Re: Putin - Texas and the national factor- last post on this subject

[Waistline2]

In a message dated 6/25/2004 8:40:18 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The situation is particularly complicated in a state like the USSR and Russian Federation, neither of which were/are nation-states. (None of the ex-Soviet republics are nation-states, which maybe the exceptions of the Baltic States, Belarus and Ukraine.) Russia is probably the most multiethnic and multicultural country in the world, and ethnic minorites are not localized in particular areas.   Let's look at Tatarstan: Some Tatar ultranationalists want Tatarstan to secede from Russia and bacome Tatarstan for the Tatars. Well, for one thing, that would be a little hard to pull of in practical terms, since Tatarstan is physically inside Russia. For another, Tatars are only about 51% of the population of Tatarstan. What do you want, mass ethnic cleansing? In Bashkortostan, the Bashkirs are a minority (coming in third after Russians and Tatars), even though they are enormously overrepresented in the elite.   Anyway, in the case of Chechnya, national self-determination is not the issue. The issue is comparable to what you would if, to use your example, the Nation of Islam took control of Mississippi, and then started to attack neighboring states.   Reply   I had an intuitive instinct about the break up and evolution of the state that was the USSR and the various nationality groups within it, that is not in fact intuitive at all. I have a vision informed by history and in this case the history of the evolution of what can be called the Russian State.   Pen-L is anchored on a center of gravity that is Marxism with ultra heavy emphasis on economic gravity as opposed to political ideology.   Chechnya, as an economic unit is very different from an ideological concept of Chechnya, as a distinct historically evolved specific people, who during the transition from agricultural relations to industrial relations were defeated in their striving to constitute a distinct national state riveted to the economic formations we identity with the modern world market as class relations.   Chechnya, is identified as an autonomous region under the Soviet system and not a national state formation with clear and distinct modern classes, independent of Russian economic development at the turn of the past century.   The good thing is we get to see exactly what is what in the former Soviet Union and ascertain the striving of political groups based on their economic striving in the world of today.   Free Chechnya . . . fine and from whom?   Hey . . . Free Detroit . . . and Los Angeles from the new taping of another LAPD beating of a citizen.    There is a point at which it makes no sense to respond to ideologists. WHJy on earth would revoutionaries and progressive in AMerican be more upset about what is happening in Chechnya, than what is happening in . . . name your country.   I'm through . . .   Can you ding a song for me blue?   Melvin P.