I must had been wrong to say it is a bug, Qt use osx native
menubar by default, but now the problem becomes how to inherit
menubar from another window and how to merge and modify.
Пн, 14 сен 2015, Ian Clark написал(а):
> @Bill
>
> > Is this behavior (sharing menu) a feature of osx in general?
>
> Yes, definitely.
>
> In OS X the menubar belongs to the app. Not to the window, as in
> MSWin. At least it did when I was programming the Mac in C in the 80s
> / 90s.
>
> Most commercial apps for the Mac, e.g. Firefox, TextEdit, Microsoft
> Word, let you create a new window with ⌘N. E.g to edit a second
> document. All such windows share the same menubar but window-specific
> menu items (⌘C, ⌘V …) work only on the topmost (=active) window.
> There's generally a "Window" menu, listing all open windows – the
> active window is shown checked: (√). Of course there are apps which
> only ever show one window. What the menubar applies-to is never in
> doubt.
>
> J602 doesn't obey the rules. Thus: if you launch the Plot package, it
> makes a separate window, but when you click on that window – the
> menubar vanishes, leaving only the Apple-supplied menus ("Apple" and
> "J"). I guess Plot is pretending to be an independent app?
>
> By contrast, JQt does obey the rules - up to a point. All windows
> owned by JQt, even user-created ones, share the same menubar. However
> the Edit and Term windows chop-and-change menus between them (a big
> no-no - you should gray them out, not make them vanish.) That totally
> bamboozled me, until I worked out what it was playing at. I was
> discovering menu items one day and not finding them the next.
>
> The basic model is that when an app (e.g. DreamWeaver) lets you work
> on either a picture or text, say, these aren't 2 different sorts of
> window. They're one-and-the-same sort of window, adapted to picture or
> text, inapplicable menu items like "Rotate" or "Spelling" being
> grayed-out. The menubar is owned by the app, as I said, and is
> therefore common to all windows. Apart from J, all Mac apps I've seen
> follow this basic model.
>
> Qt, being cross-platform, is a law unto itself, it seems.
>
> On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 12:51 AM, bill lam <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Is this behavior (sharing menu) a feature of osx in general?
> > On Sep 14, 2015 5:17 AM, "Ian Clark" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> @Chris
> >>
> >> > Does your repaint include some computation that could have been done up
> >> front?
> >>
> >> It's TABULA. Judged superficially, yes. The toolbar is painted
> >> laboriously pixel by pixel, also it's animated. A speedup would be to
> >> take a snapshot of the isidraw and use that instead. But it is
> >> (planned to be) reconfigurable by the user, so I don't want to get
> >> into speedups just yet. Particularly as I'm now badly equipped for
> >> cross-platform testing.
> >>
> >> > How did you do that?
> >>
> >> Currently a t-table carries free-form info that's displayed in the
> >> "Info" tab. It's good in practice to have that optionally in a
> >> separate window, so it can be left visible while interacting with the
> >> main form, and I've done just that.
> >>
> >> But when the "Info" window has the focus, instead of the menubar
> >> disappearing and being replaced by something vestigial, I can still
> >> see the main form's menus. And they all work.
> >>
> >> TABULA also optionally creates a "plot" window – and the same remarks
> >> apply. Bill thinks it's a bug not a feature. But jwplot wouldn't be so
> >> useful within an app if it hid the app's menus.
> >>
> >> > I suppose we should allow redefining the menubar on the fly.
> >>
> >> I guess most J coders won't need the facility to reconfigure a menu
> >> after every user interaction. Only people like me, trying to write
> >> professional-looking cross-platform software. Perhaps I simply
> >> shouldn't be using Jwd, but working directly with Qt widgets? I can't
> >> be far short of my 100th GUI.
> >>
> >> wd 'set menuitem text "New Caption" ' -would be nice. But destroying
> >> and rewriting the whole menubar ought to be fast enough. It is
> >> intuitive (using rplc) and totally flexible.
> >>
> >> Ian
> >>
> >> On Sun, Sep 13, 2015 at 3:25 PM, chris burke <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >> My form takes a noticeable time to repaint. I don't want to do that.
> >> >
> >> > I am a little surprised by this. Does your repaint include some
> >> computation
> >> > that could have been done up front?
> >> >
> >> >> But I see with JQt it's possible to define two separate forms for the
> >> same
> >> > app. If one of them specifies no menus, it lets you see the menus of the
> >> > other form – even when it's got focus!
> >> >
> >> > How did you do that?
> >> >
> >> > I suppose we should allow redefining the menubar on the fly.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 13 September 2015 at 05:32, Ian Clark <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> My form takes a noticeable time to repaint. I don't want to do that.
> >> >>
> >> >> But I see with JQt it's possible to define two separate forms for the
> >> >> same app. If one of them specifies no menus, it lets you see the menus
> >> >> of the other form – even when it's got focus! At least, it does on the
> >> >> Mac (…under Snow Leopard).
> >> >>
> >> >> I conjecture it's possible to split my form into a menu-less and a
> >> >> menus-only form. The latter will be a lot less pain to recreate – and
> >> >> easily reconfigured like this:
> >> >>
> >> >> wd MYMENUSONLY rplc 'Repeat Last Action' ; 'Repeat "Delete Line"'
> >> >>
> >> >> The same trick will let me offer an up-to-the-minute MRU list attached
> >> >> to the File menu.
> >> >>
> >> >> Maybe there are gotchers. Maybe it won't work on all platforms. But
> >> >> it's worth me doing some experiments. Anyone care to try it with
> >> >> MSWin? (I can see a sticky "fellow traveller" being needed for the
> >> >> main window, consisting only of a menubar.)
> >> >>
> >> >> On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 2:49 AM, chris burke <[email protected]>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> > You can create a new form to replace the old, positioning exactly over
> >> >> the
> >> >> > old. This should happen fast enough to be unnoticeable.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I cannot think of examples in J8, but this was done in J6, for example
> >> >> with
> >> >> > the Find and Replace dialogs.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On 11 September 2015 at 15:56, bill lam <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> I think these functions are not implemented.
> >> >> >> On Sep 12, 2015 4:50 AM, "Ian Clark" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> > With jwd in JQt, how do I change the text of a given item in an
> >> >> >> > existing set of menus?
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > E.g. to state precisely what action I'm offering to Undo / Repeat /
> >> >> etc?
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > An allied problem is to add items to an existing menu, e.g. to
> >> provide
> >> >> >> > a MRU facility.
> >> >> >> >
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