (shared) >>>>>>> cgid_module (shared) >>>>>>> userdir_module (shared) >>>>>>> headers_module (shared) >>>>>>> rewrite_module (shared) >>>>>>> autoindex_module (shared) >>>>>>> negotiation_module (shared) >>>>>>> dav_module (shared) >>>>>>> deflate_module (shared) >>>>>>> info_module (shared) >>>>>>> status_module (shared) >>>>>>> wsgi_module (shared) >>>>>>> evasive24_module (shared) >>>>>>> php7_module (shared) >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "modwsgi" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>>> an email to modwsgi+u...@ <>googlegroups.com <http://googlegroups.com/>. >>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/e06f789f-6023-417e-8b10-1f570adc069cn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/e06f789f-6023-417e-8b10-1f570adc069cn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "modwsgi" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>> an email to modwsgi+u...@ <>googlegroups.com <http://googlegroups.com/>. >>>>> >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/093152d7-26a6-4d52-8c7b-0d4cb643fa95n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/093152d7-26a6-4d52-8c7b-0d4cb643fa95n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>>> "modwsgi" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>>> email to modwsgi+u...@googlegroups.com <>. >>>> >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/363f423b-5be1-4c33-8783-638c0cd72512n%40googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/363f423b-5be1-4c33-8783-638c0cd72512n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "modwsgi" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to modwsgi+u...@googlegroups.com <>. >>> >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/e51f7b06-b0e5-42b3-ac9c-3cc3cb89070en%40googlegroups.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/modwsgi/e51f7b06-b0e5-42b3-ac9c-3cc3cb89070en%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "modwsgi" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop 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