I get that, I just don't see where having the OS up but the data gone or the stores disappear uncleanly is really any better? To each his own:)
From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 10:59 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: Re: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests This is a my environment and certain aspects that are less then optimal for an ideal configuration vs your environment situation. It's not that I am wrong, it's that our disasters have lead me down a path where the blips were less painful if the OS didn't die. Your experience may have lead you down a different path which is all to the good. On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Joseph L. Casale <jcas...@activenetwerx.com<mailto:jcas...@activenetwerx.com>> wrote: While you're not wrong, you're not right either:) So your boot vol is local, and your exchange DB's etc are iSCSI: Your san blips, are you any better off? No. It works, it's just scary for some to wrap their heads around... From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com<mailto:sep...@gmail.com>] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 9:32 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: Re: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests It is posible, but what we've discovered is that if you have a SAN connectivity issue you've compilicated your life. We had a long term performance issue and boot to SAN would be problematic. Local storage is cheap cheap cheap. Frankly if I could I would have our Exchange in direct attached storage but it is not up to me, we must spend way more because it says 'SAN'. Steven Peck http://www.blkmtn.org On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:36 AM, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com<mailto:k...@adopenstatic.com>> wrote: Boot from SAN is definitely possible within VMWare Cheers Ken From: Steven M. Caesare [mailto:scaes...@caesare.com<mailto:scaes...@caesare.com>] Sent: Tuesday, 5 April 2011 10:01 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests Boot from iSCSI SAN is possible: http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee619733(WS.10).aspx. There are some specific configuration requirements. There's a boot version of the initiator for Win2K3 as well. I've seen reports of it working within VMWare. -sc From: Kim Longenbaugh [mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com<mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com>] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 9:49 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests Harry, It would be impossible to use the guest-based initiator like the MS software initiator or the EQL Hit kit to connect the OS drive, because, as I understand it, the software initiator doesn't load until the OS boots. Any other drives can be connected via the MS software initiator quite well (or the EQL hit kit). Vmware definitely supports running the msiSCSI initiator inside a guest that is hosted in an ESX server connected via the VM initiators to a VMFS store. the answer to your second question about connecting data drives (sql data/logs, exchange stores) via the host initiator from a VMFS store breaks the EQL technology because the EQL stuff works on the EQL hit kit extensions to work. what was the best option between attaching all drives as VMFS from the host initiator, or attaching the data drives via guest-based initiator using the MS or EQL initiators is the subject of my original post, and the consensus so far from all the replies has been a resounding "it depends..." LOL What other posters have suggested, and what the guys in my shop decided, was to test both ways using a solid tool to measure the performance of the disk subsystem, like IOMeter, perfmon, or in my case, some of the Longitude Monitoring system's tools. ________________________________ From: Harry Singh [hbo...@gmail.com<mailto:hbo...@gmail.com>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 3:30 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: Re: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests Those using the guest iSCSI initatior inside VM guests, are you using that to connect all the drives? OS, Data, logs, DBs ? I don't have the specific reference, but I always thought VMware didn't off support running the MS iSCSI initiator inside a guest windows server VM whose host connects to a VMFS datastore via iSCSI. Those using EQL's -- using VMware's native iSCSI initiator to create disk breaks the app-aware snapshot feature? This is interesting since my existing archeticture, as a result of a reduced feature-set SAN, has always been to create VMFS datastores for new disks. Specifically for exchange 2010 and SQL. H On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Kim Longenbaugh <k...@colonialsavings.com<mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com>> wrote: Thanks, I saw that, and just got the slide deck today. Like you and others have pointed out, there's definitely pros and cons for either choice. From: N Parr [mailto:npar...@mortonind.com<mailto:npar...@mortonind.com>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 12:25 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests Something else you made me remember. If you plan to do MPIO at the Host level then your VMFS disks will be able to take advantage of that. EQ just had a good webex about MPIO at the host level vs. guest level a couple weeks ago, below is the recording. https://dellenterprise.webex.com/ec0605l/eventcenter/recording/recordAction.do?theAction=poprecord&actname=%2Feventcenter%2Fframe%2Fg.do&apiname=lsr.php&renewticket=0&renewticket=0&actappname=ec0605l&entappname=url0107l&needFilter=false&&isurlact=true&entactname=%2FnbrRecordingURL.do&rID=42187702&rKey=bed3095e1947d127&recordID=42187702&rnd=1623196772&siteurl=dellenterprise&SP=EC&AT=pb&format=short ________________________________ From: Damien Solodow [mailto:damien.solo...@harrison.edu<mailto:damien.solo...@harrison.edu>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 12:07 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests File Servers are a bit questionable, but for SQL/Exchange it depends on if you want to use the features of the ASMME for it. If you plan to present any VMFS from the ESX hosts though, definitely install the ESX DSM. If you do VMFS for SQL/Exchange, make sure the virtual SCSI adaptor is the paravirtualized one as it can make a big difference on boxes with heavy IO requirements. DAMIEN SOLODOW Systems Engineer 317.447.6033<tel:317.447.6033> (office) 317.217.6851<tel:317.217.6851> (fax) HARRISON COLLEGE From: Kim Longenbaugh [mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com<mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:04 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests There will be some of each type that you mentioned. File services, SQL 2005/2008, Exchange 2010. I agree that there's some advantages to be gained using the EQL HIT kits, both in the guest and the ESX servers. From: N Parr [mailto:npar...@mortonind.com<mailto:npar...@mortonind.com>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 11:34 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests We use option two here, there are a lot of very good EQ/Dell best practice white papers dealing with this exact topic. You didn't say what's going to be running on your servers. File, SQL, Exchange, etc. But if you don't do iSCSI inside the guest you lose all capability to make use of the integrated EQ tools for snapping DB's etc. The folks that say to use VMFS partitions for everything are probably using SAN's that don't have the capabilities your EQ's do. We have multiple SQL servers with multiple vNics using EQ's iSCSI MPIO overlay inside the guest and it works great. Doing the same thing with my virtualized file server and soon Exchange 2010. ________________________________ From: Kim Longenbaugh [mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com<mailto:k...@colonialsavings.com>] Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 10:46 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: MS iSCSI initiators in VM guests I considered using an "OT" tag, but decided this is not OT for the list. We're having an often heated debate on how to attach data drives in Win2003/Win2008 guests in our new VM 4.1 environment. We use Dell Equallogic iSCSI attached SAN arrays. Some folks say it's best to attach all the drives, whether it's an OS volume (C:\) or data drives, through the Vmware ESX iSCSI initiators, which would force us to use VMFS partitions (having decided again RDMs or NFS partitions). There's also a group that says that only the c:\ drive should be attached using the Vmware ESX iSCSI initiators, and the guests should be attached with guest-based initiators, either the MS one, or the Equallogic-furnished initiator with its own specific DSM. Who uses which method, and what's your pros and cons for each? Thanks Kim ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com<mailto:listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/> ~ --- To manage subscriptions click here: http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/ or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
