Hi Jeffrey,
Sorry to have incorrectly interpreted your situation. I don't think that
I've ever encountered someone who does not have some ambition to be a
better dancer or to be perceived as a good partner. In your original
post, you said that he was late because he was paying more attention to
flirting than what was happening with the music/dance. What kind of
reaction is he getting from the women? Is he getting a positive reaction
because he is charming or handsome? If so, he may be getting exactly
what he wants out of the dance and doesn't feel he needs to change.
As I said in my earlier post, maybe a different approach is needed. His
"here comes the heat" comment indicates to me that his defenses were up
and that he was not receptive to the constructive criticism. Maybe he
needs to hear this from a few of the more experienced women in the
community. It wouldn't hurt if they were attractive, too. It seems to me
that it's their opinion that matters to him. Encourage them to explain
how much more fun it would be to dance with him if he were on time and
knew what the next move was. And also to praise him if there is an
improvement. They may also give more insight into what they think is
going on with him.
Good Luck! I hope this has helped!
Chris
[email protected] wrote:
a few comments on the already posted comments:
some time ago i sat down next to the mentioned example dancer (who responded
with a comment to the effect of "here comes the heat") and tried to explain
concepts of number of beats to a step, asked if he had trouble hearing the
rhythm, how his dancing affects the dancing of those around him, etc. after
this his dancing improved somewhat for a few weeks, then back to the
original goofing off.
this person is not a 'hot shot'. 'hot shots' often do become good dancers,
as 'hot shotting' at least shows that they are interested enough to be
really good dancers, but are a bit ahead of themselves. this uncaring person
simply doesn't know what step is next, which direction to go, because he
isn't paying attention.
as for people smiling and having fun: without question this is good, and
important. but not the sole criteria. in this case, for example, the
mentioned person is always grinning; clearly, a well executed dance is not
the reason for it. regularly attending, fun loving, smiling people who don't
care enough about contra dancing to do it correctly on a basic level are not
adding anything positive to the dance, only to themselves. and, in fact,
drive away many people who are interested in contra dancing. i'm sure that i
will get criticized for this, but i would rather this person stop coming to
the dance, then come, having a 'fun' time, and making a less 'fun' time for
others. a sense of community and being tolerant of others is good, but it
goes both ways. the 'uncaring' dancers are not showing any sense of
community/responsibility for the activity that they are participating in.
jeffrey
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Stephen Moore
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 11:00 AM
To: A list for dance organizers
Subject: Re: [Organizers] uncaring "bad" dancers
When I read the post yesterday about the dancers (guys...)
who are late because they're having fun flirting I
immediately thought of one fellow at one of our local dances.
Then Chris writing about a "hot shot" was a very different
picture. The fellow I thought of does this dreamy kind of
doe-eyed dancing/flirting and when I follow him down the set
just about every woman he dances with arrives late, often
because she's having to disentangle herself from his dreamy
allemande or whatever figure. I don't know what can really
be done about that... the power of the dance organizer is
somewhat limited, and besides, I wouldn't want everyone to be
just perfect, because then when I'm in a playful mood (which
is not infrequent) I might have to overly restrain my impulses!
I remember years ago someone saying to me, "Every woman who
leaves dancing with you has a smile on her face.", which may
or may not be true, but it's stuck with me as a measure of
when a dance is going well... if people are smiling and
laughing, the particulars of how the dance is going really
doesn't make too much difference.
Stephen Moore
Lenox, MA Contra Dance
On Jan 29, 2008, at 8:14 AM, Chris Weiler wrote:
Hi Jeffrey,
The name that I've been using for this type of dancer is
"hot shot".
For them it's more about showing off and flourishes than community.
Having danced for a while now, I'm convinced that most people go
through this stage before they move on to being more of a community
dancer. I'm guilty of spending some time dancing like that, too.
My interpretation of the phrase "only here to have fun" leads me to
think that they are more commenting on feeling pressured
and lectured
about their dancing. Maybe if they were approached with
more positive
approach. "I would have enjoyed our dance more if you had
been on time
for the balance." "It's such a thrill when you help me get to the
right person in time for the next move."
I'm getting a little humorous, but I think that I'm making my point.
Make the comments about how we personally experience their
actions and
not about doing it "wrong" and it could get a whole different
reaction.
Maybe I'll take some heat for this, but I believe that
there are very
few "bad" dancers in this world. There are only people who haven't
practiced enough to learn what good and bad dancing means. It just
takes some people longer than others to learn the lessons. They
deserve our patience and some straightforward feedback.
I would love to hear other people's thoughts about this as well.
Chris Weiler
Goffstown, NH
P.S. You didn't miss any previous posts. I compiled some
interesting
e-mails from the Caller's list and sent them to this one.
[email protected] wrote:
i've seen a few replies recently talking about dealing
with certain
types of "bad" dancers. (perhaps i am not receiving some
posts, since
i didn't see the originals that were being replied to). i am
interested in hearing comments on a particular type of
"bad" dancer.
i am referring to people that can be depended on to be late and/or
confused about the next step, but NOT because they suffer
from some
physical infirmity, and NOT because of lack of experience.
they may
have been attending dances for months or years. it is because they
seem to be more interested in flirting with partner then in paying
attention to the dance. they are the type that if spoken to about
their lack of paying attention will excuse themselves by
explaining
that they are "only here to have fun". of course, fun for
them means
less fun for those dancing near them.
comments?
Jeffrey
