The meltdown in great part happenned because of the Government;s GSE and the perception it caused.....
On Sep 18, 7:33 am, Frank <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is not simply a product of greed. Capitalism clearly does not > work.If it did this meltdown would not be occuring, they would have > seen it coming and acted accordingly. It has happened twice to this > degree before (1929 & 1895) As well as 1987, 1998 and 2001. It is a > global meltdown with its epicenter in the US (world's largest economy) > not a democrat or a republican meltdown. > > If a world socio-economic system is dependent on the honesty of a > minuscule handful of people, in the form of bankers and government > officials to operate efficiently--in other words 0000.1 of the worlds > population---then it is a system that is a deeply flawed, unworkable, > anarchic, undemocratic, plutocratic,anachronism. Which is precisely > what it is. This is not my opinion, it is a scientific, mathematical > fact. Idle baseless opinion or ideological wishful thinking are a > worthless hindrance to our understanding our relationship to the > worlds socio-economic forces and the means of production. > > On Sep 18, 11:09 pm, VT Sean Lewis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > No Keith I have a brain and I know Bull Shit when I smell > > it. > > > Capitalism works, but selfish greed is a destroyer. > > > This post was about justifying selfish greed. > > > You are just too niave to realize it. > > > On Sep 18, 12:32 am, KeithInTampa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Sean, > > > > You just demonstrated, that you are a socialist elitst......You either > > > fell for, and/or actualy subscribe to the old socialists' trick, > > > playing the "class warfare card". > > > > For two hundred years, there was a concept in this Nation, the > > > proverbial "American Dream", which all Americans used to adhere to, > > > and still some productive Americans still cling to; that wealth, > > > prosperity, and a life better than what their parents maintaioned, was > > > within their grasp. The Democrat Party, which has been infiltrated by > > > socialists and communists, have for years attempted to instill in our > > > people that government is the answer and only solution for the working > > > class. The Democrat Party detests capitalism. That nothing can in > > > fact happen without government's oversight and stewardship. The > > > Democrat Party has worked hard to force a sense of class warfare. > > > > You just demonstrated it here in this thread, and another thread that > > > you posted today captioned, "The Cascade Effect, the collapse of the > > > US economy. How did it happen, and how do you stop it." > > > > If you don't believe me, go back and re-read your messages. You Sir, > > > are espousing a socialist message. > > > > Respectfully, > > > > Keith > > > > On Sep 18, 12:08 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > >http://www.ejectejecteject.com/archives/000056.html > > > > > That capitalism generates wealth is beyond debate. This capitalist > > > > reactor of ours easily invents more, learns more, and produces more > > > > benefits in a year than mankind did under a millennia of rule by Kings > > > > and Barons and Caliphs and Emperors. It s just amazing what people can > > > > do when you just get the hell out of their way. > > > > > As an economic system for increasing prosperity, you just can t beat > > > > it. And those who despise capitalism can t argue with this they just > > > > can t. What they can do, perpetually and loudly, is talk about how > > > > unfair Capitalism is. Because it allows the hard-working and ambitious > > > > to keep the rewards of their hard work and ambition, Capitalism does > > > > indeed produce some pretty uneven results. > > > > > But does uneven mean unfair? Depends on how you measure fair. > > > > > Now far be it for me to split linguistic hairs and argue over what the > > > > definition of is is. But if we re going to get to the heart of this > > > > unfair business, we have to ask ourselves, unfair to whom? Because if > > > > we are to talk intelligently about this, we re going to have to > > > > understand something right out of the gate: life is unfair. If life > > > > were fair, we d all be the same same intelligence, same drive, same > > > > capabilities. But we re not. It is a hallmark of our species that we > > > > vary wildly in these and many other categories. That s what makes us > > > > so diverse, and we sure want to celebrate that, don t we? > > > > > So, when we talk about making things fair, making them equal, we find > > > > ourselves in the same impossible conundrum as we do when we discuss > > > > The Irresistible Force meeting The Immovable Object. > > > > > Cool! Which would win? > > > > > Neither. It s an oxymoron. The definition of Irresistible Force means > > > > that there cannot be an Immovable Object, and vice versa. You have to > > > > pick one or the other. They are mutually exclusive. > > > > > Likewise, when we try to measure fair and equal, we have to face the > > > > hard reality that people are different. So, do we want to measure an > > > > equal front end: equality of opportunity or an equal back end: > > > > equality of results? Can t have both. > > > > > Here s why: > > > > > When the Declaration of Independence thundered that All Men are > > > > Created Equal, it meant equal in those essential elements: equal under > > > > the law. Equal in terms of basic human rights. Equal in dignity. Equal > > > > in the sense that if someone with a lot of money thinks they can cut > > > > in front of me at an ATM line just because they re rich, then they can > > > > just kiss my Royal Irish Ass! that kind of equal. > > > > > But to believe that all people are equally capable is to well not be > > > > paying attention, as a quick game of one-on-one half-court between > > > > Michael Jordan and Michael Moore will quickly reveal. (note to Don > > > > King: There are millions, and I mean millions to be made off this > > > > idea. Call me.) > > > > > There will always be people smarter than you, and people more stupid; > > > > people more and less motivated, ruthless, connected, ambitious, > > > > frugal, hardworking than you are. Nothing can change that. Nothing > > > > should change that because there lies the Gulag. People are > > > > different. Leave them alone. Encourage the downhearted, by all means. > > > > Help those in need when they ask for help. But otherwise mind your own > > > > business, bub. > > > > > Society is as fair as it can get when all people have equal > > > > opportunity to make what they will of themselves. We are not there > > > > yet. We are close. We are much, much closer than many would have us > > > > believe. > > > > > But people are different. They will always be different. They will > > > > succeed and fail differently. There s no two ways around it. > > > > > Like so many flawed ideas beloved by the far left, equality seems like > > > > a noble enough goal. Until you think about it. People have different > > > > capabilities. So do you want equality of opportunity as I do where > > > > people can make of themselves what they will? Or do you want equality > > > > of results, where society steps in to make sure that everyone comes > > > > out the same? > > > > > If society had a magical way of raising the bottom up, of speeding up, > > > > buffing up, and tidying up Michael Moore, thereby giving him the means > > > > to beat Michael Jordan in our (sadly) mythical game of half-court, > > > > well we d all be the winners and life would be just dandy. But, alas, > > > > this wonderful, brilliant idea is marred only by the annoying fact > > > > that it is demonstrably impossible. Michael Moore can never play as > > > > well as Michael Jordan. Never. If you want that game to come out a tie > > > > equal! then you are going to have to hobble Michael Jordon. > > > > > You re going to have to remove a foot or two from his femurs, stitch > > > > him into a clumsy, bulky, ugly suit adding a few hundred pounds, > > > > heavily sedate him to slow down his mental powers, fill him full of > > > > cheap booze to degrade his aim and coordination oh, and really mess > > > > up his face surgically. No fair if people are rooting for him > > > > disproportionately! That might hurt Michael Moore s self-esteem and > > > > limit his ability to compete. > > > > > Do all these things, and more, and you will have two equal players. > > > > You will have a really stupid, incompetent, pointless game. You will > > > > have removed all the grace, power, style, finesse and genius from a > > > > gifted and noble man, and added nothing whatsoever to his opponent. > > > > You just made Michael Moore equal to Michael Jordan. Now is that fair > > > > to Michael Jordan? > > > > > And after you ve done all these things, Michael Jordan will still hand > > > > Michael Moore his ass because he thinks and acts like a winner and not > > > > a victim. > > > > > Equality under the law: good. Essential. > > > > > Forcing people of differing skills, motivation and capability to be > > > > equal: ruinous. Suicidal. And deeply, deeply unfair. But, for the > > > > Berkeley crowd, there s no reason why a fatally flawed, disgusting, > > > > historically-demolished idea can t be retried and retried and > > > > retried So long as it will fit on a 2x4 foot piece of cardboard that > > > > you can hold on the end of a stick while dancing in a public fountain > > > > wearing a star-spangled diaper. > > > > > Does Capitalism, and its equality of opportunity, produce cruel > > > > results? It does. Does Socialism, and it s equality of outcome, > > > > produce a fair and happy society? Ask the Russian farmers under > > > > Stalin. Ask the Chinese under Mao during the Cultural Revolution. Ask > > > > the Cambodians under the Khmer Rouge. > > > > > Oh, wait you can t. They ve all been murdered. > > > > > On Sep 17, 9:06 pm, VT Sean Lewis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > This is seductive self justification for greed. > > > > > > I hear this from 'christians' who say God wants them to be Rich, > > > > > yet these same chritians live in gated communities > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
