I would also say node and noodle coding in QC is mostly fun and
Javascript in QC mostly isn't fun.
That's not a reason not to use JS, it's a reason to be mature about
when one would use it and when one would prefer not to use it.
A crutch holds one back from liberation, (but they also allow the
genuine cripple mobility). For me JS patch is liberating, not a
crutch, I feel like I know how to use logic gates well enough and have
spent plenty of time in QC trying to sync phase loops of
interpolations and dozens of logic gates to know when I want out with
a superior method — all be it in limited case scenarios. But hey why
not write state-machines in machine code, it's closer to the metal
than nodes even!
On 18/06/2011, at 6:20 PM, George Toledo wrote:
On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 12:06 AM, Alastair Leith <[email protected]
> wrote:
I agree with many of the comments including the contradictions.
George and I have had this discussion in private and I'm much more
for JS when state machine is an issue. I just described such a state
machine on this Kineme thread. The more your widgets are interacting
with each others state, like say a simple group of on screen radio
buttons where, by definition, only one can be 'active' at one time,
then the more Bang one gets out of going JS I think.
Well, QC is a node based system that allows one to control the
execution of a graph, but that also potentially has the ability to
offer one the possibility of including your own scripting language
in a patch, even in the standard API.
I think that if one is going to conceive of the graph as a type of
visual language, then needing to rely on javascript is a crutch,
while being able to use it, is a feature. People panning node based
solutions when programming in a node based language is weak. Many
patch based languages can result in some graphs that have many
connections and are difficult to follow, but to me, that's an
asinine criticism. It's akin to complaining that you can't
understand a circuitboard after staring at it for 30 seconds. Well,
big surprise.
By using the nodes in QC, one has the ability to sample or queue
every data type; this cannot be done with the javascript patch,
though it does handle many types.
Quite possibly my darkest, most sinking moments as a developer are
when I see a myriad of XOR, NAND and OR logic patches tangled up
with Math patches, Counters and other logic type things trying to
control disparate elements that would be much easier achieved with
a single cleanly written JS patch that spits out nice neat state
values. People - Embrace the JS! It is your friend!
Agreed. I used to get into all that, making a Flip/Flop out of logic
gates the way Feynman describes it in Feynman Lectures on
Computation but in terms of serious reusable code involving state,
logic and timing it's JS all the way for me. For some reason I never
liked the Timelines patch either, it seems even more against the QC
functional graph paradigm than grafting a MVC model on top to me.
The timeline patch is one of the most underused, and undervalued
patches in QC, imo. There's no reason it couldn't be used in tandem
with javascript as well.
I find the panning of using logic patches, math, etc., to be
obnoxious.
OS X said:
Exception Type: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (SIGSEGV)
Exception Codes: KERN_INVALID_ADDRESS at 0x00000000bbadbeef
Crashed Thread: 0 Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread
Thread 0 Crashed: Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread
0 com.apple.JavaScriptCore 0x00007fff85dbd7f9
JSC::Heap::makeUsableFromMultipleThreads() + 57
1 com.apple.JavaScriptCore 0x00007fff85dbd2e4
JSGlobalContextCreateInGroup + 132
2 ...QuartzComposer.ExtraPatches 0x0000000115882fbb 0x11587b000 +
32699
3 com.apple.QuartzComposer 0x00007fff821d3189 -
[QCProgrammablePatch recompileSourceOfType:] + 134
4 com.apple.QuartzComposer 0x00007fff821d30b8 -
[QCProgrammablePatch setSource:ofType:] + 295
5 com.apple.QuartzComposer 0x00007fff821d2caf -
[QCProgrammablePatch initWithIdentifier:] + 455
Don't know that one. User error?! haha just kidding, GT. Unknown
runtime errors are disheartening... I didn't get the point you were
making here:
When one configures a javascript patch above a certain input count,
the whole qtz becomes unstable and often results in error when
trying to duplicate macro.
The point I'm making is while there's a love fest going on about how
awesome javascript in QC is, it has issues. The error above comes
from taking a javascript patch:
var result = new Object();
function (__structure vars) main (__number inputNumber[7])
{
result.vars = new Object();
result.vars.X = inputNumber[0];
result.vars.Y = inputNumber[1];
result.vars.Z = inputNumber[2];
result.vars.R = inputNumber[3];
result.vars.G = inputNumber[4];
result.vars.B = inputNumber[5];
result.vars.A = inputNumber[6];
return result;
}
... making multiples, and connecting to another patch:
function (__structure vars) main (__structure inputStructure[100])
{
var result = new Object();
var array = new Array();
array[0] = inputStructure[0];
array[1] = inputStructure[1];
array[2] = inputStructure[2];
array[3] = inputStructure[3];
array[4] = inputStructure[4];
array[5] = inputStructure[5];
etc...
At a certain point, javascript starts barfing, and just fails. This
was found with a more complex setup and reduced to this.
I'm not really taking away from anyone's personal experiences, just
adding mine to the mix. It's hard not to read some of the comments
and think that they're somewhat off base or skewed too far to one
side, or remember how much time I've wasted with the javascript
patch in QC being flaky, or shifting in QC versions.
-gt
On 17/06/2011, at 8:38 PM, Adrian Ward wrote:
I'm just going to chip in and say that building a central state
machine using the JavaScript Patch has been absolutely critical for
us, and this is what sits at the heart of every interactive AV
we've ever made in QC - without it you'll just get messy
unmanageable noodles, no matter how clean you are with your macro
patching and connection routing.
It also helps to enforce an MVC paradigm on your project, which is
a bit of an unusual approach within the QC ecosystem but I'm
convinced is utterly crucial when making anything ambitious.
Quite possibly my darkest, most sinking moments as a developer are
when I see a myriad of XOR, NAND and OR logic patches tangled up
with Math patches, Counters and other logic type things trying to
control disparate elements that would be much easier achieved with
a single cleanly written JS patch that spits out nice neat state
values. People - Embrace the JS! It is your friend!
Ade.
On 17 Jun 2011, at 10:09, Alastair Leith wrote:
I like Achims State machine, here's another approach I made years
ago before my JS was useful.
I've done this sort of thing where I have two registers and
interpolate between them. The registers are the two most recent
items in a queue, so a new item in pushes the registers if that
makes sense. Can't find a composition for that method.
Also I did it for a structure of 3D attitudes/orientations of an
object. I have a comp for this. In this case the queue just track
random index values, again causing the index at the registers to
shift along each time a new one comes in.
It's a juggling act that uses a pulsed timer (LFO sawtooth-ramp-
up) to drive interpolation patches and the queue; here is a demo
composition I dug out (minus the interesting bit that morphs a
cube into a sphere and back).
<Demo transitions between atitudes with a spinning cube.qtz>
<Rotational Positions.plist>
NB The rotation position.plist is an XML file that needs to be in
the same folder as the comp to load.
Best
Alastair
On 17/06/2011, at 5:09 PM, Rick Mann wrote:
I've been doing these on-screen graphics for a web channel that
covers space launches. We show a couple of different countdown
clocks, as well as a block of ascent parameters.
But for the last nine minutes of a shuttle launch, there's not
much to show. I have a couple dozen events that occur at various
times during the count. I want to display each one as it occurs.
An event is just a text string describing the event ("APU Start,"
"Steering Test," etc.).
My custom patch can either output each string on a output port,
or output an array of structures that has the string and the
associated time. The former is easier for me.
How can I crossfade from the last event string to the next,
especially when they come in rapid succession (perhaps more
quickly than the crossfade duration)?
I was doing a similar cross fade between a set of images, and it
was a real pain to build the structure for it.
Thanks for any suggestions,
Rick
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George Toledo
[email protected]
www.georgetoledo.com
The machine does not isolate man from the great problems of nature but
plunges him more deeply into them.
Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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