On Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 6:39 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton <orc...@apache.org> wrote: > Good point, Rob. I am not floating a proposal, more an opportunity for > discussion. Here are some questions: > > 1. When should we conclude that the Initial Committers that have arrived are > all that are coming and we should close the door, with all further committers > being by invitation of the PPMC? >
Friday, September 16th, Midnight UTC. Let's give a reasonable period of time, especially respecting summer vacations. > 2. A person is considered eligible to become a committer when there is an > established pattern of contribution on the project: > <http://community.apache.org/newcommitter.html>. > > 2.1 To what degree should contributions elsewhere -- a prior reputation -- > be taken into consideration? > 2.2 For how long should we do this, if at all? > I think that many former contributors to OOo have a clear advantage over all most other potential contributors to Apache OpenOffice, and this advantage will result in their becoming Committers very fast. This advantage is their existing familiarity with the product, how it is put together and how it works and what users want. This is true for coders, testers, translators, documentation authors, etc. This awareness will allow them to "hit the ground running" and demonstrate merit far faster than someone who is approaching this code base for the very first time. Remember, that becoming a Committer is about commitment to this project, this *Apache* project, and that this commitment is demonstrated not only by a contributors patches to the project, or contributions to the mailing lists or support forums. It is also demonstrated by understanding and applying the Apache Way. This later qualification is not something one would have gained knowledge of from work on legacy OpenOffice. You might gain it from work on other Apache projects. Or you can gain it by working on this project for a while. So to answer your question: I don't think we ever stop taking into consideration work done at legacy OOo, but I think we should always be looking for evidence that this legacy knowledge is leading to valued contributions in the Apache project, and that the contributor is showing that they understand the Apache Way. > 3. What do you expect to see as demonstration that the PPMC is being > even-handed in the invitation of new committers? > I'd like to see evidence that a new person can join the project, who was not involved in OOo, and that they can gain sufficient familiarity with it that they can work on an area of interest, make contributions, have their patches merged in, and based on their demonstrated merit, be voted in as committers. Note that this is more than the voting side of things. In some sense, voting is the easiest part of this. The much harder part is how a new project members, without previous knowledge of OOo or Apache, can get up to speed. In that sense, we need to learn how to be ourselves "mentors" of new contributors. We're starting on that already. The FAQ's on editing the web site, for example, have enabled more people to contribute in that area. We'll want to pay attention to this "new contributor" factor in all of our work. What do we need to do to get new volunteers productive? > 4. Is it understood why the ooo-secur...@incubator.apache.org list is being > created and the safeguards that are intended with regard to the security > under which matters of security are raised? > I think the idea is, that even with the best intentions, a large private list will have inadvertent leaks. So where the subject matter is especially sensitive we limit access even further, to a few experts. In addition to this list, I suggest we maintain a txt file in the PPMC's private repository, to contain the contact information for additional, non PPMC experts who we agree should be consulted in relevant security discussions. > 5. Most important: This is a learning experience for all of us. What do you > want cleared up around these growing-pain considerations? > The above is a good start. > - Dennis > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rob Weir [mailto:rabas...@gmail.com] > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 14:34 > To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Project + PPMC Growing Pains > > Is this intended as a blog post? It reads like one. In particular I > don't see any proposals to discuss. > > -Rob > > On Jul 12, 2011, at 4:30 PM, "Dennis E. Hamilton" <orc...@apache.org> wrote: > >> We are just one month into being the Apache OpenOffice.org Podling. It is >> useful to interesting to take stock of all that is happening and where we >> are. >> >> The main activity that we are all holding our breath over is the >> reconstitution of the code base under Apache. There is also concern for the >> documentation and web sites and how they fit under an Apache umbrella. >> >> Depending on their interests and specialties, not everyone here is >> immediately able to contribute much. We are in the process of organizing >> and bringing over and IP-scrubbing the initial artifacts for the project >> that will be the foundation for further work. There is not much to get our >> teeth into in terms of actual development until that is sorted out. (E.g., >> we don't have a bug tracker yet and the documentation, localization, and >> user-facing folk, including marketing, are still wondering how our project >> will accommodate them.) >> >> Meanwhile, there is also how we organize ourselves to operate as an Apache >> project. >> >> - Dennis >> >> 1. BOOTSTRAPPING COMMITTERS AND THE PPMC >> 2. HOW LONG IS THE OPEN DOOR OPEN? >> 3. WHAT WILL IT TAKE TO BE A COMMITTER AS TIME GOES ON? >> 4. WHEN BEING MORE PRIVATE THAN PRIVATE IS IMPORTANT >> >> >> 1. BOOTSTRAPPING COMMITTERS AND THE PPMC >> >> The set of Initial Committers is a self-selected group who added their names >> to the Initial Committers list on the original incubator proposal. That's >> how the podling is bootstrapped. Likewise, ooo-dev participation is fully >> self-selected, and it will stay that way. >> >> This means that we are a group of people who have not worked together as a >> single Apache project community before, even though there are a variety of >> mutual acquaintances and associations in the mix. >> >> Of the Initial Committers, a subset were eager to be on the project and have >> arrived. That is the overwhelming source of the current 54 committers, 41 >> also being on the PPMC. >> >> 2. HOW LONG IS THE OPEN DOOR OPEN? >> >> There are still about two-dozen Initial Committers who have not yet >> registered an iCLA. We don't know if they are arriving or not. One issue is >> when to close the door on initial committers who have taken no initiative to >> be here, although reminders have been sent out. >> >> It is also the case that all initial committers are welcome to participate >> in the PPMC but not all have taken action to do so. At some point, the PPMC >> will not grow automatically and that also needs to be resolved. >> >> 3. WHAT WILL IT TAKE TO BE A COMMITTER AS TIME GOES ON? >> >> We vote on other committers the same as any [P]PMC. The addition of two >> invited committers has already been reported. >> >> One thing that concerns the PPMC (who, for all but two members, walked >> through an open door) is how and when do we move from consideration of >> previous reputation and being known to some of us to a situation where >> contribution on the podling is the determining factor. We're working our >> way through that. The PPMC is also concerned that, although the addition of >> new committers and new PPMC members is carried out in private, we be >> transparent about how we are conducting ourselves and that we demonstrate >> that we are even-handed about it. >> >> It is not clear what the ooo-dev community wants to see and what the >> understood progression to the normal rules for invitation of committers >> should be. >> >> >> 4. WHEN BEING MORE PRIVATE THAN PRIVATE IS IMPORTANT >> >> The PPMC is responsible for dealing, quietly and privately, with security >> matters and their resolution. The security@ team informs us that because we >> have so many members who are unknown here and also to each other at this >> point, a limited ooo-secur...@incubator.apache.org list is essential. We >> need to identify those few among us who have appropriate skills and >> sensibilities around security matters and who can keep their work secret >> when that is appropriate. >> >> For this, we want to know who has been on the security teams of >> OpenOffice.org and who happen to be here also. There will also be >> cross-communication with other security teams that operate on the same code >> base, or in some cases, that operate on the same document formats. >> >> We will be going ahead with the creation of the private ooo-security list >> for that purpose. What we are waiting for is identification of three >> moderators who are distributed around the earth's time zones well enough to >> provide moderation of incoming reports in something approximating 24/7 >> coverage. >> >> [end] >> > >
