On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 7:57 PM, Dave Fisher <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi Dennis,
>
> I am under impression that the license for everything on OOo is PDL, yet 
> almost nothing fulfills the terms.
>
> Copyrights are with the Initial Writer. If I can find an Initial Writer I 
> will mark it - pretty much only in <META> tags although that is whose OOo 
> back in 2000/2002 created or changed the page or some lists in some places.
>
> As far as copyright where there is no identified Initial Writer should we:
>
> (1) Have no copyright.
> (2) Put the ASF copyright in place.
> (3) Put an Oracle copyright on it.
> (4) Put an OpenOffice.org copyright on it.
>
> We can't do (3) we're not Oracle. We should stop doing (2).
>
> Unless there is an argument in one direction or another I'll do (1) by Lazy 
> Consensus.
>

What does it mean to "do (1)"?  Are you saying to remove the notice in
the appendix?


> I recommend that as we replace pages with AOOo policies that we create mdtext 
> replacements as fresh files.
>
> On Sep 7, 2011, at 4:11 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>
>> Dave,
>>
>> It would seem that these (few, I believe we're told) can be handled the same 
>> as unclear provenance anywhere in the code base and its dependencies.
>>
>> The ideal time to clean these up would be when the site is under the 
>> OpenOffice.org domain name but actually hosted on Apache infrastructure.  
>> That gives complete ability to make all of the adjustments that are needed, 
>> including the numerous minor ones to connect to the Bugzilla, etc.
>>
>> I'm not clear how migration of the wiki is impacted, unless you mean the 
>> proposed movement of material now on static web pages into the wiki?
>
> That is my concern. Kay will need to assure that we know which wiki pages 
> came in as "PDL" as I think they'll need to stay that way.
>
>>
>> Exactly where are you finding these PDL license notices?  The first one I 
>> found was on the "Open Office.org 3 Installation Guide", a PDF (or ODT) 
>> reachable from <http://download.openoffice.org/common/instructions.html>.  
>> If we *don't touch it* can't it be retained until a permissively-licenses 
>> alternative is needed?  I don't see a reason to be concerned that the 
>> authors/contributors did not properly execute the instructions of the 
>> license they have offered.
>
> That's not the concern, the concern is if StarOffice, Sun, and/or Oracle lost 
> the paperwork. I suppose should we be presented with a copy of the PDL from 
> an Initial Writer then we fix the issue.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
>>
>> - Dennis
>>
>> RELAXED RETAIN, SUPPLEMENT, AND REPLACE SCENARIO
>>
>> If the notices are always in standalone documents such as the Installation 
>> Guide, I don't see any problem making them available the same way they are 
>> now.  They should simply be left intact.  They can be replaced by 
>> non-derivative replacements later, when there are Apache OOo releases that 
>> require different information.  I don't see why we have to hurry.  
>> Instructions for existing releases remain valuable to keep around.  I 
>> suggest preserving them right where they are, where people expect to find 
>> them.
>>
>> When there are releases from Apache OOo, supplementary documents could be 
>> offered.  That would be another way to provide specific information 
>> applicable to later releases.  I see considerable time before these 
>> PDL-licensed documents need to be supplanted. They might be retained for a 
>> very long time.
>>
>>
>> - Dennis
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Dave Fisher [mailto:[email protected]]
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2011 14:33
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: Re: Concerns about all PDL website material
>>
>>
>> On Sep 7, 2011, at 2:16 PM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Dave Fisher <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> I am stuck on a licensing issue with the OpenOffice.org website and I 
>>>> begin to doubt if can do much with it other than rehost and correct 
>>>> obvious changes in policy.
>>>>
>>>> Please look at http://www.openoffice.org/licenses/PDL.html
>>>>
>>>> (Whether the PDL is category A for Apache is a follow up, but there is no 
>>>> point without resolving the following.)
>>>>
>>>> Specifically look at:
>>>>
>>>>> Required Notices.
>>>>> You must duplicate the notice in the Appendix in each file of the 
>>>>> Documentation. If it is not possible to put such notice in a particular 
>>>>> Documentation file due to its structure, then You must include such 
>>>>> notice in a location (such as a relevant directory) where a reader would 
>>>>> be likely to look for such a notice, for example, via a hyperlink in each 
>>>>> file of the Documentation that takes the reader to a page that describes 
>>>>> the origin and ownership of the Documentation. If You created one or more 
>>>>> Modification(s) You may add your name as a Contributor to the notice 
>>>>> described in the Appendix.
>>>>> You must also duplicate this License in any Documentation file (or with a 
>>>>> hyperlink in each file of the Documentation) where You describe 
>>>>> recipients' rights or ownership rights.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> and
>>>>
>>>>> Appendix
>>>>> Public Documentation License Notice
>>>>> The contents of this Documentation are subject to the Public 
>>>>> Documentation License Version 1.0 (the "License"); you may only use this 
>>>>> Documentation if you comply with the terms of this License. A copy of the 
>>>>> License is available at __________________[Insert hyperlink].
>>>>> The Original Documentation is _________________. The Initial Writer of 
>>>>> the Original Documentation is ___________ Copyright (C)_________[Insert 
>>>>> year(s)]. All Rights Reserved. (Initial Writer 
>>>>> contact(s):________________[Insert hyperlink/alias]).
>>>>> Contributor(s): ______________________________________.
>>>>> Portions created by ______ are Copyright (C)_________[Insert year(s)]. 
>>>>> All Rights Reserved. (Contributor contact(s):________________[Insert 
>>>>> hyperlink/alias]).
>>>>> NOTE: The text of this Appendix may differ slightly from the text of the 
>>>>> notices in the files of the Original Documentation. You should use the 
>>>>> text of this Appendixrather than the text found in the Original 
>>>>> Documentation for Your Modifications.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Does it ever actually require that someone fill in the blanks in the
>>> Appendix?  I see that it requires one to duplicate the notice in the
>>> appendix.  And it permits (but does not require) initial writers and
>>> contributors to add their names to the Appendix.
>>
>> If no one seems to ever provide this information then what can we assume? If 
>> there is no Initial Writer then who holds the copyright? Where's the 
>> paperwork? Where does that leave us? Square one on the website and anything 
>> derived from PDL?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>>
>>>
>>>> I can find no answer to the question about who are the initial writers and 
>>>> further contributors are for all most all web pages. There are some that 
>>>> have meta tags, but that is not following the terms.
>>>>
>>>> Can anyone provide help here? Do most pages have an "INitial Writer" and 
>>>> "Contributor" of Oracle Corporation?
>>>>
>>>> Would we need to see if the archives from prior to the kenai migration 
>>>> have enough history to determine "Initial Writers" and "Contributors"?
>>>>
>>>> Where are these appendices?
>>>>
>>>> I don't see any point in working on the OOo website or transfers to MWiki 
>>>> or CWiki without clarification.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dave
>>
>
>

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