Hello Dennis My path: Computer operator, duveloper, system programmer, DBA.
About developers: they do not see the whole picture, do not understand limitations etc.. I had a call from the guy who is charge of a project. The database creates about 10 MB of archive logs every 3-4 minutes, and is on remote site. He come over to discuss the possibility of implementing a stand by database at our main site. When I asked him the bank width to the remote site he told me: fast, 256KBps. A simple calculation was enough to explain to him that he creates much more data then the pipe line can carry. Boy was he suprised. Yechiel Adar Mehish ----- Original Message ----- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 6:51 PM Gene - C'mon ya gotta give us more details. I have heard that most DBAs either come from developers or sys admins, but I can't recall a former sys admin, or maybe they just didn't mention it. I am curious about your observations on the best and worst qualities of each variety. I feel that a former developer might make a better development DBA because he/she might understand things from the developer's perspective. I could see where it might take a developer turned production DBA awhile to understand a systems perspective. If the developer only created code on a PC, it might take awhile to really get a system-wide perspective (or never). Maybe you'll give me a better appreciation for my sys admin. Dennis Williams DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 11:11 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Actually some of the worst DBA's come from the development track. IMHO, the best DBAs are from the systems world :). Of course this doesn't mean all systems ppl make good dba's or all developers make bad dba's. This is only from my experience. Gene *Let the Wars begin, NOT* >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/30/02 11:08AM >>> I feel that it is hard to draw the lines between Application and Production DBA's. For example where would you place the DBA that "maintains" SAP? Without the application knowledge he/she/it wouldn't get very far. Also I have been wondering something and this thread seems a good place to ask. Is there a historical feud between DBA's and Developers? Coming from a consulting/software house I find some of the comments funny but can't believe that there is that quantity of bad developers. Most of the DBA's we deal with have come up through the ranks and started as developers. >From: "Ron Rogers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: So, What is a 'Production DBA'? >Date: Thu, 30 May 2002 04:48:29 -0800 > >Rachel, > I agree with your short list of the areas of responsibilities but I >would change the word "application" to "development". An application >DBA, from the people I have talked to, is quite busy performing the >upgrades and patches that accompany the Oracle Applications. The >applications database generally has many, many tables, triggers and >constraints and is constantly the target for upgrades and patches from >Oracle. It is a time consuming task as the majority of the different >applications (financial, HR, Purchase Order, etc) have "hooks" into each >different package and are so intertwined that any small fix in one >involves patches for the others. There are only a few user defined >tables as each package has their own named tables that are partially >shared between packages. There is very little if any work you can do on >the application code because it is so intertwined and customized when it >is installed. Any upgrades require that the "customization" be reworked >to make it fit into the new version of the application package. > It takes a longer time to install than a standard database, on the >magnitude of days, and requires a dedicated and investigative mind set >to maintain. > >To the list you created I would add: >Help desk call recipient, >network support, >client support, >software and hardware evaluation, >"whipping" post, >IT team member (possibly team leader), >self driven, >office coffee maker, >consumer of various liquids. > >Ron >ROR mª¿ªm > > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/29/02 04:50PM >>> >that's not a bad definition :) > >seriously, everyone will have their own definition, mine is: > >production dba -- responsible for all databases that are considered >"production". this includes but is not limited to: > >backups >recovery testing >contingency testing >production performance tuning (should mostly be database tuning as SQL >really should be tuned at the development stage, with information >passed back from the production DBA) >documentation of all procedures >space management on production systems, including capacity planning >and >projection of growth >change management >monitoring external data loads into production database >health checks on production database > >application dba -- responsible for all databases in which developers >have access. responsibilities: > >SQL tuning (not SQL coding!) >database design, in conjunction with the developers >any and all changes to the application schema >working with the production DBA to ensure production performance (see >SQL tuning!) >backups (these might be weekly offline backups, as development is >usually less critical but then again maybe not) >as deadlines creep closer, the "weekends off" may not be > >this is just the "short" list > >I've usually been both the production and application dba where I've >worked. > >Rachel > > >--- Peter Barnett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > We are having this debate. What is a 'Production > > DBA'? Right now all of the DBAs do some of > > everything. In an effort to focus more DBA time on > > infrastructure, damagement is floating the idea of > > Production and Applications DBAs. The DBA group has > > loosely translated this into the group that is always > > on-call and the group that gets their weekends off. > > > > I would appreciate some input from those of you who > > are Production DBAs. > > > > > > > > ===== > > Pete Barnett > > Lead Database Administrator > > The Regence Group > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup > > http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com > > -- > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > > -- > > Author: Peter Barnett > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 > > San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing > > Lists > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To REMOVE yourself from this mail >ing list, send an E-Mail message > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup >http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com >-- >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com >-- >Author: Rachel Carmichael > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 >San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists >-------------------------------------------------------------------- >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). >-- >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com >-- >Author: Ron Rogers > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 >San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists >-------------------------------------------------------------------- >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message >to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Jay Wade INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Gene Sais INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Yechiel Adar INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
