Or the "Tercerista, " in the FSLN? Daniel Ortega Saavedra - [ Translate this page ] ... cuyo seno Ortega desempeñó el cargo de coordinador. Miembro del grupo 'tercerista' del FSLN, la facción más moderada de las tres que lo conformaron durante ... http://www.gratisweb.com/ladron16/dortega.htm M.P.
4/24/02 8:51:21 AM, "Devine, James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I don't understand your position of these issues, Louis. Are you opposed to >cross-class alliances (such as the "popular front" that Dmitrov advocated)? >but aren't a lot of the third-world causes you support organized as >cross-class alliances? for example, wasn't Peron's movement a cross-class >one? > >Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] & http://bellarmine.lmu.edu/~jdevine > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Greg Schofield [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >> Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 7:11 AM >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Subject: [PEN-L:25350] Re: Re: Re: Re: Le Pen triumph thanks to >> ultra-leftists >> >> >> Louis this is more guilt by historical association. what >> happens in history is obviously complex, contradictory and >> all too often ironic. Simply making a simple reduction of the >> Popular Front to siding with the bourgeousie, is not about >> the Front at all but rather a more abstract question >> misplaced in this context. >> >> Confronted with a massive reactionary attack Dimitrov simple >> gave voice in clear style to creating not some limited and >> secartian united front (which had been semi-offcial policy >> since the year dot and is the only form of unity a sectarian >> the limited left can have) but forming a political unity in >> the mass of the population itself (ie by-passing the fomal >> unities which you seem intent on foiting on the Popular Front). >> >> Dimitrov did not speak of parties but classes and sections of >> classes (ie not the political representatives but the classes >> themselves) the role he pushed forward for communists was to >> be the rock upon what all else could be built. As I said the >> Australian experience while having many stalinist warts was >> explosive and at the rank and file level led to all soughts >> of people working together and putting ideological >> differences aside while hammering out a common platform >> loosely connected with the main anti-fascist thrust of the Front. >> >> Hence in this period there was an explosition of proletarian >> culture, education and mobilization, a magnet which drew in >> people from every concievable position from conservative >> Christians to truely liberal members of the bourgeoise, to >> shop-keepers and the destitute (ie the very sections and >> classes which Dimitrov identified and which CAME UNDER >> PROLETARIAN LEADERSHIP - which bureacrats worked hard to >> convert into CP power). >> >> And all of this when Stalin is painted as Uncle Joe all >> seeing and all knowing demi-god, where party bureacracies >> fought a long and later successful battle against THE VERY >> ELEMENTS UNLEASHED BY THE POPULAR FRONT staretgy. >> >> Contradiction, irony, complexity - no simple formula of >> Popular Front = collaboration. >> >> We can either explore our history to understand the complex >> interactions which produced Spain, or we can look for >> dynamics long hidden by the official position of Trotskism >> and Stalinism (which soon as possible and where-ever possible >> broke with the Popular Front). >> >> Louis to this you bring banalities, at best misdirected but >> all displaying no attempt to comprehend the policy as policy >> or the period of history as history. We cannot pluck out >> random examples and simply say, there is the proof, nor can >> we argue by mischaractisation (Popular Front proposed class >> collaboration). It simply does not work, it is part of our >> sectarian legacy (or should I say leprosy). >> >> And beyond all the complexity that were Spain it was not all >> that difficult to work out what was going on - but none of >> this involved the Popular Front as such, though all of it was >> dressed up in frontism. Stalin and Russian state policy >> wanted a bargaining chip in their geo-political chess board. >> To have such a chip they needed direct control over the >> governement of Republican Spain and they needed a Governement >> which posed no real class threat to the rest of Europe (this >> was repeated again in the Greek Civil war, arguably in >> Yugoslavia until Tito picked up his ball and left the game, >> and later still in China - I might add the the Prague Spring >> was directly inspired by the experience of the Popular Front >> and soviet-tanks showed how compatable this was with Russian >> foriegn policy). >> >> To this external desire, must be added the opportunist >> desires of a rising middle class in Spain some of which had >> radical representation in the CP, these sought for their own >> miscalculated benefit (as class representatives) to willingly >> fit into Russian policy strategies. The result was needless >> catstrophe. To attribute this disaster to a mere policy >> deviod of class context is not what I would call a >> materialist approach. The policy played a role but the class >> context made the policy. >> >> What I am saying the mass Popular Front was an invention of >> class history mouthed by Dimitrov, that there has been >> something of a conspiracy of silence in the left which is at >> odds that just in this period large numbers of workers >> identified with communism, read the works of Marx and Lernin, >> organisied autonomously in niegbourhoods, work places in art >> and cultural activities and is the historical shadow which we >> still inhabit butr will not recognise. >> >> We cannot copy Dimtrov or the Front as it was, but by God we >> can certainly learn from it if we are willing to learn. >> >> Put simply this critical idea (critical objectively to the >> history of the working class politically in the 20th century) >> has been slandered casually and ignored. We need to >> understand what actually went on the past if we are to have >> any hope of knowing what to do in the future. >> >> Greg >> >> --- Message Received --- >> From: Louis Proyect <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 08:25:34 -0400 >> Subject: [PEN-L:25347] Re: Re: Re: Le Pen triumph thanks to >> ultra-leftists >> >> Greg Schofield: >> >>The Popular Front was one of the great modern innovations >> in effective >> political struggle of the working class, at the plain of how >> communists >> should work it relates directly to the Communist Manifesto >> applying the >> same principles to the specific question of anti-fascist struggle.<< >> >> It certainly was an innovation, although how great it was is >> another story >> entirely. Until the rise of Stalin, Marxism fought for class >> independence. >> The workers in late 19th century Germany maintained their own >> press, ran >> their own candidates and were hostile to any capitalist >> politician. It was >> this party that Lenin and the Bolsheviks sought to emulate, >> which is a fact >> understood by few self-appointed "vanguards" today. When >> giving an example >> of a vanguard in "What is to be Done", Lenin cited Kautsky's party. >> >> In the "Erfurt Program" of 1892, Kautsky wrote: >> >> "The interests of the proletariat and the bourgeoisie are of >> so contrary a >> nature that in the long run they cannot be harmonized. Sooner >> or later in >> every capitalist country the participation of the >> working-class in politics >> must lead to the formation of an independent party, a labor party." >> >> The People's Front was an attempt to harmonze the interests >> of the workers >> and the progressive bourgeoisie, who supposedly would be >> united against >> those elements of the ruling class that opted for fascism. >> This analysis >> was anti-Marxist in its essence. The bourgeoisie has no real >> committment to >> democracy. When the Weimar Republic failed to defend >> capitalist property >> relations, it threw its support behind Hitler. Today outfits like >> Goldman-Sachs, my former employer, lavish millions of dollars >> on Republican >> and Democrat alike. If these two parties fail to maintain a stable >> environment for capitalist profits, corporate rulers will investigate >> outfits to the right starting with Pat Buchanan. >> >> The problem in Spain is that the left parties, including the >> CP and SP but >> the anarchists as well, did not want to upset the People's >> Front unity. So >> they reined in the revolutionary left. When the revolutionary >> left refused >> to be reined in, they shot its leaders like Andres Nin. >> People in Spain >> were willing to risk their lives for economic as well as political >> democracy. When they figured out that the People's Front was >> not willing to >> smash the old agrarian despotic class relations, they lost >> their fighting >> will. In a struggle against fascism, you have to have clearly >> defined class >> politics. Watering down social and economic demands leads to >> the triumph of >> fascism. >> >> >> >> >> Louis Proyect >> Marxism mailing list: http://www.marxmail.org >> >> ________________________________ >> >> Greg Schofield >> Perth Australia >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> ________________________________________________________ >> ________________________________________________________ >> Modular And Integrated Design - programing power for all >> >> Lestec's MAID and LTMailer >> http://www.lestec.com.au also available at Amazon.com >> ________________________________________________________ >> ________________________________________________________ >> > >
