Quoting from Greg's website...
__________________________
The Academy Cinema in Oxford Street, London, was built in 1913 and
was saved from conversion to a shopping arcade in 1928 by Elsie
Cohen of the original Film Society, who proceeded to run it as an
arthouse which is how it was ran till it's closure in 1986.
The posters became a London landmark, in fact very few were used
outside of London, resulting in very small print runs of 3-500.
Most of the posters were printed by the prestigious Westminster
Press and later by Ward and Foxlow.
http://www.rarefilmposters.com/category1770107.html?page=6
______________________________________________________________________
___________________________
So 50 is feasable, especially for a low budget cult film.
Another bit of information to add... 'Ward & Foxlow' are now
'William Evans & Partners' but no longer a Printing Company.
Andy
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2009 12:53:55 +0100
From: evan...@blueyonder.co.uk
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Mean Streets UK Quad 30x40 Original, Beautiful
poster in Near Mint, rolled Condition
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Phil and Greg's info should be respected.
Both been at it for ages, plus Greg has for a long time had loads
of Academy quads, plus artworks, so I'd be confident in him knowing
the background.
I strongly suspect he has a reason for being specific about the
figure and it isn't just his opinion, (but admittedly, that is mine).
The printing method is Letterpress, with the art done in lino cut
by Strausfeld.
Once you've done that, and you're paying Ward & Foxlow £X, them
cutting the print run to 50 is nonsensical.
At the time of this quad selling, I kept my bidding low precisely
because the condition made me cautious of a cache.
When I saw the seller, The Mean Streets and the other Academy quads
he had in a plans chest were like they had just come off the press.
Seemed to have been locked away in decent conditions away for the
last 30 plus years.
At most only the most minor traces of handling, and a great smell!
He was perfectly happy to sell all he had, other than one he had
already lined up with other Academys for Christies.
No reason to suspect a secret sizable cache there.
I was in touch with him after the Christies sale, he was blown away.
Since then I've not seen one being sold that has the condition to
indicate it comes from that lot, (everything looks like it's been
knocking about a while), until Andy's.
You see the Mean Streets reasonably often, more than other Academy
quads, (at least at auction houses), but then there isn't the same
demand for the others.
I can think of Seven Samurai, The Connection, and then I'm
struggling to think of anything off the top of my head that
wouldn't end up in a job lot at an auction house, or stuck in a
dealer's inventory.
Other than the double crown for Zero De Conduite, (awesome), only
ever seen the Reelposter copy of that one.
Whether it was a 300 or 500 run, (tend to think the latter more
likely), it's a great poster.
I'm biased, but I don't think there's any reason to suspect it's
another Peeping Tom.
Cheers,
Rich
On 28 Apr 2009, at 11:12, Andy Neal wrote:
Also with respect, it's just their opinion, which is fine i don't
dismiss it either, everyones entitled to their opinion, mine is
that there were 50. It's a low budget film and this is what I have
been told from someone from Academy one (Little hear say but I'm
more likely to beleive this) Not sure why your quoting the
population of London 36 years later than the film was produced,
little off tangent and irrelevant I feel.
I'm not saying anyones right or wrong here Helmut. Just saying what
I have been told and my opinions. Whether it's 50 or 200 is not
important to me really, it's still a beautiful and very collectable
poster and I am quite sad to sell it in all honesty.
At the time, maybe it was only the known copy!? So 3 other copies,
plus mine. Maybe he has the other 46 do you think?
Andy
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2009 11:53:08 +0200
From: texasmu...@web.de
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Mean Streets UK Quad 30x40 Original, Beautiful
poster in Near Mint, rolled Condition
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Andy,
with all respect, but when it comes to British poster, Greg Edwards
and Phil are two of the oldest and most experienced people around.
Personally, I don't dismiss their opinion as 'trying to guess on
hear say'.
So the poster has been printed for just one cinema. I don't know
how many people lived in London in 1973, but today the population
is about 7,500,000, which should give an idea.
A print run of 50? For a London INSTITUTION that used its posters
for subway advertising? Gimme a break.
300-500 sounds a lot more reasonable to me, especially since the
costs are just about the same, no matter which printing technique
they used. The big chunk of the costs used to be in pre-processing,
so the price for 50 or 500 copies would have been almost the same.
This first changed with the advent of digital printing.
Also, this poster was first offered as 'only known copy', meanwhile
at least three more have survived, apparently all from the same
source, and who knows how many more this guy holds on to.
Helmut
Am 28.04.2009 um 11:00 schrieb Andy Neal:
It's anyones guess really but I am going from what I was told from
someone who worked at the Academy one cinema.
One thing you have to remember is that this was in 1973, Scorsese's
first full feature film of his own ideas, just after his student
films, low budget, a very narrow following (Not a wide apeal) The
poster was printed for one cinema only. 200 seems a little high for
a low budget film such as mean streets. The method of the printing
for the poster is very unique and has been talked about on the
forum and I don't think it was decided how it was actually printed.
I don't think you can compare to normal print runs you had with
Raging Bull.
As far as print runs are concerned, it would be good to get some
knowledge from a print person from this era, and not someone trying
to guess on hear say.
Andy
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2009 09:58:01 +1000
From: p...@cinemarts.com
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Mean Streets UK Quad 30x40 Original, Beautiful
poster in Near Mint, rolled Condition
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Greg Edwards would be correct on the runs of 300-500 for the
Academy quads. It might even be higher for some films that had a
wider apeal (i.e. English language films which arrived with some
reputation preceding them).
Apart from the those used at the cinema itself, they targeted
specific London Underground tube stations in areas that fitted the
Academy's demographic during the period. Back in the halcyon days
of the Academy in the 70s, such popular annual events as the Buster
Keaton Summer Season (a season of Keaton classics in fabulous
prints, accompanied by piano) would see a very wide spread of
London Underground adevertising.
Finally, print runs of 50 were and are simply uneconomic. Unit
pricing back then and now usually works on the basis of 500 to get
the cheapest unit price. Anyone who has done any printing of
anything - posters, books, magazines, catalogues, etc knows that
the more you print the cheaper the unit price.
The thing for everyone to remember (especially younger and/or less
experienced collectors) is that these posters were produced to
promote and advertise the film. They were not created as a
collectors market item - especially back then.
And yes, from time to time, a stash of a quantity of posters do
show up. An unopened roll/rolls forgotten in a corner somewhere
(RAGING BULL advances, anyone?)
Phil
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Evans
To: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 4:10 AM
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Mean Streets UK Quad 30x40 Original, Beautiful
poster in Near Mint, rolled Condition
Looked there too.
I don't mean just now in ebay, I saw the pics you took ages ago.
By boosted I mean whether you brightened/contrasted or fiddled with
the hue/saturation in photoshop.
I'm not against a bit of it especially if it's to compensate back
to better match the original.
In this case I'm just pointing it out because I believe you're
doing yourself and the poster a disservice.
Like I said, it looks day-glo and inferior to the actual colour.
On numbers, I met the same seller, lovely bloke, but didn't seem
particularly knowledgeable to me.
He had a little cache of 4 of them, one of which went on to make
the big price at Christies.
According to Greg Edwards, who I imagine knows a bit about Academy
paper, figure more likely to be in the few hundreds.
He states runs of 3-500, which makes sense given they are letterpress.
But, out of that rough figure, how many survived and are out there
on this title, who knows?
Cheers,
Rich
On 27 Apr 2009, at 18:41, Andy Neal wrote:
How do you mean boosted?
ebay pics always reduce quality when you upload, usually worse when
theres anything with red in it.
Try the gallery pics
Andy
CC: MoPo-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU
From: evan...@blueyonder.co.uk
To: andyan...@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Mean Streets UK Quad 30x40 Original, Beautiful
poster in Near Mint, rolled Condition
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2009 18:16:59 +0100
Have you boosted the pics?
Don't look flattering to me, bit too day-glo looking.
Cheers,
Rich
On 27 Apr 2009, at 17:35, Andy Neal wrote:
Mean Streets UK 30x40 Original Quad
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...em=130302985311
Mean Streets UK 30x40 Original Quad
Size: 30x40
Condition: [b]Near Mint Rolled condition
Free Delivery
Please click here for full photo gallery
Kind Regards
Andy
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