No Bruce that isn't what Sean is saying.
he's saying that IF he had sold one of these
items (and to my knowledge he has not) he refunds
the money to the buyer and then he pursues his
source, which is the way it should be
once his source refuses to pay then he sues that source.
everyone who sold these is not criminal. Some
people have been genuinely defrauded, but not
necessarily by the consignor, if they bought from
an auction house. The auction house has a
fiduciary responsibility, though not a criminal one
his second point is that those buyers whose
purchases were small enough to designate a
lawsuit as difficult should band together in a
class action, making remuneration a greater possibility.
Rich
At 12:36 PM 9/1/2009, Bruce Hershenson wrote:
So you are saying that someone who hypothically
purchased a fake from say, Platinum Posters
should be "working with" Platinum Posters to
join a joint plaintiff suit against the
originators of these fakes, and that Platinum
Posters has no liability towards that person who
purchased a fake from them? Is that the way the law works?
If the joint plaintiff suit against the
originators of these fakes is unsuccessful, or
if no money is recovered, will those who acted
as middlemen have ANY liability towards those
who purchased the items from them?
Bruce
On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Sean Linkenback
<<mailto:[email protected]>[email protected]> wrote:
What did Profiles say when you called/emailed them to ask these questions?
I know they dont have any representatives on
here to read your messages, so I can only assume
you have contacted them directly.
I will say I think it would be horrible if they
(Profiles) started legal proceedings against Ron
Magid like you would have done.
Why would you start legal proceedings against an
innocent party that was duped? Wouldnt you
rather work with that party in holding the
originator of the fakes accountable? I, for
one, would not applaud you for suing innocent
people that were duped but thats just me.
I also wish that all these collectors who have
been cheated and are contacting you privately
would also contact me (or Jim Gresham) so that
1) we can help them get in contact with the
correct investigators at the FBI who are looking
into this case, and 2) discuss with them the
possibility of a joint plaintiff suit against
the originators of these fakes. Many of the
people who have purchased these might have only
purchased one or two items and feel powerless to
do anything about them or to get restitution
from the person(s) they purchased from, but by
joining and acting together, something can and will be accomplished.
What are you saying to these people when they
contact you? I certainly hope you are
encouraging them to do the above and not to stay quiet.
----------
From: MoPo List
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bruce Hershenson
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 9:22 AM
To: <mailto:[email protected]>[email protected]
Subject: [MOPO] What is the responsibility of
auction houses or dealers who sold Universal fakes as middlemen?
I can't help but notice that NONE of the auction
houses or dealers who sold Universal fakes as
middlemen have come forward and admitted to
having done so. The only name that has been
mentioned is Profiles in History and they were "outed".
What is the responsibility of those auction
houses or dealers who sold Universal fakes
towards their customers? If they long ago paid
their consignors, can they simply say, "Sorry,
but I was fooled just as much as you were, and
therefore I have no liability at all?" Can the
buyer sue the people who made the fakes even
though they didn't purchase them directly?
If some auction houses or dealers are making
restitution to those who purchased fakes from
them, is this all going on the honor system? Are
any law enforcement agencies involved in
investigating who the fakes were sold to, and/or
making any efforts to see that restitution is
made by the middlemen, or to prosecute those who made the fakes?
I wish those who unwittingly sold these fakes
would publicly address how they are dealing with
the situation, and whether or not they are
voluntarily making restitution to those who were
cheated. I would think this would not be any
source of embarrassment for them (I have
publicly stated that is is quite likely I myself
would have been fooled by these, if they are as
good as people have said, and therefore I myself
might well have unknowingly cheated people by
auctioning them). But had I done so, I would
have refunded the buyers as soon as I discovered
the scam, and began legal proceedings against
those who sent me the fakes, and I think the
hobby would have applauded me for doing so.
Some of you have made it clear you hate my posts
on this subject. You have ridiculed me or in
essence told me this is none of my business. But
I keep getting contacted by collectors who were
cheated who DO want answers to these questions,
but are afraid to post publicly . I want to help
them not only do I want to help see that right
is done, but also because I want to protect the
integrity of this hobby which provides me with my living.
If anyone has anything of substance to post, I
am all ears. And it is also fine if people who
want to stay out of the public spotlight keep contacting me privately.
Bruce
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