Dave, I think, the best way to approach The question is to look at how Higher income roughly equates to A higher standard of freedom Or perceived higher standard Anyway. Without a love for wisdom A passion for betterment or a greater Range of freedom is a rudderless Boat, a moving cart with no destination. To ask What does it mean To lead a " good" life? Is to begin to think about Just where this cart is going and how It gets there. To a 5th grade teacher Who cares about such things it couldn't be more relevant, I mean You are right it's a serious philosophical question but it's also A very simple one , but my point Is that everyone gets so caught up In the attainment of greater freedom ( an evolutionary drive) that the good Is often overlooked or confused for Freedom for its own sake.
Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 18, 2014, at 8:37 PM, david <dmbucha...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > This is a tangential issue and nobody asked BUT please notice what Pirsig > (via David Granger) is saying about relationship between academia and > civilization.... > > From Granger's paper, called "Dewey and Pirsig in Education": > > > ------------------------------------------------- > The student[s'] biggest problem was a slave mentality which had been built > into [them] by years of carrot-and-whip grading, a mule mentality which said, > 'If you don't whip me, I won't work.' [They] didn't get whipped. [They] > didn't work. And the cart of civilization, which [they] supposedly [were] > being trained to pull, was just going to have to creak along a little slower > without [them]. (ZMM, 175) > Ironically, Pirsig thought, this is in direct contradiction to the academy’s > claim that civilization “is best served not by mules but by free men” (ZMM, > 175). And education is supposedly the means to this freedom. As tragic as > this slave mentality sounds, Pirsig saw that it is unavoidable only if one > presumes that the cart of civilization must be propelled by something outside > itself, by disinterested mule-selves. Whether these mules are in front of or > behind the cart matters little here. In either position, they bespeak of > stubborn, laboring beasts – the polar opposite of artistically-engaged human > beings -- beasts that have no immediate investment in or sense of connection > to the larger cart of civilization." > > ---------------------------------------------------- > > As I read this, proper education is of no importance unless you're interested > in maintaining civilization. The academy, or rather the church of reason, > supposedly says that civilization "is best served not by mules by free men" > (free people) and it supposedly offers education as "the means to this > freedom". And what does it mean to NOT be a mule? What does it mean to be > free, to liberated by this education? I suppose it's just like the man says. > This kind of freedom means that it totally matters whether you're "in front > of or behind the cart" of civilization. In fact, you're an > "artistically-engaged human being" with a personal "investment in or sense of > connection to the larger cart of civilization." The mules say that all this > "matters little". "The stubborn, laboring beasts," by contrast, "have no > immediate investment in or sense of connection to the larger cart of > civilization." > > Same as it ever was, I think we need throw out the money lenders. I mean, the > church of reason has become corrupt in the same sort of way. For the most > part, people think of higher education levels as the means to a higher > income. Otherwise, most dads figure, college is a waste of money. That's not > the kind of calculus that propers civilization forward, obviously. It's not > crazy. Seems sensible, hard to argue with common sense realism. Blah, blah, > blah, as everyone knows. But it's tragically narrow-minded and short-sighted > and if everyone thought like that the whole freakin' deal would crap out in a > hurry. In fact, that might be what's already happening. Or maybe that's just > how stupid it is in America. Sigh. > Look, I know we've all had some hell from bullies and tyrants at school. But > that's not what Pirsig (or Dewey or Granger or any other serious person) is > concerned about with respect to the church of reason or with respect to > Western rationality. This is about some serious shit that is not terribly > relevant to anyone's 5th grade teacher, you know? How can a democracy, like > ours is supposed to be, with a bunch of mules voting? If the progress of > civilization depends on the strength of free people to pull her forward, then > what is the value of real education? > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
