Jim D: BTW, my empirical observation is that conspiracy theories are much more the rave these days on the left than are systemic theories (e.g., Marxism). When Dan Scanlan suggested that "911 and other chaos ... Is fostered [by the Bush elite] to keep arms sales up, oil controls in place" he was stating a type of opinion that is extremely common on the left.
^^^^^^^ CB: Dan Scanlan's statement doesn't sound like a theory that everything going on politicaleconomically is explained by this fostering of this and that, ergo, it is not a socalled conspiracy theory of anything but the specific events referred to, that is it is not the error of substituting a conspiracy theory for a system theory. ^^^^^^ CB: > The fact that there are divisions in the ruling class doesn't mean there are no plots by agents of the ruling class, that the ruling class is divided over everything ! < JD: I believe that in my first comment on Dan Scanlan's conspiratorial- sounding missive, I immediatedly agreed that there were someconspiracies. For all I know, the assassination of JFK was a conspiracy. (Maybe anti-Castro Cubans, maybe pro-Castro ones. Maybe the CIA, the mafia, etc...) ^^^^^ CB: Important point on this thread is that speculation about conspiracy to kill JFK (certainly was a conspiracy by someone for sure) is not necessarily a theory that everything in U.S. politics is a conspiracy. ^^^^^ CB: > In the main , the ruling class is NOT divided, but united, otherwise, they'd fall. Duh.< JD: not if the working class and other opposition forces are even more divided. CB: Correct. More divided and less conscious. Ruling class is united relative to the ruled class, more united and conscious than the class it rules. All discussion of unity or division must be relative statements comparing the unity or division of the two main classes. ^^^^ JD: And as long as the state protects capitalist property rights with a lot of force, the capitalists can fight among themselves as much as they want without falling. CB: They can't fight in ways that are advantageous to the working class. So, they can't fight "as much as they want" exactly. The state is not just out there separate from the ruling class. Part of the measure of the necessary level of unity of the ruling class is that the ruling class remain united over the role of the state vis-a-vis the interests of the ruling class and the working class. This doesn't just happen automatically, but must be continuously monitored by the political agents of the ruling class. The Dems and Reps don't remain continously servants of ruling class interests vis-a-vis the interests of the working class without supervision by agents of the ruling class. It's not spontaneous, this Tweedle Dee/Tweedle Dum stuff. Right now there seems to be some kind of split between the auto company owners and some sections of the financiers. What can the working class do with that one ? ^^^^^^ CB: >The main characteristic of the ruling class is that it is united, not divided, vis-a-vis the working class.< JD: Right. The RC is more united than the working class. CB: Correct. %%%%%%%% >CB: The historically necessary condition for ruling classes to rule, given that they are always elite minorities , is that they be more class conscious and united than the classes they rule over. "Class conscious" means very much aware and knowing of what they are doing, including sitting around talking about and planning how to keep ruling over the working classes through specific programs, bribes, wars, assassinations, provocations, diversions, numerous and various crimes , not by accident , but by plan ,purpose and organization. Don't kid yourself. They have arguments and disagreements, but in the main relative to the working class they are unified and CONSCIOUS.< JD: Sure, CB: Sans doute JD: there are these conspiracies (as I've said). But there are a lot of important divisions within the RC (Republicans vs. Democrats, Bush vs. Soros, US capitalists vs. European ones, etc., etc.) CB: Important might mean potential openings for the working class to exploit in the class war. The Dem vs. Rep one has not, as our anti-ABB comrades emphasize is today a phony division that we waste our time trying to exploit in 2005. The U.S. / European one may have more potential, but I'm not sure how we act in order to aggravate that contradiction. ^^^^^^ CB: >Jumping up and squawking "conspiracy theory ! conspiracy theory !"everytime somebody speculates about plots by ruling class agents tends to make the squawker sound naïve and ivory towerish, like they have their head in the clouds,and thereby less credible on other issues.< JD: The typical conspiracy theory of the sort that I criticize doesn't make much sense or is true by definition. I think that the left would do better trying to be logical and empirical -- and trying to think systematically -- rather than thinking up theories about small elites of Illuminati or whoever who are plotting. CB: The Left would do better to do both, as we can chew gum and walk at the same time. Some conspiracy speculation is offthe wall and out to lunch. Some conspiracy theories are sort of famously and notoriously outtolunch, and we don't have to spend much time with them. ^^^^^ CB> We are in a class war. Know thy class enemy.< JD: there's a big difference between the capitalist elites (which plot) and the capitalist class (which can't do so, because it's relatively big and diverse). CB: I don't know about a "big difference". The capitalist elites are a part of the capitalist class. The elites lead the class is probably the relation between them.
