The erosion of the right to trial by jury is a fact of life. Juries are practically completely out of civil cases, and the value threshold to be entitled to one in a criminal case has been raised, because jury trials are very expensive. John Wilson, you are quite right to condemn the erosion of our rights to a jury trial in contempt of court matters (to leave it solely to judges to decide guilt in these criminal matters is obviously less than safe) What is also bad is that in defamation cases, even when permitted a jury, the juries are not allowed anywhere near the issue of whether what was said is true...Judges have grabbed that one. All juries can do is decide whether what was said sounds bad, but never whether it was true). But in the long term, the lawyers and judges have been systematically disempowering juries for centuries, as I outline in my book (www.campac.net.au/bsdawson), so perhaps people know this and view the exclusion of juries from contempt cases as just another step along a well trod path, so why bother. As my book shows, juries once did questioning of witnesses, and Judges and juries worked together. Perhaps that did not confer enough status on Judges. Perhaps it gave juries too much power. Anyway, their role keeps getting less and less. Nowadays Judges exclude evidence from juries, by holding hearings separate from them to decide what is 'admissible". The general theory seems to be that juries cannot be trusted. And let's face it. There have been untrustworthy jurors, and one lawyer tactic is to try and get a favourable (ie biassed) juror on the jury. Sometimes it happens by chance. I know people who would say they would rather have a Judge than a jury. In my book I explain how many Queensland men who have been surveyed say rape victims "ask for it" . The odds are good for the rapist wanting a jury trial, especially if one can get an all male jury by a bit of judicious "challenging". Perhaps some people think jurors should have to demonstrate a bit of intelligence before being qualified as jurors. In the US, the O J Simpson prosecutor said he knew Simpson would be acquitted the moment he saw the composition of the jury. So jury trials nowadays are not necessarily always a good thing, and even in your Magna Carta no one knows if the barons were wanting juries of their peers (in other words of barons) and actually were not intending to subject themselves to the judgement of the people at all. -----Original Message----- From: John Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Allan Gourley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; auchmore <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; austand <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Brett Dawson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Colin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Dennis Stevenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Dorothy Pratt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; exposure <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Jeanine McRae <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Joe Bryant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Joseph Abram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Larry Dodge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Martin Essenberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Misha <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; omega <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Peter Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Philip Madsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Ray Platt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Raymond A. Smyth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Robert Balgarnie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Robyn Van Rheeden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; b3969976 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Scott Balson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Sue and Bob <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; David Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Tony Pitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Arthur Tuck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Thursday, June 17, 1999 7:06 AM Subject: No response to Lies and Treachery in the High Court. ---------------------------------------------------------------- This is the Neither public email list, open for the public and general discussion. To unsubscribe click here Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=unsubscribe To subscribe click here Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=subscribe For information on [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.neither.org/lists/public-list.htm For archives http://www.mail-archive.com/public-list@neither.org
