On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 10:19 AM Wes Turner <wes.tur...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Fri, Sep 25, 2020 at 8:09 PM Chris Angelico <ros...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> On Sat, Sep 26, 2020 at 8:17 AM Wes Turner <wes.tur...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > What a worthless semantic distinction. >> > >> > You don't want to be executing code to determine why an Exception occurred >> > because you do not trust support devs to access all of the data in the >> > production system. >> > >> > "Exceptions happen" is true, but that's not satisfactory in an >> > organization focused on quality. >> > >> >> .... wut? >> >> I don't understand what you mean here. Sometimes a traceback isn't all >> the information, and you need to add code to something to figure out >> the cause. Are you implying that, because I actually put effort into >> tracking bugs down, I am clearly not focused on quality?? >> >> I'll just go ahead and repeat myself: "what?" > > > - The context of this tangent was ~"[Exceptions happen in production] and > that's okay". > - Looseness with exception handling is entirely unacceptable for > safety-critical and high availability applications. > - *Interactive debugging* is fine for many non-production applications. > - Yup, the process spawner is going to reap and restart when the process > fails due to an unhandled Exception, > but data loss due to unhandled exceptions (and non-transactional data > persistence) is a real problem > - "It's just going to raise whatever sometimes and you can just pdb it > every time" > - You can add information to exceptions and preserve the traceback with > `raise _ from _` > > I have nothing further to add about this non-personal tangent.
Okay, I can see what's happening. You're assuming that "debugging" means "interactive debugging in a specialized harness". I consider "debugging" to be "anything done with a view to removing a bug". So by my definition, debugging in production is normal, and by yours, it's impossible/unwise. I think we're just arguing terminology here, and either way, checked exceptions won't really help. There's nothing further to debate - we just use the word "debugging" differently. :) ChrisA _______________________________________________ Python-ideas mailing list -- python-ideas@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-ideas-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-ideas.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-ideas@python.org/message/A7W3CISZRXMAZTA23UCPS5GIE4FBQZXP/ Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
