Please unsubscribe me from all OpenEHR list. Yes, I tried unsubscribing it from the link but never have any success.
Thanks. On Sat, Sep 19, 2015 at 11:40 AM, William Goossen <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi all, > > Great references and food discussion! > > But, I must admit that I do not believe in any universal truths and I do > distrust anyone assuming to have one. So the point should be imho to > question if BFO is useful? definitely, but universal truth???? No way.! > Is use of ontology necessary for learning about reality? Of course. And > can it help with information modeling as abstraction of reality ? That > point was made in the on this list very heavily critiqued paper by Blobel, > Brochhausen and myself a year ago. It is good to see the OpenEHR community > look different and more positively at this aspect of two level modeling[1]. > > [1] > > http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1386505613002013 > > > Met vriendelijke groet / With kind regards, > > > dr. William T.F. Goossen > > > directeur Results 4 Care B.V. > De Stinse 15 > 3823 VM Amersfoort > the Netherlands > > telefoon +31654614458 > > e-mail: [email protected] > [email protected] > skype: williamgoossenmobiel > kamer van koophandel 32133713 > http://www.results4care.nl > http://www.results4care.eu > http://results4care.wikispaces.com/ > http://www.linkedin.com/company/711047 > http://results4care.wikispaces.com/3.+Cursussen+Nederlands > ------------------------------ > Van: [email protected] > Verzonden: 19-9-2015 18:00 > Aan: [email protected] > Onderwerp: openEHR-clinical Digest, Vol 41, Issue 8 > > Send openEHR-clinical mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of openEHR-clinical digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. RE: book recommendation - basic formal ontology (BFO) for > biomedicine (Koray Atalag) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2015 12:17:55 +0000 > From: Koray Atalag <[email protected]> > To: For openEHR clinical discussions > <[email protected]> > Subject: RE: book recommendation - basic formal ontology (BFO) for > biomedicine > Message-ID: > <b1ce708e5c614f4bb990e32cc5f03ad4dbf45...@uxcn10-6.uoa.auckland.ac.nz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I think within the timeframe stated by Tom we will definitely see these > two worlds coming closer and producing some tangible benefits. Did you all > notice an increase in research in this area these days? Just my quick 2 > cents....still on travel > > > > Cheers, > > > > -koray > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: openEHR-clinical [[email protected]] on > behalf of Thomas Beale [[email protected]] > Sent: Tuesday, 8 September 2015 7:14 p.m. > To: For openEHR clinical discussions > Subject: Re: book recommendation - basic formal ontology (BFO) for > biomedicine > > > Daniel, > > nice observations and thanks for the references - I had intended to > circulate the first one as well, at some point. For my part, I think > ontology will become useful in information modelling precisely for the > reason that it offers ways of representing distinctions between real world > referents and the things that refer to them (information entities). In > other words, to help the IT sector understand 'how to model'. Historically > it has been completely confused (I would go so far as to say not even > conscious) of the difference between real world entities and events and the > information items that document them. > > With no understanding of the in-principle divide between ontological and > epistemological points of view (or equivalently of Popper's 3 worlds), > information modelling can't possibly achieve much clarity or computability. > > So in agreeing with you, I would add that ontology-thinking is not a > recipe for how to do information modelling, but it is useful for > understanding what not to express in information models - mind-independent > truths. > > - thomas > > On 08/09/2015 01:23, Daniel Karlsson wrote: > Dear All, > > agree partly with Ian's assessment, i.e. about the messiness. While I much > appreciate what I have read, and I've had much help from earlier texts from > the authors (as I'm sure I will from this book), there is in the medical > informatics community a widespread belief that the position held by (some > part of) the BFO community is undisputed and sort-of final. There are still > issues which requires careful consideration, especially regarding > information artefacts and the is-about relationship [1, 2], but also about > e.g. dispositions [3], and functions [4]. > > Additionally, while ontologies deal with what is universally true, it is > my belief that universal truth takes, and should take, the back seat > compared to user needs and practicality in information modelling. > First-world (using Popper's ontology [5]) ontologies are outcomes of our > understanding of the physical world and evolve as science evolves (at least > good ones). Information models and other second-third-world ontologies are > always constructs and, like with fictional characters, nothing can be > discovered by examining those models in addition to what has been > explicitly stated. For this reason, ontology as a method isn't as helpful > for information modellers as it is for others. > > 1. > https://www.researchgate.net/publication/266021648_An_Ontological_Analysis_of_Reference_in_Health_Record_Statements > > 2. http://www.amazon.com/Aboutness-Carl-G-Hempel-Lecture/dp/0691144958 > > 3. http://www.amazon.com/Dispositions-Stephen-Mumford/dp/0199259828 > > 4. > http://www.amazon.com/Functions-Biological-Artificial-Worlds-Philosophical/dp/026211321X > > 5. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popper%27s_three_worlds > > /Daniel > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.openehr.org/pipermail/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org/attachments/20150919/b15e5a75/attachment-0001.html > > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > openEHR-clinical mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org > > ------------------------------ > > End of openEHR-clinical Digest, Vol 41, Issue 8 > *********************************************** > > _______________________________________________ > openEHR-clinical mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical_lists.openehr.org > -- -Julian
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