Hi, Kenny, Could you please add a topic for next Monday’s (8/7/2017) “PTL & Coordinators Meeting”:
· “ONAP development enforcement for R1 and forward” proposal I would like to get feedback from PTLs and Coordinators first. And then have another three days to get feedback from the community, and hopefully get the approval from TSC at 8/10/2017. Then Integration team will work with LF to add scripts to enforce what we have agreed. Regards, Helen Chen From: <onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org> on behalf of Gildas Lanilis <gildas.lani...@huawei.com> Date: Friday, August 4, 2017 at 6:43 AM To: onap-tsc <onap-tsc@lists.onap.org> Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP Hi, Thanks David for sharing your analysis +1. Big chunk of code should not happen (whatever big mean). That is why when TSC reviewed and approved the “Development Best Practices<https://wiki.onap.org/download/attachments/3245207/ONAP-DevelopmentBestPractices.pdf?api=v2>” earlier in July, I had the motto “If there is 1 word to remember "Commit, commit, commit" multiple times a day”. During that meeting someone brought the issue of submitting code that is not completely done, and the practice of submitting “Gerrit Draft Features<https://wiki.onap.org/display/DW/Configuring+Gerrit#ConfiguringGerrit-Submittingadraftfeature>” was introduced. This “Gerrit Draft Features” practice provides a way for the community to see “code in progress”, to provide early feedback and not commit yet in Master (until the feature is really complete). The unfortunate David’s description of “we’ll build it internally and then upstream the code” demonstrates a lack transparency, working in a silo mode, that a trustfulness open source community must avoid. I agree with Oliver and Lushen that the singularity we are currently experiencing is about bringing in seed code, onetime event. In case of multiple occurrences of such behavior in a single repo, as a community we should simply -2 the code while doing code reviews. Thanks to Steve, who pointed out the CI guidance we have in place in wiki. At the end of the day, in Open Source what matter is working code. And CI disciplines<https://wiki.onap.org/display/DW/Continuous+Integration> helps. Not sure we should spend energy in tooling to control or limit such behavior. I think we have bigger fish to catch now. I would be in favor of educating people and making them realize everything they do is PUBLIC (thinking about their online resume). That should help the community to self-regulate. Also, read the lines story I bring each time we meet on the coder who commit code at 5:30 pm on a Friday<https://wiki.onap.org/display/DW/Continuous+Integration> (fourth bullet)) Some good reading in CI by Jez Humble and David Fairley<https://www.amazon.com/Continuous-Delivery-Deployment-Automation-Addison-Wesley/dp/0321601912> (but that requires much more time) Thanks, Gildas ONAP Release Manager 1 415 238 6287 From: onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org [mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org] On Behalf Of Stephen Terrill Sent: Friday, August 04, 2017 3:01 AM To: onap-tsc@lists.onap.org Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP Thanks for sharing your perspective Lusheng, I think its important to get the perspectives of the projects into these discussions. BR, Steve. From: onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org> [mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org] On Behalf Of JI, LUSHENG (LUSHENG) Sent: 04 August 2017 07:43 To: onap-tsc@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc@lists.onap.org> Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP Dear TSC and ONAP community, As I am reading through this thread, I can certainly appreciate David’s good intention behind the suggestion. Perhaps this is a minority opinion here, but as a PTL and committer I have to say I am also concerned about “enforcing” things such as hard limit on submission LOC. 1. Contributions come in the shapes that they are in. Some large some small. Putting a submission size limit will not change that, but it would impact the integrity of large contributions though. Say someone wants to contribute a new complex function but LOC too large, it is not like he would be able to break this one large contribution into several smaller contributions. The more likely outcome is that he will simply break the contribution into several smaller commits, each smaller than the LOC limit but only fragment of the original contribution file tree. This would make committer’s job much harder because he now must review ALL of these commits together, equal amount of LOC, and spread in multiple submissions. Individual commits like these cannot be reviewed individually effectively because it is difficult to assess its value to the whole project, without mentioning that individual submission may even break the CICD and testing of the project. 2. The “commit small commit often” practice of devops really relies on the rich support of features and branches of git. We essentially have ONLY ONE branch, the master. This is the key reason for why I am not sure we should follow the devops manual to a tee here. None of those sophisticated branching workflows is applicable here. ONAP gerrit is not best suited for being used as dev repo. With this limitation, I would much prefer to have the head of master branch relatively clean and stable, only advanced by good quality, tested, and self-contained contributions, not by work-in-progress fragments. 3. Large submission does not necessarily equal to behind-door development. Gitlab is cheap. Self-formed herds, even individual ONAP projects, can set up their own git server and apply all fancy workflows there, then make the whole contribution to ONAP when they are ready. I actually believe this is more community based development. 4. Studies show that there is a loglog relationship between number of submissions and submission sizes for open source commits. Large submissions do happen, but are rare. We only see more of those now because we are pre-R1, many contributions are ports from OpenO, OpenECOMP, or member companies own code. As ONAP grows, more and more code will be developed along with ONAP, and I have no doubt we will see fewer and fewer mega submissions. 1. With all the above said, I do wish that it would be great if the 36 hour review deadline rule can be flexible based on submission size. Thank you for reading. Lusheng ONAP DCAE From: <onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org>> on behalf of Stephen Terrill <stephen.terr...@ericsson.com<mailto:stephen.terr...@ericsson.com>> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 1:42 PM To: "onap-tsc@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc@lists.onap.org>" <onap-tsc@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc@lists.onap.org>> Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP Hi, It great that David highlighted this need, just a few thoughts from my perspective: - I read that there is general agreement about going for upstream first. Maybe its not about introducing something new actually. When looking at our Wiki, we already have guidance: https://wiki.onap.org/display/DW/Continuous+Integration<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__wiki.onap.org_display_DW_Continuous-2BIntegration&d=DwMFAg&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=qiKb3LQBLje9oy8MjG3MEx1ia4mIocif7RoUY8WQWV8&m=t5dp25cmMjv6cRum8ZeBjkB0d-1VdJqF7AjC3yZ0_Jw&s=u7dbYQ5C7s9xVea7VKhL_KkZI46vTT-t-P3s-9V9qoQ&e=> - We know that the projects are going through a formation and migration and merging, and I can respect the effort that entails. Maybe its enough to highlight this for now that after the “migration/formation” that this is not a great practice. Accepting this may occur during the formation phase and is not a desired habbit, I wonder whether we could simple ask the PTLs when they will be ready to move to continues upstream mode of operation? Leave the projects to define when it makes sense to them in their particular situation. - Anything to do with code styling, best practices, etc. I agree its great to have a desired aligned view. However lets involve the designers and projects, enforcing from “external” may not have traction. My suggestion would be to involve them and have TSC approval based on PTL approval first. Best Regards, Steve. From: onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org> [mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org] On Behalf Of GILBERT, MAZIN E (MAZIN E) Sent: 03 August 2017 18:33 To: Yunxia Chen <helen.c...@huawei.com<mailto:helen.c...@huawei.com>> Cc: eric.deb...@orange.com<mailto:eric.deb...@orange.com>; onap-tsc@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc@lists.onap.org> Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP Thank you Helen. Appreciate the leadership. Mazin Sent through AT&T's fastest network On Aug 3, 2017, at 7:00 PM, Yunxia Chen <helen.c...@huawei.com<mailto:helen.c...@huawei.com>> wrote: Hi, Mazin, The Integration team will take this one as an action item: we will define a list, (there’s other best code practice as well, such as code review etc.). with an implementation plan since we may not able to do everything in R1, and get TSC’s approval. Regards, Helen Chen From: <onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc-boun...@lists.onap.org>> on behalf of "GILBERT, MAZIN E (MAZIN E)" <ma...@research.att.com<mailto:ma...@research.att.com>> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 8:31 AM To: Eric Debeau <eric.deb...@orange.com<mailto:eric.deb...@orange.com>> Cc: onap-tsc <onap-tsc@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-tsc@lists.onap.org>> Subject: Re: [onap-tsc] Enforcing an "Upstream first" approach to ONAP I am ok if the integration team wants to take the task of defining best code practices and guidelines on significant code insertion. I agree with Ash that code that can not be reviewed should not be committed blindly. But we need to form guidelines so we are all following the same practices. Even the concept of significant code is not defined. This is not a trivial effort and I do not want the integration team to be distracted from R1, but I am open for suggestions from the TSC. Let's have the discussion via email. I would also appreciate links to successful code best practices and enforcements adopted by other forums. Mazin Sent through AT&T's fastest network On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:35 AM, "eric.deb...@orange.com<mailto:eric.deb...@orange.com>" <eric.deb...@orange.com<mailto:eric.deb...@orange.com>> wrote: +1 for raising this topic We should avoid 10k LOC patches because it is very complex to review and is not aligned with an open source spirit. I do not believe that we should create another subcommitte to handle such issue. The integration project may be able to detect such behavior and alerts the PTL and TSC I also agree with Dhananjay => We spend too much effort on functional aspects for R1. There is still some issues to setup a full ONAP platform on Vanilla OpenStack. Best regards Eric _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. _______________________________________________ ONAP-TSC mailing list ONAP-TSC@lists.onap.org<mailto:ONAP-TSC@lists.onap.org> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.onap.org_mailman_listinfo_onap-2Dtsc&d=DwICAg&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=IKSC5mg8GeOiSar1dax3GQ&m=rSkZu5gsdRT8HwFjzhd2QXyGHqPCRZUGh5Z88VRAiJs&s=o6YwYnIHiT-aLyFYu-yYBdw3IkZxVziwKVEUvMO7h6c&e=
_______________________________________________ ONAP-TSC mailing list ONAP-TSC@lists.onap.org https://lists.onap.org/mailman/listinfo/onap-tsc
