ZFS doesn't substitute for good backups. If the machine suffers a catastrophic loss, ZFS isn't going to bring your data back. If you have a good backup, however, you should be able to recover after a period of downtime restoring the data.
On Thu, Jun 14, 2018 at 5:54 PM, Alex Smith (K4RNT) <shadowhun...@gmail.com> wrote: > Am I the only one who instantly thought about ZFS? > > " 'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, > the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all > irrevocably.' Those words were uttered by Judge Aaron Satie as wisdom and > warning... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we’re all > damaged." - Jean-Luc Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie, Star Trek: TNG > episode "The Drumhead" > - Alex Smith > - Kent, Washington (metropolitan Seattle area) > > On Thu, Jun 14, 2018 at 3:45 PM, Chris McQuistion <chris.mcquistion@ > curreyingram.org> wrote: > >> Always a good point. There is NO REPLACEMENT for proper backups! >> >> *Chris McQuistion* >> >> Director of Information Technology >> >> Currey Ingram Academy >> >> 6544 Murray Lane, Brentwood, TN, 37027 >> <https://maps.google.com/?q=6544+Murray+Lane,+Brentwood,+TN,+37027&entry=gmail&source=g> >> >> >> *o* 615.507.3175 *c* 615.525.5877 >> >> www.curreyingram.org >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, Jun 14, 2018 at 9:14 AM Tilghman Lesher <tilgh...@meg.abyt.es> >> wrote: >> >>> All of that is moot if you're keeping offline backups (and maybe even >>> offsite backups? Right? Right?), as the backup ensures that even if the >>> original system becomes completely unavailable, you still have your >>> applications and data. >>> >>> On Thu, Jun 14, 2018 at 1:37 AM, Csaba Toth <csaba.toth...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> My definition of the vendor lock-in is the same. Controller failure is >>>> much less common than than disk failure, but when it happens it can be bad. >>>> In such case moving off the data may not be easy, the controller knew how >>>> it calculated and stored the parity. It's not a rocket science and it can >>>> be forensically determined I guess, but that may require non trivial >>>> effort. I've heard of a PACS system where the controller failure was >>>> forgotten out of the contract (between the hospital and the vendor), but it >>>> happened and it was NOT pretty. >>>> >>>> With LVM it's all software, so you don't even have to move the data >>>> off, if you find any controller with JBOD capability which can show the >>>> disks again to the system. >>>> >>>> I also often come across systems which 10+ years old, still running >>>> fine, but the controllers become my first thought in my mind. The best if >>>> you have some spare one. Still SATA, but yes, PATA for example is getting >>>> really outdated. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jun 11, 2018, 9:46 AM Tilghman Lesher <tilgh...@meg.abyt.es> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> When I think of vendor lock-in, I generally think of the inability to >>>>> move data off of one system. I don't think that's really much of a >>>>> concern, at least if you're working with business systems, and your >>>>> hardware is not more than a few years old. As the disks tend to fail more >>>>> often than the controller, how you formatted and managed the disks isn't >>>>> likely to be the main issue. >>>>> >>>>> The bigger issue that you're going to encounter is a change in >>>>> hardware specification. Imagine that you have a storage room full of IDE >>>>> disks, and you needed to get information off of them, when today, the >>>>> prevailing standard is SATA. Or, if you're into tape backups, imagine a >>>>> room full of backup tapes and being unable to find a working drive that >>>>> takes that specific tape. >>>>> >>>>> On Sat, Jun 9, 2018 at 12:54 AM, Csaba Toth <csaba.toth...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> True. LVM is not remotely equivalent, but can be utilized towards use >>>>>> cases of disk arrays. A well versed RAID controller makes it easy to set >>>>>> up >>>>>> a RAID 50 for example but as you experienced, they can age and things can >>>>>> go wrong. Some of them are true hardware RAID, like lats time I dealt >>>>>> with >>>>>> an AMCC which has PowerPC CPU on board to perform the parity computations >>>>>> and related stuff. But for today's CPUs that's not much. If you have >>>>>> enough >>>>>> spare cards that can be enough fine. >>>>>> One thing I also learned long time ago: make sure to have a BBU and >>>>>> that the BBU battery is charged & functional, otherwise you can be >>>>>> impacted >>>>>> by a significant speed hit because the card won't cache as much / caches >>>>>> differently for data integrity reasons. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 6:53 PM, Chris McQuistion < >>>>>> chris.mcquist...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I don’t think of Linux software RAID as the same as LVM but yes I >>>>>>> would prefer Linux software RAID over hardware RAID because the >>>>>>> performance >>>>>>> is very good and the array is portable. I had a hardware RAID card die >>>>>>> on >>>>>>> me, many years ago, and it made me realize that I was dependent on that >>>>>>> single piece of hardware that the manufacturer (Adaptec) had long since >>>>>>> discontinued. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Jun 8, 2018, at 7:54 PM, Csaba Toth <csaba.toth...@gmail.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Would you favor LVM over "hardware" (quote is half intentional)? My >>>>>>> twin brother's advice is that this way I can avoid vendor lock-in. And >>>>>>> if >>>>>>> something goes south I can still migrate to anything which provides >>>>>>> JBOD. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 8:00 AM, Chris McQuistion < >>>>>>> chris.mcquist...@curreyingram.org> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> and if you "watch cat /proc/mdstat", you can watch the progress as >>>>>>>> your RAID array is built or re-built. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *Chris McQuistion* >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Director of Information Technology >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Currey Ingram Academy >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 6544 Murray Lane, Brentwood, TN, 37027 >>>>>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=6544+Murray+Lane,+Brentwood,+TN,+37027&entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> *o* 615.507.3175 *c* 615.525.5877 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> www.curreyingram.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 9:58 AM Howard White <hwh...@vcch.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Currently messing about with a software raid (md). Found a nice >>>>>>>>> how-to >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> <https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-cre >>>>>>>>> ate-raid-arrays-with-mdadm-on-ubuntu-16-04> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> that included a couple of generally useful commands: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> lsblk -o NAME,SIZE,FSTYPE,MOUNTPOINT >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> cat /prod/mdstat >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Enjoy. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Howard >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>> send an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>>>>>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>>>>>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>>>>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>>> >>>>>> --- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Tilghman >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>>>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>>>> >>>>> --- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>>> >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Tilghman >>> >>> -- >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >>> /nlug-talk?hl=en >>> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "NLUG" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> -- >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "NLUG" group. >> To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group >> /nlug-talk?hl=en >> >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "NLUG" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "NLUG" group. > To post to this group, send email to nlug-talk@googlegroups.com > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nlug-talk+unsubscribe@ > googlegroups.com > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/ > group/nlug-talk?hl=en > > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "NLUG" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to nlug-talk+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Tilghman -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "NLUG" group. 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