Grant, I notice that you've been posting to the RBW forum more frequently, and I thank you for it. Since there would not even be such a forum without your endeavor, and since we are all interested in the bikes and philosophy you promote, we are also interested in your opinions, whether we agree with them or not. It also gives you an opportunity to preach to the choir on smaller issues as the mood strikes you without having to pay attention to a full-time blog or having to update your homepage. Keep it coming.
On Aug 10, 11:12 am, Grant Petersen <grant...@gmail.com> wrote: > RIght, usually it's the left foot on a twelve-o'clock pedal, the bike > leaning right with the top tube on the right hamstring, and the right foot > on the ground. > Howowowowowowever...the CPSC requires that the bike clear the crotch by an > inch. "Crotch" to a modern male who wears his belt nine inches below his > navel, and "crotch" to somebody trying to eke out every last centimeter of > top tube height in order to get the bars high enough are two different > places. I like to measure it with riding shoes and to the PB, not the sack > and not the slacks or anything worn. When we recommend frame sizes, it is > always with a larger tire than the rider expects to ride, and is with the > minimum inch clearance in mind. > IT's common for a rider-here-in-person to stand over a 61, for instance, and > say, "Hey man, it's 'right there, right on me'," but then I'll ask him to > lift the bike up, and the tires clear the ground by an inch and a half or > two, which just proves that guys tend to be overly protective of their > territory down there. No doubt that extreme caution had survival value and > there must be a genetic component of it, but when it comes to fitting bikes, > pretend they're invulnerable and insensitive to pain. > > The bike I'm riding most these days--not a good example of How To Do It, but > it illustrates a point well. My PBH is 85, and I'm on a 60 Sam > because...long story, but I put the contact points (saddle, bars, pedals) in > the right spot, and when I'm riding the bike it's like....the most comfy > bike in the galaxy. I am truly AT THE BONE on it, but the only time it > matters is when I lift the front wheel onto a curb while my two feet are > still on the street. It's not something I do more than a few times a week or > a month, and the rest of the time I'm in bike-comfort-heaven. > > I would NEVER sell a 60 to anybody else with my PBH--and I mean, you > couldn't offer to pay twice as much for a 60, even, because we just wouldn't > do it, period. But my experience with way too high top tube is worth > considering for somebody who is merely within an inch. > > G > > > > On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 7:51 AM, Jan Heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > >After reading Michael's request for recommendations for his "right > > >frame size," and if I'm interpreting Rivendell's sizing chart > > >correctly (?), will Michael's pbh clearance above the top tube on a > > >57cm Hilsen be about 7mm, with a 35mm Pasela? > > > >At what point, for road and/or country bikes, does pbh clearance > > >become a safety factor for the rider? > > > The answer is simple: Standover clearance never is a safety issue > > even for an only mildly experienced rider. There was a Bicycle > > Quarterly article on this issue a few years back. Here is a short > > synopsis. > > > Background: Most of my bikes have marginal or no stand-over > > clearance. My 9-year-old son's bike doesn't have standover clearance > > either. My bikes were sized that way to get the handlebars to about > > 1-2" below the saddle without riser stems, sloping top tubes or huge > > quills showing. On my son's bike, it's simply a matter of trying to > > find a lightweight (<30 lb.) kid's bike with a geometry suitable to > > slow speeds. The bike is too big for him, but he is rectifying this > > by growing like a beanstalk. (We reduced the reach by replacing the > > drop bars with cut-down mtb bars, but we couldn't shorten the seat > > tube.) > > > When you stop a bike, it is very difficult to jump off with both > > feet. In fact, riders new to toeclips or clipless pedals sometimes > > fall down because they get _zero_ feet on the ground. Once you > > realize that you put only one foot down when you stop, standover > > clearance no longer is an issue. When you put one foot down, you also > > have to lean the bike to prevent it from falling (the bike and your > > leg on the ground form a triangle), which lowers the top tube a lot. > > You also move your pelvis to the side, and off the "dangerous" top > > tube. If your top tube is _way_ too high, you will simply lean the > > bike a little further when you stop. My son did fall once when he > > first rode his new bike. However, your private parts never are in > > danger. > > > After you have put one foot down, you can put a second foot down, and > > some riders do. If you don't have standover clearance, your foot will > > not reach the ground. Since you already are standing and bracing > > yourself and your bike with one leg, you will not fall. > > > Off-road, the "two feet down" situation is best avoided. In Simon > > Burney's original edition of "Cyclocross", there is a lovely photo of > > a rider straddling his bike after having failed to ride up a steep > > hill. The caption reads something like "This rider is trapped - can't > > get going, can't dismount. He should have dismounted before his > > momentum was lost." > > > As I said, even my son, whose saddle at first was as low as the > > seatpost would go, with the center section of the sloping top tube > > almost at saddle level, never hurt his private parts from lack of > > standover clearance, and he is _not_ an expert cyclist. > > > One exception is starting on a tandem. If you like to have the stoker > > put both feet on the pedals, it is useful to straddle the bike. You > > can do this with marginal standover clearance, as you won't jump onto > > the tandem. > > > From my experience, standover clearance is not a safety issue. The > > CPSC recommendation is one of many questionable ones. It appears that > > they even requested a lip on a Campagnolo front derailleur to prevent > > people getting hurt by the cage. Right next to the front derailleur > > is a chainring with super-sharp teeth, so it's hard to see how the > > straight front derailleur cage makes a bike more dangerous... > > > Something that can kill you - and almost did kill a friend on one of > > my bikes once - is toe overlap. The CPSC is silent on that, and most > > experienced riders probably can deal with it in most situations. > > > Jan Heine > > Editor > > Bicycle Quarterly > > 140 Lakeside Ave #C > > Seattle WA 98122 > >http://www.vintagebicyclepress.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
