On 23 May 2018 at 15:23, Greg Sheremeta <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On Wed, May 23, 2018 at 2:38 AM, Stian Thorgersen <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >> >> On 22 May 2018 at 22:23, Andres Galante <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Leslie has been meeting with different team to take this decisions based >>> on their requirements and roadmaps. She is on vacation this week so we can >>> probably continue this discussing next week. >>> >> >> I believe we're different as we provide pages exposed directly to >> end-users, not only to admins/developers. Look at Angular for example they >> still support IE9-11. >> >> +1 Let's continue the discussion next week >> >> >>> >>> Here is my reasoning: >>> >>> IE11 is a burden, not only because we can't use css variables and grid >>> among other modern CSS features but also because it increases the time of >>> development to write fallbacks and testing and it makes the codebase harder >>> to maintain. >>> >>> Patternfly next beta will out during the next 6 month-ish and a stable >>> version probably by the end of the year or beginning of the next. By the >>> time we have a stable version and projects start adopting it, it's a safe >>> assumption that IE11 will be irrelevant. >>> >> >> I'm not sure when IE11 will be irrelevant. Remember how long IE6 stuck >> around after it was EOL? It was crazy. We even had a visit from IE6 (and >> IE5) on keycloak.org this year. >> > > "Hi kind person! Looks like you are using Bad Technology. Let us help you > ... install this nice Firefox over here." >
lol - we can just make a lil' javascript alert for those using IE11. I'd go for Chrome though ;) > > /problem > > Greg > > >> >> >>> >>> Does it make sense? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 5:01 PM, Stan Silvert <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Maybe we can load a polyfill when we detect IE11? >>>> >>>> Would this work for all the new features you plan to use Andres? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 5/22/2018 3:31 PM, Stian Thorgersen wrote: >>>> >>>> On keycloak.org we have ~5% on IE11 this year. Of IE users 95% of our >>>> users are on IE11. >>>> >>>> Looking at https://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php there's 2.81% for >>>> IE11. On http://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/desktop/wo >>>> rldwide it says 7.17%, which I assume is mostly IE11. They don't give >>>> details on individual versions as far as I can see. >>>> >>>> From my understanding there's still a lot of folks on Windows XP in the >>>> world and a good proportion has not updated to Edge. I remember how long it >>>> took to get rid of IE6. >>>> >>>> For RH-SSO and Keycloak we have login pages as well as the account >>>> management console that both should be available to most users. Available >>>> is subjective of course, but if there's CSS variables used which is not >>>> supported at all on IE11 I would assume it would look very bad on IE11? >>>> >>>> On 22 May 2018 at 21:05, Andres Galante <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Stian, >>>>> >>>>> How much of that IE traffic is IE11? >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 3:11 PM, Stian Thorgersen <[email protected] >>>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> According to http://gs.statcounter.com/b >>>>>> rowser-market-share/desktop/worldwide >>>>>> >>>>>> IE11 is still more popular than Edge. >>>>>> >>>>>> I get the same numbers from keycloak.org. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 22 May 2018 at 20:07, Stian Thorgersen <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Is the world really ready to move on from IE11? For admin facing >>>>>>> apps I don't see it as a problem, but what about end-user facing apps? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 18 May 2018 at 10:53, Guillaume Vincent <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> this is a good news, thank you patternfly ! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 1:22 PM, Andres Galante < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Stan, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Yes! it means we'll go back to use CSS variables following the >>>>>>>>> same 2 tier variable system >>>>>>>>> <https://css-tricks.com/theming-with-variables-globals-and-locals/> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> We'll also be able to use CSS grids to build layouts :) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 8:14 AM, Stan Silvert <[email protected] >>>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I'm quite happy to ditch IE11. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Does that mean PatternFly Next will use CSS variables instead of >>>>>>>>>> preprocessor variables? Eliminating the preprocessor will make me >>>>>>>>>> double >>>>>>>>>> happy! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> For our app we want to allow an administrator to do simple theme >>>>>>>>>> changes from the admin console. This gets really easy to implement >>>>>>>>>> if the >>>>>>>>>> app doesn't need preprocessing. If we have to use a preprocessor >>>>>>>>>> then it >>>>>>>>>> becomes extremely complicated. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Stan >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 5/16/2018 4:55 PM, Leslie Hinson wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hey Fliers >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> At the last PatternFly Next update, the topic of IE11 browser >>>>>>>>>> support came up. Specifically, the question on whether or not we >>>>>>>>>> needed to >>>>>>>>>> support it moving forward. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> As a result, we wanted to follow up to ensure we understood >>>>>>>>>> PatternFly users' browser support roadmap. From what we've been able >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> gather, we learned that the majority of PatternFly users that are >>>>>>>>>> interested in migrating to PatternFly-Next are comfortable proceeding >>>>>>>>>> without IE11 support moving forward. We will continue to have PF3 >>>>>>>>>> for any >>>>>>>>>> users that still require that level of support, however we don't >>>>>>>>>> believe >>>>>>>>>> that IE11 support is worth the cost for this next major version. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks to everyone that raised this concern as well as those that >>>>>>>>>> provided input to help us make this decision. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Leslie Hinson >>>>>>>>>> PatternFly Lead, UXD >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> PatternFly mailing >>>>>>>>>> [email protected]https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/patternfly >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> PatternFly mailing list >>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/patternfly >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> PatternFly mailing list >>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/patternfly >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Guillaume Vincent >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Senior FrontEnd Engineer >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>> <https://red.ht/sig> >>>>>>>> TRIED. TESTED. TRUSTED. <https://redhat.com/trusted> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PatternFly mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/patternfly >> >> > > > -- > > GREG SHEREMETA > > SENIOR SOFTWARE ENGINEER - TEAM LEAD - RHV UX > > Red Hat NA > > <https://www.redhat.com/> > > [email protected] IRC: gshereme > <https://red.ht/sig> >
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