I follow Linux and tech relatively closely and I had, and still have no idea what Ben was actually referring to. I also felt a lot of unwarranted and unpredictable anger.
There is clearly a lot of pain and stress in the air. Just my thought on the matter, Tomas On Fri, Jun 5, 2020, 16:25 Denis Heidtmann <denis.heidtm...@gmail.com> wrote: > Thanks for the explanation, but my comment was not sarcastic. I just felt > out of the loop, as if everybody but me understood what the "discussion" > was about. BTW, I do not consider John's reference to Rieser was out of > the blue--he made a genuine attempt to fill in the gaps, gaps which were so > large that perhaps I was not the only one here feeling out of touch. > > I will just say that your comments come across to a novice like me as > coming from an angry, impatient man. May not be, but that is how I read > them. > > > -Denis > > On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 11:03 PM Ben Koenig <techkoe...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On 6/4/20 9:48 PM, Denis Heidtmann wrote: > > > This convinces me I am dense. > > > > > > Lost the will to discuss the issue when someone pulled a murder from > > 2006 out of thin air. I don't know what I said to prompt that but I can > > come up with theories why it resurfaced. > > > > > > Since your sarcasm is so inviting I'll explain my frustration, you asked > > for it ;) > > > > All I want is for people to stop pushing the idea that slackware is the > > cause of a given software glitch. It's the only reason I bother offering > > to help Rich. After a couple years of lurking here I kinda snapped when > > I saw someone give slackware a try and the floodgates of stupidity > > opened. It seemed like nobody was interested in the facts and just > > wanted promote whatever random opinion popped into their head at the > > given moment. It was actually really bad and I felt a responsibility to > > set the record straight. > > > > > > It felt like sabotage. A bunch of people who had never used slackware > > kept offering advice, and then giving that disclaimer that they'd never > > used it. For someone who was actively trying to learn, this created > > severe problems in separating fact from fiction. He was clearly unable > > to decide who's advice was real, and who's was not. That's not his > > fault, but the fault of the people who actively worked to get in the way. > > > > > > As for Rich's questions, pretty much all of them are the result of > > either his inexperience or custom configuration (very custom). He gets > > fancy with his setup and it upsets me to see conversations head in the > > direction of "well maybe slackware..." when its something like rebooting > > a computer after 100 days of uptime. > > > > > > Any venerable user knows these questions are not slackware specific. But > > my concern is more about spreading knowledge to new users. When I leave > > the PLUG list and go do other things, I run into other linux users who > > say the dumbest things. Factoids and anecdotes that have nothing to do > > with what slackware actually is. People tell me about a flaw they heard > > about and I'm sitting there thinking about how that's literally not > > possible. The laws of physics kind of get in the way, know what I mean? > > > > > > People who know the truth are complacent, assuming that the facts speak > > for themselves. But they don't, and newer users are given unrealistic > > expectations and spread those like wildfire. I don't get the impression > > that people want to fight the fire because they just sit there watching > > it burn. This idea of spreading misinformation has become such a > > standard of life in the US that I start thinking that nobody here even > > cares about facts or truth. You just shout your opinions like its a damn > > twitter feed. If I thought anyone here cared about the design of the > > software and why it functions the way that it does, I would have offered > > to give a presentation on Slackware basics. It's not like there's some > > magical difference, we have binary compatibility with both centos and > > debian... > > > > > > At Free Geek I taught a class called "Linux Playground" where I walked > > brand new linux users through the basic differences of the various > > distributions. They would then go and get an ubuntu computer, but they > > left the class with an understanding of why free geek used Ubuntu, and > > what kind of options were out there if they chose to try something else. > > I firmly believe that we all have a moral obligation to promote the > > truth. This doesn't mean I think you should learn slackware, this means > > that you should acknowledge where your experience starts, and ends. > > Don't bother making a slackware specific statement if you have no > > experience with it. > > > > > > If you check the history of emails you'll not only notice that I've been > > critical of ubuntu, but that I've also offered pointed advice. This is > > because many of the issues that float through this mailing list are the > > same issues I solved at free geek. I literally maintained the book of > > "known issues and solutions" for several years. There are a lot of > > recurring problems, with easy solutions. > > > > > > When someone claims that I'm just bashing Ubuntu because I think I'm a > > "linux GOD", I find it hurtful. I feel excluded when I offer years of > > experience for free, and it gets tossed to the wind by people who think > > that it's the responsibility of the user to decide what is and is not > > correct. They are asking for help because they don't know what the > > correct path is, so when you throw out lots of information in a short > > period of time, people get confused. > > > > > > But you tried to do the right thing, and that's clearly all that matters. > > > > -Ben > > > > > > > On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 9:18 PM Ben Koenig <techkoe...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > >> On 6/4/20 9:00 PM, John Jason Jordan wrote: > > >>> On Thu, 4 Jun 2020 20:56:01 -0700 (PDT) > > >>> Rich Shepard <rshep...@appl-ecosys.com> dijo: > > >>> > > >>>> I believe that Ben referred to Resser (sp?). The file system > developer > > >>>> who was a bit bonkers. I don't recall the whole story but it was > > >>>> really big news for a while. > > >>> It was Reiser. He was arrested for murdering his wife. Thereafter, > his > > >>> filesystem fell out of favor. > > >> > > >> Not sure where reiserFS factors into anything, that happened in > 2006... > > >> why are we talking about it??? > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> I vented several issues both old and new in that post. This is not a > > >> topic I want to discuss via email. I've lost faith in the idea that > > >> people can communicate effectively. text-only email only makes the > > >> problem worse. > > >> > > >> > > >> The Linux community is becoming more inclusive by excluding certain > > >> types of people. It just happened right in front of everyone on this > > list. > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> PLUG mailing list > > >> PLUG@pdxlinux.org > > >> http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > PLUG mailing list > > > PLUG@pdxlinux.org > > > http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug > > _______________________________________________ > > PLUG mailing list > > PLUG@pdxlinux.org > > http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug > > > _______________________________________________ > PLUG mailing list > PLUG@pdxlinux.org > http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug > _______________________________________________ PLUG mailing list PLUG@pdxlinux.org http://lists.pdxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug
