As I started Smalltalk with Pharo 1.3, I may resonate with Dennis point of view.
Simple in syntax but not easy indeed. There are ways to do things and smart ways that require a while to sink in. Basically, it turned my mind upside down and I realised that a lot of things are easier to do in Smalltalk once you do it the Smalltalk way. And I really love the minimalism of the syntax and the environment. Heck, I chose to go with Pharo for my paying customers and it works fine. This explaining that, I'd better have a working solution if I want to eat. This helps with the learning. Not sure I would have persisted if it was not the case though. Phil On Thu, Jun 19, 2014 at 7:01 PM, Nicolas Cellier < nicolas.cellier.aka.n...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > 2014-06-19 16:44 GMT+02:00 Dennis Schetinin <chae...@gmail.com>: > >> Simple ~= Easy. >> Smalltalk is simple (simpler then most of other PLs), but it's not easy >> (to understand and master, especially after other PLs). >> >> >> Intersting... > I'm certainly too biased after all these years of Smalltalk, but I would > have thought the exact contrary... > What exactly isn't easy in Smalltalk versus other PL? > Is understanding and mastering C++, lisp, haskell, whatever, simpler than > Smalltalk? > Or do you only mean that difference between any two other languages is > less than difference to Smalltalk? > > >> -- >> >> Best regards, >> >> >> Dennis Schetinin >> >> >> 2014-06-17 11:59 GMT+04:00 kilon alios <kilon.al...@gmail.com>: >> >>> personally I don't like this postcard , it looks too much like "snake >>> oil marketing" to me. >>> >>> It creates the illusion that Pharo is much simpler than other >>> programming languages as a programming language while nothing can be >>> further from the truth. The idea here is to prove to the viewer that Pharo >>> is based on a very simple recipe and that is of course true. But if we have >>> to be honest is should come with a disclaimer for the potential users that >>> Pharo is no blue pill and there tons of things outside this postcard you >>> need to learn if you want to create the simplest Pharo application. I will >>> be frank , as a language I dont find Pharo any simpler than let's say >>> python , which I am more familiar with. And the fact that there is this >>> simple recipe gave me zero benefits to me so far. Its a cool trick that may >>> come handy down the line if I want to shape the language more to my needs, >>> but I dont see doing this to a day by day basis. >>> >>> Now a "living coding postcard" stating the workflow of Pharo and >>> demonstrating the power of the debugger is much more honest and frankly >>> better marketing for Pharo. You show something to a person that will >>> benefit his workflow on a day by day basis. >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Jun 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymc...@me.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Now, who is creative enough to add “dynamic array” (one with curly >>>> braces) and temporaries in a block to the original thing: >>>> >>>> exampleWithNumber: x >>>> | y | >>>> true & false not & (nil isNil) ifFalse: [self halt]. >>>> y := self size + super size. >>>> #($a #a "a" 1 1.0) >>>> do: [ :each | >>>> Transcript show: (each class name); >>>> show: ' ']. >>>> ^x < y >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Uko >>>> >>>> On 16 Jun 2014, at 15:35, Oscar Nierstrasz <oscar.nierstr...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> I got it from Stef, who always said it came originally from Ralph >>>> Johnson. >>>> >>>> http://c2.com/cgi-bin/wiki?SmalltalkSyntaxInaPostcard >>>> >>>> Googling around finds various copies of this, but no original source. >>>> >>>> Oscar >>>> >>>> On 16 Jun 2014, at 10:58 , Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymc...@me.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> I guess it’s here: http://files.pharo.org/media/flyer-cheat-sheet.pdf >>>> >>>> I think that it would be interesting to put the syntax on a postcard. >>>> It can work as a proof of concept, some addition cheat-sheet for newcomers >>>> and also as some king of souvenir. >>>> >>>> Uko >>>> >>>> On 16 Jun 2014, at 10:36, stepharo <steph...@free.fr> wrote: >>>> >>>> you have the flyer of Damien (no idea where it is) but no real postcard. >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>> On 16/6/14 09:35, Yuriy Tymchuk wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi guys, >>>> >>>> we all are talking about the syntax fitting in a postcard, but was >>>> there any real postcard with Pharo syntax prototype? This would be really >>>> interesting. >>>> >>>> Uko >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >
