Our "Culture" is based on Christian tenets and principals. --- replaced by American tenets and princi*ples *out regard
marriage is most definitely an ecclesiastical creation --- not anymore. function and a part and parcel of our society. --- not since 1913. On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 11:17:24 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: > > More proof of Secular Progressivism's ignorance and attempt to redefine > and rewrite our history. > > Our "Culture" is based on Christian tenets and principals. Whether you > like the concept and history of marriage is really not all that > important...."It Is; What It Is"; and yes, marriage is most definitely an > ecclesiastical creation, function and a part and parcel of our society. > > On Mon, Jun 6, 2016 at 11:06 AM, plainolamerican <[email protected] > <javascript:>> wrote: > >> redefining the definition of marriage is purposely to weaken and diminish >> Christian values and tenets, of which are important to our culture. >> --- >> only to xian culture ... Americans don't care about your xian culture. >> >> Marriage is, and always has been an ecclesiastical function >> --- >> hogwash ... >> Marriage in the United States is regulated by state laws. >> Local officials, such as a mayor, judge, deputy marriage commissioner >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deputy_marriage_commissioner>, or justice >> of the peace, are empowered to conduct civil wedding ceremonies, which may >> take place in public offices. The type of ceremony (religious or civil) >> has no bearing on the legal validity of the marriage, and there is no >> requirement to precede a religious rite with a civil ceremony. >> >> - 1913 – The federal government formally recognizes marriage in law >> for the first time with the passage of the Revenue Act of 1913 >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_Act_of_1913>. >> - 1923 – The federal government establishes the Uniform Marriage and >> Marriage License Act. [1] >> >> <https://books.google.com/books?id=-VgaAAAAYAAJ&pg=PR3&source=gbs_selected_pages&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=false> >> - 1929 – All states now have laws regarding marriage licenses. >> >> >> >> >> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 2:35:08 PM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >>> >>> What it proves and establishes, is that like me, Trump stands for >>> equality and equal rights for all. You on the other hand, along with a few >>> Secular Progressives who hijacked a movement within the Gay community that >>> literally caused and formulated the militant Gay agenda, do not want >>> equality; you are in fact pushing for and attempting to rewrite history, >>> and change the fundamental core of our Nation. >>> >>> Like many who were initially pushing for "Equal Rights for Gays"; I too >>> wanted to see the same outcome, which is for men (and women) who choose to >>> join/couple, to have the same rights and benefits as a married couple. I >>> was rightfully convinced that there was a far sinister reason for those who >>> were pushing for the redefinition of marriage, versus pushing for civil >>> unions, when there is no distinction in law between the two, and that >>> redefining the definition of marriage is purposely to weaken and diminish >>> Christian values and tenets, of which are important to our culture. >>> >>> Here's a message that I wrote back in January of last year that I think >>> explains my views; and even today, I haven't changed my viewpoint. I do >>> believe that governments should admit that there is not now, nor has there >>> ever been "Civil Marriage"; but because when the several States got >>> involved in the "Civil Union" business, there was no clamor for same sex >>> civil unions, and the two terms; ee.g.; "Marriage" and "Civil Union" were >>> interchangeable. That was a mistake, as it's clearly not the case in the >>> New Millennium, and the Several States along with the Supreme Court should >>> to and rectify this mistake. >>> >>> Here's what I wrote: >>> >>> I have been adamantly opposed to the redefinition of marriage, and that >>> is exactly what has happened. Americans with traditional values and >>> beliefs lost this battle....In a nutshell: >>> >>> 1. I have always been in favor of, and believed that homosexual >>> couples who wished to "couple" had the inherent right to do so, and should >>> have been granted a "civil union" status, much as California, Illinois, New >>> Jersey and a number of States recognized. Simplified, it is my belief that >>> no one should be denied equal protection or equal rights under the law. >>> >>> To take this a step further, and by example, California for years had a >>> "Civil Union" statute for Gay men and women, which granted them the same >>> rights and privileges as any married man and woman: >>> >>> >>> http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=fam&group=00001-01000&file=297-297.5 >>> >>> 2. This was clearly not accepted by the militant faction of Gays, and >>> who demanded the redefinition of the term "Marriage". You can trace this >>> to the works of two gentlemen by the names of "Marshall Kirk" and "Hunter >>> Madsen"; who were the "Saul Alinsky's" of the Gay movement. I encourage >>> you to "Google" their names and read up on them. Here is just one of their >>> epistles, (and the name "Erastes Pill" was Madsen's "pen name") : >>> >>> http://library.gayhomeland.org/0018/EN/EN_Overhauling_Straight.htm >>> >>> Make no mistake, Madsen and Kirk were Anti-American, Marxist/Democrat >>> secularists who waged a war against American culture, which is still raging >>> today! >>> >>> 3. Marriage is, and always has been an ecclesiastical function, and >>> the several States, (namely it was California and Connecticut) who first >>> got into the marriage business, the purpose being to stop miscegenation. >>> Later, the States getting involved in regulating Marriage was obviously >>> needed, with the divorce rates in this nation, and moderating/arbitrating >>> those contracts. Obviously, had the thought of, or had there been a >>> faction in our society 150 years ago that was advocating same sex marriage, >>> they would have been mocked and laughed at, and more importantly, the term >>> "Marriage" would not have been applied to civil unions performed by the >>> States. The reason the term "Marriage" is utilized today, is because these >>> functions were carried over from the Church, and a matter of expediency. >>> >>> 4. Today, it is my belief that a State issued "Marriage License" is >>> nothing more than, and nothing less than a "Civil Union". That governments >>> should not be involved in an ecclesiastical function whatsoever. That all >>> marriages outside of a Church should be recognized as only a "Civil Union", >>> whether it be between a man and a woman, a woman and a woman, a man and a >>> man, or a man and a goat! "IF" you can find a Church to marry you, then >>> more power to you! >>> >>> Again, I have tried to be brief and simplify my response here....I could >>> take ten pages and several hours to respond, but in general, we've lost the >>> battle! I hope that you will take the time to read and understand how and >>> why we did! >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 2:27 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Trump has in fact supported civil unions; but is opposed to Gay >>>> marriage. >>>> I concur. >>>> --- >>>> that's what I said. >>>> I also said that if you disagreed with Trump you were the better >>>> person. I see you're not. >>>> >>>> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 1:16:09 PM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I cannot find the exact article that you're citing from, but the "cut >>>>> and paste" that you've cited are only parts of what Donald Trump has >>>>> said; >>>>> and there's plenty of examples all over the web. >>>>> >>>>> Trump has been opposed to the Supreme Court's ruling, believing that >>>>> this should be a State issue; (I concur; both from a Constitutional >>>>> standpoint and previous Supreme Court rulings); Trump has in fact >>>>> supported civil unions; but is opposed to Gay marriage. >>>>> >>>>> I concur. >>>>> >>>>> Again, you are manufacturing and posting lies and misinformation, >>>>> which is typical of Secular Progressives. >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 1:46 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Again, I encourage you to read, study, and stay away from the far >>>>>> left Soros funded (or the globalist/elitist) hate sites. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> flush ... already addressed. Soros is pos and does not influence my >>>>>> vote. >>>>>> >>>>>> Like myself, Donald Trump has always supported equal rights for the >>>>>> Gay community. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> hogwash. >>>>>> Trump has consistently maintained his opposition to marriage >>>>>> equality, sometimes by citing polling and making an analogy to his >>>>>> dislike >>>>>> of long golf putters. After the Supreme Court ruling, Trump said the >>>>>> court >>>>>> had made its decision and, although he disagreed with the ruling, he did >>>>>> not support a constitutional amendment that would allow states to re-ban >>>>>> marriage equality. He later said he would appoint Supreme Court judges >>>>>> who >>>>>> would be committed to overturning the ruling. >>>>>> *Trump Said He Would “Strongly Consider” Appointing Judges To >>>>>> Overturn Same-Sex Marriage Decision. *Asked on Fox News Sunday >>>>>> “WALLACE: But -- but just to button this up very quickly, sir, are you >>>>>> saying that if you become president, you might try to appoint justices >>>>>> to >>>>>> overrule the decision on same-sex marriage?” TRUMP: “I would strongly >>>>>> consider that, yes.” [Fox News Sunday, 1/31/2016 >>>>>> <http://www.foxnews.com/transcript/2016/01/31/ted-cruz-attacks-donald-trump-financial-record-trump-responds/>; >>>>>> >>>>>> VIDEO] >>>>>> *Trump Compared Opposition To Same-Sex Marriage To Disliking Extra >>>>>> Long Putters In Golf.* At one point, he compared his opposition to >>>>>> the legalization of same-sex marriage to his reluctance to use a new >>>>>> kind >>>>>> of putter. ‘It’s like in golf,’ he said. ‘A lot of people — I don’t want >>>>>> this to sound trivial — but a lot of people are switching to these >>>>>> really >>>>>> long putters, very unattractive,’ said Mr. Trump, a Republican. ‘It’s >>>>>> weird. You see these great players with these really long putters, >>>>>> because >>>>>> they can’t sink three-footers anymore. And, I hate it. I am a >>>>>> traditionalist. >>>>>> >>>>>> Marriage is not an equal right, but instead is a "Special Right" >>>>>> that is afforded to Gays because of their sexuality, >>>>>> --- >>>>>> opinion noted ... not shared. >>>>>> >>>>>> and denied to people like you and I because of who we choose to hop >>>>>> in the sack with. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> cite example. >>>>>> >>>>>> Moreover, the laws now discriminate against some Christians because >>>>>> of their deeply held religious beliefs. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> bs ... it's because they're refusing to serve lgbt's. They're >>>>>> judgmental assholes and a courtroom awaits their sorry asses. >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't expect you to understand this; as I have pointed out this >>>>>> morning, it has become increasingly clear that you don't have the >>>>>> educational background, nor the critical thinking skills to fathom or >>>>>> understand critical, cognitive thinking. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> delusion noted ... and a typical debate technique used when someone >>>>>> can't present an argument ... so their response is, 'you don't >>>>>> understand' >>>>>> or 'you're ignorant blah, blah, blah.' >>>>>> I have a bachelors degree and a master's degree ... how about you? >>>>>> >>>>>> Still, I encourage you to try and read, study, and expand your >>>>>> sources of information, which is all that any of us can do. >>>>>> --- >>>>>> backatcha >>>>>> >>>>>> You should literally make it a point to check and re-check your >>>>>> sources of information. As we've covered this morning, you have posted >>>>>> blatantly false, fictitious information and it's not becoming to be a >>>>>> Secular Progressive who is also known for being a liar. (*See* >>>>>> TommyTomTomForNews) >>>>>> --- >>>>>> I present a lot of article that may or may not be true ... that >>>>>> doesn't mean I agree with them .. like your persecution of lgbt's like >>>>>> Trumpass. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 11:57:21 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Again, I encourage you to read, study, and stay away from the far >>>>>>> left Soros funded (or the globalist/elitist) hate sites. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Like myself, Donald Trump has always supported equal rights for the >>>>>>> Gay community. Marriage is not an equal right, but instead is a >>>>>>> "Special >>>>>>> Right" that is afforded to Gays because of their sexuality, and denied >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> people like you and I because of who we choose to hop in the sack with. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Moreover, the laws now discriminate against some Christians because of >>>>>>> their deeply held religious beliefs. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't expect you to understand this; as I have pointed out this >>>>>>> morning, it has become increasingly clear that you don't have the >>>>>>> educational background, nor the critical thinking skills to fathom or >>>>>>> understand critical, cognitive thinking. Still, I encourage you to >>>>>>> try >>>>>>> and read, study, and expand your sources of information, which is all >>>>>>> that >>>>>>> any of us can do. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You should literally make it a point to check and re-check your >>>>>>> sources of information. As we've covered this morning, you have posted >>>>>>> blatantly false, fictitious information and it's not becoming to be a >>>>>>> Secular Progressive who is also known for being a liar. (*See* >>>>>>> TommyTomTomForNews) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 12:46 PM, plainolamerican < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> if so, you're better than Donald Trumpass. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 11:46:02 AM UTC-5, plainolamerican wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hardly. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> so you are for allowing lgbt's to marry and receive equal benefits? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 11:37:25 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hardly. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> But not at all surprising coming from someone like you. Typical >>>>>>>>>> Politically Correct asinine intolerance. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 12:27 PM, plainolamerican < >>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/presidential-candidate-donald-trump-stance-same-sex-marriage-offends-gay-activist-article-1.122915 >>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>> wrong again .... as if you don't agree with denying lgbt's the >>>>>>>>>>> right to marry and equal benefits, homophobe. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/presidential-candidate-donald-trump-stance-same-sex-marriage-offends-gay-activist-article-1.122915 >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, June 3, 2016 at 7:57:55 AM UTC-5, KeithInTampa wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Your quote from the Des Moines Register is a blatant lie. I >>>>>>>>>>>> got no further than that, this is typical, and of course, you will >>>>>>>>>>>> acknowledge this and/or be now known as a Secular Progressive >>>>>>>>>>>> "LilMarxistMoonbatTomForNews" like liar >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 3, 2016 at 8:44 AM, plainolamerican < >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Far left extremist Anti-American Secular Progressives have no >>>>>>>>>>>>> idea what Donald Trump has said, or what his message is. >>>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>>> delusion noted. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> his message? >>>>>>>>>>>>> he changes his words and opinions more than GHWBush changes >>>>>>>>>>>>> his Depends. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> from his own words we know he would deny lgbt's equal rights >>>>>>>>>>>>> ... >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, Trump talked to the Des Moines Register about >>>>>>>>>>>>> "exploring" a presidential run, and was asked f he supports >>>>>>>>>>>>> "allowing >>>>>>>>>>>>> same-sex couples to marry." >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Trump said "no," but didn't stop there. When asked whether gay >>>>>>>>>>>>> couples should have access to "the same benefits as married >>>>>>>>>>>>> couples," the >>>>>>>>>>>>> mogul initially replied that his attitude on the issue was not >>>>>>>>>>>>> yet "fully >>>>>>>>>>>>> formed." >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> After thinking about it for a moment, however, Trump said: "As >>>>>>>>>>>>> of this moment, I would say no and no" to gay marriage and civil >>>>>>>>>>>>> benefits. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> from his own words we know he would try to build a fence on >>>>>>>>>>>>> our southern border ... which is wrong for humans and wildlife. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> “I will build a great wall – and nobody builds walls better >>>>>>>>>>>>> than me, believe me – and I’ll build them very inexpensively. I >>>>>>>>>>>>> will build >>>>>>>>>>>>> a great, great wall on our southern border, and I will make >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mexico pay for >>>>>>>>>>>>> that wall. Mark my words.” >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> from his own words we know he's a xenophobe and would try to >>>>>>>>>>>>> get china to assassinate the leader of north korea. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuIClGGj758 >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> from his own words we know he would punish women who have >>>>>>>>>>>>> abortions >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1Jpoecf0xY >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> should I continue? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> regardless of his opinions, I will won't vote for him because >>>>>>>>>>>>> he, like other neocons and zionists, are hateful toward other >>>>>>>>>>>>> nations, >>>>>>>>>>>>> supports the failed US interventionist policy and is unfit and >>>>>>>>>>>>> knowledgeable to represent America. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 2, 2016 at 5:56:58 PM UTC-5, KeithInTampa >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> LOL! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Typical! Far left extremist Anti-American Secular >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Progressives have no idea what Donald Trump has said, or what >>>>>>>>>>>>>> his message >>>>>>>>>>>>>> is. All they know, is "Bad~~Bad~~Hill Clinton"; and whatever >>>>>>>>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>>>>>> George Soros mouthpiece tells them to think! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 2, 2016 at 6:24 PM, plainolamerican < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> great ... his Bachelor of General Studies >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_General_Studies> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> degree >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in criminology <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminology> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and physiology <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physiology> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really help. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that said ... you can bet he won't be blasting hispanics and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> muslims like Trumpasshole. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 2, 2016 at 4:47:42 PM UTC-5, Bill wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Click here: Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson Hints at Political >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Future - Christine Rousselle >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://townhall.com/tipsheet/christinerousselle/2016/06/02/dwayne-the-rock-johnson-hints-at-political-future-n2172412> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For options & help see >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Visit our other community at >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "PoliticalForum" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>>>>>>>>>>> For options & help see >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>>>>>>>>>>> * It's active and moderated. 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Register and vote in our polls. >>>>>>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> --- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "PoliticalForum" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>>>> >>>>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>>>> >>>>>> --- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "PoliticalForum" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> -- >>>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>>> >>>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>>> * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. >>>> * Read the latest breaking news, and more. >>>> >>>> --- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "PoliticalForum" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >> -- >> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >> >> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >> * It's active and moderated. 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