Revisionist history PlainOl', the Soviets were clearly a threat. I was living here in Germany in 1976 through 1979 as a young soldier when they were a threat. I am too young to remember, (although I was alive) but the Soviets propping missiles up in Cuba ninety miles from my home in Tampa was clearly a threat. There are hundreds if not thousands of other examples, but to suggest anything else is either Moonbattery and/or RonPaulCrackpottery.
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 9:41 PM, plainolamerican <[email protected]>wrote: > We were not going to allow Soviet > expansionism throughout the world > --- > the birth of a term called culture of fear > the soviets were not a threat to the USA and everyone knew they were > headed for collapse .... yet, through exaggerated fear they were > demonized > > every attempt by the US to intervene has been a disaster and seldom > has it ever led to a democracy > not that the US has an obligation to promote democracy > > > On Oct 3, 12:19 pm, Keith In Köln <[email protected]> wrote: > > You might want to read on down, with regard to what Truman had to say: > > > > *The very existence of the Greek state is today threatened by the > terrorist > > activities of several thousand armed men, led by Communists, who defy the > > government's authority at a number of points, particularly along the > > northern boundaries. A Commission appointed by the United Nations > security > > Council is at present investigating disturbed conditions in northern > Greece > > and alleged border violations along the frontier between Greece on the > one > > hand and Albania, Bulgaria, and Yugoslavia on the other. * > > * * > > > > *Meanwhile, the Greek Government is unable to cope with the situation. > The > > Greek army is small and poorly equipped. It needs supplies and equipment > if > > it is to restore the authority of the government throughout Greek > territory. > > Greece must have assistance if it is to become a self-supporting and > > self-respecting democracy. * > > * * > > > > *The United States must supply that assistance. We have already extended > to > > Greece certain types of relief and economic aid but these are inadequate. > * > > > > ** > > ** > > President Truman, March 12, 1947 > > > > http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/trudoc.asp > > > > What Truman did, and what became known as the Truman doctrine, was a "tit > > for tat" scenario with the Soviets. We were not going to allow Soviet > > expansionism throughout the world, and we nipped it in the bud in South > > Korea, as well as Viet Nam for over a decade. I think it important to > note > > that we never lost a battle in Viet Nam, and I reject the notion that we > > lost a war in Viet Nam. We allowed for a liberal media to influence the > > political machinations of the era, and it was in fact a mistake for > > President Ford not to have gone back in and wiped Hanoi off of the map in > > 1975, but I digress. I could end up writing an epistle on this topic, > but I > > do opine that this was a defining moment in our Nation, and what was the > > initial split between conservative politics and the socialist/communist > > movement in this Nation. > > > > On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 6:57 PM, plainolamerican > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I cannot think of any time in our history, where we "intervened" and > > > there > > > wasn't an argument for the protection of our sovereignty, including > > > Viet > > > Nam > > > --- > > > are you implying that communism was a direct threat to our > > > sovereignty? > > > if so, then wouldn't you say that socialism is a direct threat? > > > > > You may in fact disagree with the logic, (and like most > > > Moonbats, not comprehend the Truman Doctrine > > > ---- > > > Truman: > > > I believe that we must assist free peoples to work out their own > > > destinies in their own way. > > > Speech to a joint session of the US Congress (12 March 1947), > > > outlining what became known as The Truman Doctrine. > > > > > All the president is, is a glorified public relations man who spends > > > his time flattering, kissing, and kicking people to get them to do > > > what they are supposed to do anyway. > > > > > Had ten minutes conversation with Henry Morgenthau about Jewish > > > ship in Palistine. Told him I would talk to Gen[eral] Marshall about > > > it. He'd no business, whatever to call me. The Jews have no sense of > > > proportion nor do they have any judgement on world affairs. Henry > > > brought a thousand Jews to New York on a supposedly temporary basis > > > and they stayed. When the country went backward — and Republican in > > > the election of 1946, this incident loomed large on the DP [Displaced > > > Person] program. The Jews, I find are very, very selfish. They care > > > not how many Estonians, Latvians, Finns, Poles, Yugoslavs or Greeks > > > get murdered or mistreated as DP as long as the Jews get special > > > treatment. Yet when they have power, physical, financial or political > > > neither Hitler nor Stalin has anything on them for cruelty or > > > mistreatment to the under dog. Put an underdog on top and it makes no > > > difference whether his name is Russian, Jewish, Negro, Management, > > > Labor, Mormon, Baptist he goes haywire. I've found very, very few who > > > remember their past condition when prosperity comes. > > > > > On Oct 3, 11:08 am, Keith In Köln <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hey PlainOl', > > > > > > Israel is a conundrum, and not a good example of other hot spots in > the > > > > world, albeit they are right in the middle of several issues. > > > > > > To the point, if any Nation does any act that would threaten the > > > sovereignty > > > > of the United States, then I think we have the right to intervene. > Thus, > > > > when there are those who are not identified with a Nation-State, but > are > > > > devout on seeing Islam return to its glory of the 11th and 12th > > > centuries, > > > > then yes, I think we have every right to intervene. So was the case > with > > > > Afghanistan in 2001, Iraq (which we believed was a potential threat > in > > > > 2003) and Pakistan just last year, when we violated Pakistan's > > > soveriegnty > > > > to go in and emasculate Osama bin Laden. > > > > > > I cannot think of any time in our history, where we "intervened" and > > > there > > > > wasn't an argument for the protection of our sovereignty, including > Viet > > > > Nam, and Iraq. You may in fact disagree with the logic, (and like > most > > > > Moonbats, not comprehend the Truman Doctrine with the case of Viet > Nam) > > > > and/or be intent on revising contemporary history, but again, I can > think > > > of > > > > no incidents. (Maybe the Spanish American War....) > > > > > > On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 5:04 PM, plainolamerican > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > would we as a Nation have a right to interfere > > > > > --- > > > > > yes ... even to the extent of dismantling their government, if > > > > > necessary > > > > > but, remember, this is not about controlling resources or > protecting > > > > > one foreign government from another > > > > > > > backatcha: > > > > > If the US stops providing military support to israel and their > enemies > > > > > attack them should we interfere? > > > > > remember, israel has spied on us, killed our soldiers, corrupted > our > > > > > politicians and promotes socialism in our nation > > > > > > > On Oct 3, 9:50 am, Keith In Köln <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Hey PlainOl', (And Michael, Bruce, and all other Ron Paul > Supporters > > > > > here > > > > > > in PF!) > > > > > > > > I have a question, I think it's rather simple. I am going to > give a > > > > > > hypothetical: > > > > > > > > "If Mexico decides to revert back to 19th or early 20th century > > > > > technology, > > > > > > and the Nation chooses to dump all of its sewers, waste streams > both > > > > > > residential and commercial, (which would potentially include > > > chemical > > > > > waste > > > > > > and toxins, leachates, etc.) into a system that is untreated, > and > > > the > > > > > > stream of waste is dumped into the Gulf of Mexico, where the > Nation > > > of > > > > > > Mexico builds a pipe in international waters to divert this > stream > > > away > > > > > from > > > > > > its coast, where eventually, it is going to end up on American > > > beaches > > > > > and > > > > > > shorelines, would we as a Nation have a right to interfere, or > to > > > stop > > > > > such > > > > > > a waste stream?" > > > > > > > > On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 4:20 PM, plainolamerican > > > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > > > Beginning in the early part of the twentieth century, people > like > > > > > > > Woodrow Wilson began supposing that we had the right and duty > to be > > > > > > > the world’s keepers, and they have proceeded to mess things up > > > around > > > > > > > the world ever since. > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > spot on! > > > > > > > > > those who think the US should interfere in the internal affairs > of > > > > > > > other nations and fund their militaries should fight and fund > their > > > > > > > own charities without US tax dollars and soldiers > > > > > > > > > you're either an American or something else > > > > > > > > > On Oct 1, 10:05 am, MJ <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > The Cult of Reagan, and Other Neocon Folliesby Thomas E. > Woods, > > > Jr. > > > > > > > > Some time agoThe American Spectator’s Jeffrey Lord claimed > Ron > > > Paul’s > > > > > > > foreign policy of nonintervention was "liberal," and that > > > conservatives > > > > > are > > > > > > > supposed to be hawkish on foreign policy. Now to some extent, > no > > > one > > > > > really > > > > > > > cares about these labels, and who qualifies as what. But it is > > > > > obviously > > > > > > > false to say that supporters of nonintervention must be > > > left-liberals. > > > > > I > > > > > > > showed this in my YouTube response, which dismantled Lord’s > entire > > > > > position: > > > > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YpP80_J5N8&feature=player_embeddedIfi.... > There is no wiggle room left for Lord after that. > > > > > > > As Gary North put it, "The lesson here is simple: don’t get > Woods > > > on > > > > > your > > > > > > > case if you are saying really stupid things about American > > > history." > > > > > > > > Yet hecame back for more. With a busy schedule both > personally > > > and > > > > > > > professionally, I have only now had the time to respond, which > I’m > > > > > doing in > > > > > > > a series of bullet points. > > > > > > > > 1) I pointed out in the video that the anti-imperialist > movement > > > in > > > > > the > > > > > > > late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries was dominated by > the > > > > > > > conservatives, as historian William Leuchtenberg has noted. I > > > likewise > > > > > > > pointed out that we may count on one hand the number of > > > Progressives > > > > > who > > > > > > > opposed U.S. entry into World War I. I further noted that the > > > recent > > > > > > > interventions Lord supports were likewise supported by Hillary > > > Clinton, > > > > > > > Howard Stern, theNew York Times, and theWashington Post(among > > > others I > > > > > > > mentioned). Before Lord goes attacking other people for their > > > tactical > > > > > > > alliances, he might make note of the beam in his own eye. > > > > > > > > Lord does not acknowledge any of this. I wouldn’t, either, > were I > > > in > > > > > his > > > > > > > shoes. > > > > > > > > 2) Lord is obsessed with Ronald Reagan, and again condemns > Ron > > > Paul > > > > > for > > > > > > > opposing Reagan’s expansion of government power. The weird cult > of > > > > > > > personality around the deceased former president reveals that > > > > ... > > > > read more » > > -- > Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. > For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum > > * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ > * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. > * Read the latest breaking news, and more. > -- Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more.
