Hi RBWOBunch,
I’m a newer member here… I've added a few comments to some recent threads but otherwise had only been a casual observer for the past few years after first discovering the group while doing some google searches (sorry, I still haven’t completely accepted “google” as a verb) of past Riv models. I never had a personal gmail and just didn’t know how to join/contribute otherwise but a few weeks back I came to the realization that I could just commandeer a dormant account that was originally created for another purpose with a group of friends but that project was abandoned some time ago and I was the last to manage the account… so here I am. Anyway, I have found great value in several threads here and thought it was time I share some details and solicit feedback as I sort through some cycling related dilemmas. Apologies in advance… this is likely to become long winded and overly verbose. I could do that and my wife likes to say my brain throws up on occasion ; ) Here’s my overall dilemma: I desperately need to downsize my bike stable but I know I’ll need to keep enough on hand to satisfy my tinkering tendencies. I’ve already abandoned several prior experiments/projects for various reasons but still have a few ideas nagging me. I know logic will never prevail over emotion but I’m attempting to approach this as logically/economically as possible and think things through rather than act hastily like I may have in the past in regard to trying new builds. My wife and I also welcomed our first child 4.5 months ago so the downsizing is in large part out of necessity. Ideally I’ll still have at least 2 road ready bikes come Spring; One set-up for baby hauling and one for sportier solo riding, both on and off road as I have a small network of multiuse paths and trails very close to home. I do not intend for this discussion to just be about downsizing however. Something else in particular has been bouncing around my brain and involves an otherwise unused Riv fork: A Simpleone surplus fork (700c, canti-equipped, unpainted, 238mm threaded steerer… bought from Riv when available as a web special pre-Rosco Bubbe project.) It was intended as part of a front end upgrade for an old road frame but that project fell through. Unfortunately, the frame (a mid/low end ‘87 Schwinn Traveler) revealed a crack right before the rebuild began but of course not until after I already acquired all the desired/necessary upgrade parts (new headset, Nitto 32f rack, new canti brakes, and a fatter front tire to take advantage of the increased clearance.) This frame had gone through a few wardrobe changes but most recently served as my single speed testing platform prior to the planned rebuild. After I concluded single speeding was right for me I had picked up a readymade Milwaukee Orange One frame as a dedicated singlespeed/fixed gear and moved the drivetrain over. I then wanted to convert the Traveler back to a geared drop bar build and splurged on the Riv fork for the added versatility and because the steerer length was nearly an exact match to the existing fork. At the time this would have given me three bikes (maybe 4 depending on the timing of a Raleigh 3 speed acquisition); Milwaukee Single, Schwivendell Road, and an old rigid MTB. The frame is clearly not worth the expense of repair (although it’s still hanging in a family member's garage in case I ever decide to practice welding/brazing or something!) So the Simpleone fork is now collecting dust and either too long or too short for my remaining frames. I recently considered whether it could work as a 9/8” threadless to 1” threaded conversion of the Milwaukee Orange One? I know I’m trying too hard and this was recently discussed with one LBS who seemed to at least appreciate the discussion and mental exercise and confirmed that although it is certainly “do-able” they added that it is not advisable in their opinion and they are not interested in such endeavors. I’ve greatly enjoyed the Milwaukee the past 2 years and there is nothing wrong with it but I can’t stop wondering whether I could salvage something out of all of this and simultaneously make the Milwaukee even more useful/versatile with the more rackable and more elegant Simpleone fork? The stock Milwaukee fork is imported and appears to otherwise match a Surly Pacer fork. It's fine and no problem whatsoever but pairing the nicer Riv fork with my nicest Waterford made road frame would be ideal and essentially create my very own Rosco Road Simplebeam/Quickone aka Rivwaukee [Rivay-wah-kay] SimpleRoscOne [Simplay-Rosco-nay!] I’m already aware of numerous reasons I should forget the whole thing, cut my losses, and just move on but hear me out: Geometry change would be minimal: Axle to crown is slightly more with the Riv fork but within less than a cm of the stock Milwaukee fork. Offset is a few mm’s more on the Riv fork which could help alleviate a bit of toe overlap OR allow more fender clearance or a plusher tire but same amount of overlap as I currently experience. I know it is possible to use headtube adapter/reducer shims to install a 1” headset/fork in a 9/8” spec’d headtube and the LBS confirmed this but noted they generally advise against it and take a conservative approach regarding hacks in the headtube area. The bigger issue is the stack height: If my numbers are correct I’m about 5-6mm short on stack height…. the Milwaukee headtube is a cm taller than the headtube of the originally planned frame (210mm vs 200mm) and with the headset stack(33mm Tange Levin) and extra mm of lip from reducer shims it makes the fork steerer (238mm) fall a bit too short. The headtube has 2cm of upper extension from top tube junction and in theory can be safely shaved/cut down by 5-6mm to accommodate but that’s a lot of material to remove via head-tube facing and that LBS is clearly not interested in such a task. The shop mechanic suggested that the ideal single solution (which does not even exist as far as we know) would be a short stack threaded headset with the outer diameter of EC34 cups but the guts/inner diameter of a 1” threaded ISO. Being that this product doesn’t exist (or does it?) he agreed that taking material away from the upper headtube plus the 34mm OD/30mm ID headtube shims would certainly work as intended but is not recommended. They were not trying to completely discourage me but made it clear that they are not willing to do so and there was never a discussion of labor cost for such a job. I completely understand the reasoning behind not doing it but I still can’t stop thinking about it… it would help consolidate a few things for me and allow better parts swaps between a few other frames and maximize use of a bunch of spare quill stems and bars. I could keep one frame on the road at a time and keep them going in rotation (until I find that perfect build?) I’ve already acquired numerous bike tools the past several years after realizing I’d rather incur the expense of the tool and enable myself to complete certain jobs. This revelation also came on the heels of several disappointing experiences from other local shops over the years (it still amazes me how poor the service could really be at some shops… and I’m talking the most basic stuff!) I have yet to venture into reaming/facing/frame mods territory however and can’t justify such an investment right now. If I found a shop willing to do the headtube facing for a reasonable fee my only additional expense is that labor and cost of the headtube reducer shims… and I get to keep some of my projects in reserve. I only have space for one bike in my living space right now but thanks to some available storage from generous family I could still keep a 2nd bike road ready and rotate the two completes as needed/desired and keep a couple spare frames in storage for when the mood strikes to rebuild and try something new at little additional expense (aside from new cables, etc.) Then again, I could also accept the fact that the Milwaukee honestly has less tire clearance and more toe overlap than I’d really prefer. I could accept the fact that the Riv fork would likely be better off just waiting for something else to come along that is a better fit or in someone elses hands. If actually forced to reduce to a single bike my 65cm Clem H would definitely be the keeper right now and is the planned kid hauler. Of all my other bikes/frames the Milwaukee is also the only one with decent value if to came down to selling anything. I’ve considered selling off/donating a few things and saving for a 64cm Black Mountain Monstercross as a lighter duty and drop bar/single speed friendly complement to my Clem. This would allow a 2 bike stable that could still do it all but that would require fully abandoning a few other projects I simply haven’t had the time for but still want to see through for the fun and experimentation. But will I even care about those anymore if I did go for the BMC Monstercross? I also became intrigued by the Canti-Sam presale announcement and thought a 62cm Canti-Sam might be a great complement for Clem and with both at 135mm rear spacing would allow quick wheel and brake swaps between the two whereas the BMC Monstercross has 130 spacing. But I haven’t the budget for a Sam and would have needed to already have sold off a bunch of stuff when that $1000 presale was announced anyway… maybe still an option if I start purging immediately but I still have reservations. Anyone still reading this far? Thanks! not sure what my question really is at this point but I think you understand what I’m trying to figure out. I want to downsize but in a strategic way that still allows some flexibility and tinkering down the road. I simply do not think I’ll be satisfied trying to limit myself to one bike. My current line-up is as follows: COMPLETES: 65cm Clem H – Complete with Chocomoose replacement (Clempaloosa?) 62cm Milwaukee Orange One – Moustache RM016 equipped with single speed drivetrain 68.5cm (27”) Schwinn Traveler (1983 Giant made frame) – currently set with Nitto RM013 Dirt drop bar/stem and hack job single speed drivetrain… I have the ability to run this as a geared roadbike with bolt on derailer hanger and have all the other shifting stuffs but haven’t gotten around to it yet. IN PROGRESS: ‘70s/’80s 25” Raleigh Deluxe(Superbe?) – unique fleabay frame find that was supposed to be my 3 speed rebuild with locking fork but turned out to be an entirely different beast and accepts 700x35 with 120 spacing and room for fenders. Planning to make this a fixed/free with spare set of wheels. Think of it as becoming a lower trail, foul weather complement to the Milwaukee. Fork/frame takes modern hub axles already but just needs to be spread and aligned from 95mm to 100m front and 114 to 120 rear and fresh headset bearings/grease. Then there is the Raleigh bottom bracket issue but my understanding is that a VO threadless cartridge should resolve that and although I have an available Raleigh bottom bracket and cottered crank I think I’d prefer the square taper upgrade. ‘94 Mongoose Hilltopper – 22” frame - 56cm c to c/60cm c to top – 61cm horizontal top tube - 130mm spaced 7 speed rear MTB. This was my first real bike shop bike. Frame still serviceable. Fits 26x2.3 + canti/vbrakes but I was also able to fit an actual 700x38 under a Tektro R539 in the rear on a road wheel and why I considered using the Riv fork at one point to make this a roadier 700c bike but there isn’t enough threadless steerer to go full threadless and not enough threads to go full threaded with everything as is… 145mm headtube and 195mm of threadless steerer leaves only 50mm of combined headset and stem stack space. Best bet here is to tap a couple more cm’s of threading on the Riv fork. I also have a NOS 26” Tange unicrown MTB fork with 200mm steerer and is a perfect fit for the frame… a little longer than the stock fork and raises the total stack just a bit. The frame/stock fork are JIS spec’d but I’ve debated tapping/cutting down the Riv fork to match the length and threads of the NOS 26” Tange fork and doing an ISO conversion using these as two swappable forks. I actually have two identical Tange Levin headsets and I could just scavenge the crown race from the 2nd to make the swaps that much easier. In truth I should just let this one go but talk about versatility… this frame just has tons and it could become so may different things. 21” Raleigh Sports 3 speed – way too small for me and was supposed to be the parts donor for the above mentioned Raleigh deluxe 3 speed build. Probably should just rebuild and sell this one locally. Part of me wants to keep it now that my wife and I have a son and maybe he’ll want to join the 3 speed party with us some day but even if so that’s years from now… can I really justify storing it that long? Problem is I simply don’t have the time nor space to justify having all of these all built up at once. Decisions, decisions… I told you my brain throws up sometimes! Brian Cole Lawrenceville NJ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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