Nick: Thank you, Dan, for the reference to ZMM free download. I found that I could put in a key word/phrase and the pdf document would cite every page where that word/phrase was to be found. This is a great way to be able to resource information...ah! technology. When it has Quality, it is a good thing :)
Mention has been made of Turner's Letter, Persig's reply letter to Turner, and a compilation of first year Lila Squad discussions titled "Lila's Child" Nick Question: Would anyone be kind enough to direct me to these documents or would any one post them for new comers to access and learn from. Thank you Nick: Finally, Patterns of Value has been discussed here recently. It has been said that there is a hierarchy of patterns and that the higher pattern of value has precedent over lower patterns: > Chapter 13 of LILA. >"Just as it is more moral for a doctor to kill a germ than a patient, so it is more moral for an idea to kill a society than it is for a society to kill an idea." Nick Question: Did Pirsig really say this? This cannot be right. Much more towards MOQ is, I believe: > "This observation is impossible in a substance-dominated metaphysics where everything has to be an extension of matter. But now atoms and molecules are just one of four levels of static patterns of quality and there is no intellectual requirement that any level dominate the other three." [Robert Pirsig] Nick: Perhaps, I have taken the germ metaphor out of context and Pirsig does not put forward the concept that an idea killing a society is more moral than a society killing an idea. Also, I suppose that Pirsig can only give us a map to Quality. The ideas of MOQ are just the map and that we are "finally and completely trapped into making quality judgments for" ourselves to climb the mountains and traverse the territory. Thank you: Dan. To conclude, I send my greetings to John and Tuukka. Tuukka, hang in there. I wish you well and right along with you, I, too, am seeking how to reach for greater Quality. Being isolated can lead to quality because it allows one to think more deeply. Being isolated can lead to negative quality because, I believe, it is hard-wired into our biology to be with other people. Further, seemingly through the ages, we have come to value that having "purpose" in our lives moves us closer to quality. Dan seems to find this in his writing. I am still working on finding my purpose. I know what it is "not" though, just as we know what is an essay that lacks quality :) Pirsig gave us the guideline that we can know what Quality is. Charlie Munger, a popular philosopher-business man of today, urges us to always "invert". That is: always turn what you are thinking about to its' opposite, to its' upside-downness. Then take a look at that possibility. That might be an addendum guideline to seeking quality, the realization that knowing what is "not" bringing us towards quality also can help. Here is to finding more Quality and purpose. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html